Seth is reserved for the Josh Richardson/family reunion trade.
(10-08-2020, 03:25 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]Seth is reserved for the Josh Richardson/family reunion trade.
You mean the Steph wants to join Luka and Seth for some easy rings 2022 free agency reunion?
(10-07-2020, 03:14 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ] (10-07-2020, 03:03 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]So, for me, the only requirement for that deal to be a success is for the player to be better than what’s available at #18. I don’t think that’s impossible at all.
I think this draft is deeper than you obviously do. I have weighed in that the Mavs should package 18 and 31 to move up a few spots (at least three or so). Unless they completely blow the pick on a no-D guy like Nesmith or Toppin (won't be there), I think it would be pretty difficult to screw it up. I would rather have an inexperienced-but-learning good player on a rookie deal than an experienced player on a big deal, and screw Plan Powder. We should be able to dump Wright using 31 if nothing else. He has some value in the league.
I looked at the FA list again. Would rather have 18 (or moved-up-from-18) than Haywood. Lowry I would take, but you aren't getting him for anything the Mavs have (KP for Siakam and Lowry? Hmmmm....). Gobert, Oubre, Schroder, yes, I would do 18 for them. Jarrett Allen, sure. Dinwidie, sure. All of the rest of the players who are expiring in '21 whom I would consider are valuable players not likely to be available who are on rookie deals.
Come to think of it, I would rather have Nesmith and his poor defense on a rookie deal than do a plan powder move.
I would also trade 18 in a package for Aaron Gordon, but that ain't plan powder.
Screw it - OPJ probably requires 18, especially if the deal doesn't include THJ, and I would likely do that. What I actually said earlier was that I would be annoyed if it looked like the deal could have done without including 18.
Edit: Did some research on Dinwiddie. No 3, no D, no thanks. The list is shorter...
(10-08-2020, 03:38 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-08-2020, 03:25 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]Seth is reserved for the Josh Richardson/family reunion trade.
You mean the Steph wants to join Luka and Seth for some easy rings 2022 free agency reunion?
Negative.
(10-08-2020, 12:25 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Not sure if Boston sees Hayward in their plans moving forward or not, so this might be crazy. But, the more I think about it, the more I feel like he's a target the Mavs would absolutely get excited about.
- Positionally, he would fit well on the current roster
- Absolutely provides the secondary playmaker they want, if healthy
- HUGH expiring contract, so he keeps 2021 path alive
- could potentially be pretty high on their list of fall back options for the 2021 off season
Let's say they're into this, and let's say Boston wants to move on from him. What would it take to get the deal done, and do the Mavs have enough? If so, could they get it done without including THJ?
Hayward is an interesting name for sure. My issue is that defense would be pretty rough with him, Luka and THJ out there. If Hayward was brought in as a replacement for THJ it might make more sense as I think he would be a clear upgrade over THJ. Also salary-wise I don't see how you get to 34 without giving up some good assets.
Teams are so desperate for talent I think Boston will get a good deal for Hayward. I don't know that the Mavs are desperate enough to send assets for Hayward. That being said if you did THJ + filler for picks that would be an upgrade imo. Boston already has too many guards/wings so I don't know that THJ is much use to them. Maxi might be somebody they like but I don't want to give him up.
I guess I just don't really see a path that makes sense for both teams.
(10-08-2020, 04:06 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ] (10-08-2020, 12:25 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Not sure if Boston sees Hayward in their plans moving forward or not, so this might be crazy. But, the more I think about it, the more I feel like he's a target the Mavs would absolutely get excited about.
- Positionally, he would fit well on the current roster
- Absolutely provides the secondary playmaker they want, if healthy
- HUGH expiring contract, so he keeps 2021 path alive
- could potentially be pretty high on their list of fall back options for the 2021 off season
Let's say they're into this, and let's say Boston wants to move on from him. What would it take to get the deal done, and do the Mavs have enough? If so, could they get it done without including THJ?
Hayward is an interesting name for sure. My issue is that defense would be pretty rough with him, Luka and THJ out there. If Hayward was brought in as a replacement for THJ it might make more sense as I think he would be a clear upgrade over THJ. Also salary-wise I don't see how you get to 34 without giving up some good assets.
Teams are so desperate for talent I think Boston will get a good deal for Hayward. I don't know that the Mavs are desperate enough to send assets for Hayward. That being said if you did THJ + filler for picks that would be an upgrade imo. Boston already has too many guards/wings so I don't know that THJ is much use to them. Maxi might be somebody they like but I don't want to give him up.
I guess I just don't really see a path that makes sense for both teams.
No Hayward for me. No matter how good it looked for the Mavs, remember trade rule #1.
(10-08-2020, 03:25 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]Seth is reserved for the Josh Richardson/family reunion trade.
This is definitely on my radar now that Doc's the coach. I don't know the Mavs opinion of Richardson but on paper he seems like the type of starting wing we need on this team. Assuming THJ stays they would essentially both be the 2 wings with DFS sliding the PF.
If you have both THJ and J-Rich under contract and miss out on Giannis (which likely is over pretty quick) aren't you better just resigning both (ie asset management)? You could resign both assuming you aren't going completely nuts AND still use MLE that year to improve the team once again. This assumes Mavs aren't going to reshuffle again for 2022 PP but in my view you are better off with THJ/J-Rich/MLE than whatever you are going to get in 2022.
(10-08-2020, 04:16 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ] (10-08-2020, 03:25 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]Seth is reserved for the Josh Richardson/family reunion trade.
This is definitely on my radar now that Doc's the coach. I don't know the Mavs opinion of Richardson but on paper he seems like the type of starting wing we need on this team. Assuming THJ stays they would essentially both be the 2 wings with DFS sliding the PF.
If you have both THJ and J-Rich under contract and miss out on Giannis (which likely is over pretty quick) aren't you better just resigning both (ie asset management)? You could resign both assuming you aren't going completely nuts AND still use MLE that year to improve the team once again. This assumes Mavs aren't going to reshuffle again for 2022 PP but in my view you are better off with THJ/J-Rich/MLE than whatever you are going to get in 2022.
I would target Jrue if he looks spry in '21.
(10-08-2020, 04:06 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]Hayward is an interesting name for sure. My issue is that defense would be pretty rough with him, Luka and THJ out there. If Hayward was brought in as a replacement for THJ it might make more sense as I think he would be a clear upgrade over THJ. Also salary-wise I don't see how you get to 34 without giving up some good assets.
Teams are so desperate for talent I think Boston will get a good deal for Hayward. I don't know that the Mavs are desperate enough to send assets for Hayward. That being said if you did THJ + filler for picks that would be an upgrade imo. Boston already has too many guards/wings so I don't know that THJ is much use to them. Maxi might be somebody they like but I don't want to give him up.
I guess I just don't really see a path that makes sense for both teams.
Oh, it's not what I would do, but I think THEY would would love to do it.
(10-07-2020, 10:49 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, if he’s not healthy, totally different story, @"Scott41theMavs". You might be right.
(10-07-2020, 10:48 PM)loki Wrote: [ -> ]It wouldn't surprise me at all if the Mavs front office sees it that way. It could pay off in a huge way, or more likely they will end up with no pick, no Schroder, and no Giannis.
With the whole league going for cap space (and no certainty of where the cap will even be set) I would focus on acquiring as much talent as possible, even if it involves long term salary. As long as the players are worth their contracts the Mavs can stay active in free agency through a sign and trade.
So, that’s possible, but on the other hand, signing a free agent isn’t the only way to use the space. I’m not sure it’s the way to go either, but in my internal dialogue about this, I just keep coming back to the thought that 2021 is probably their only shot at a cap space strategy for a long, long time.
If nothing else, they’ll have this new expiring contract (if that’s the way they go) to combine with THJ at next season’s trade deadline, which will be a time when quite a few teams will be trying to set up space for the following off season. This is exactly how they got Porzingis, and I can imagine how that would be a much more opportune time to take on the type of long term money you’re hoping they take. Could be much better options out there.
Or, even if they opt to go the FA route and strike out, there could potentially be opportunities to absorb contracts into their space from teams where these guys DO want to play, and THEY could be better than the players available in trade right now. Plus, as we’ve seen, performing that service for a team at the last minute usually comes with some sort of draft capital sweetener.
Bottom line for me is that 2021 is the path that provides the most options. If they get want they want in the meantime, I’m sure they’ll be all in, but it had better be GREAT.
Absorbing contracts is an interesting idea. I would just point out that there will be a lot more competition for that type of deal in 2021 than in years past. And it requires Dallas to renounce all their own free agents including THJ, Schroder, or any other expiring they trade for in 2020. I'm skeptical that the return will be great enough to justify all of that.
I definitely see the value in having another expiring at the deadline, but if that's what Dallas needs to pull off a big trade, there are easier ways to acquire them. Trading Wright, spending the MLE, or re-signing Lee could all get the job done without having to give up a 1st round pick.
And expirings are only one piece of the puzzle. You have to have assets to go along with it. KP would likely be wearing another jersey right now if Dallas had not made DSJ and their draft picks available. I see #18 and #31 this year as a chance to replenish the stock of tradeable assets. Those are much harder to come by than expirings imo.
(10-08-2020, 12:36 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ] (10-08-2020, 12:25 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]If so, could they get it done without including THJ?
I don't think so. Kind of same problem as with Porter - his contract is too big and Boston will not take crap contracts like Powell in return. The window for such contracts was TDL, when we had Lee contract to play with.
(10-08-2020, 12:33 PM)Hypermav Wrote: [ -> ]My trade of the day is Seth, Maxi and 18 plus 31 for Beal. I can dream too.
It doesn't work salary wise, you have to throw in Powell and Wright.
Wright too? No way! No Deal!
Pretty good to hear WCS wants to give it another shot.
He didn't show much in his limited time but I feel like it was a victim of circumstance and not personal talent. I think he can put together a great full season with the Mavs with a full training camp under him.
And at 2mil a year, it's hard to beat that value. If WCS shows he's a consistent lob threat with solid defense, then it makes Powell even more expendable than he already is. WCS will be filling the Powell role, and at 9 mil less a year.
(10-09-2020, 12:01 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]WCS will be filling the Powell role, and at 9 mil less a year.
No he will not
WCS will be third center with Powell probably ready from day one of the delayed season start. Maxi, Powell, DFS and KP will take most of PF and C minutes. Of course, there will be games when KP will rest and where WCS could get a chance to prove himself.
(10-09-2020, 12:32 AM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ]No he will not WCS will be third center with Powell probably ready from day one of the delayed season start. Maxi, Powell, DFS and KP will take most of PF and C minutes. Of course, there will be games when KP will rest and where WCS could get a chance to prove himself.
Hard to disprove you based on what we saw from when WCS was actually playing with us. I was coming from the idea that what we saw of WCS was a handicapped version. Outside variables that depressed his on-court production and gave us an underwhelming performance. First he was integrating into an entirely new team. The Mavs offense isn't a simple one, and while WCS job in that offense is relatively simple, there is a lot of movement, and build up to make his actions simple. I'm sure there was a learning curve there, and he certainly was learning on the go. I mean heck Carlisle used to give players quizzes on offensive sets.
Then after he was traded a family member of his suddenly died prematurely. I'm sure that affected him significantly. Enough to keep him out of games. Now be in his shoes. Just got transferred to an entirely new city, in an entirely new organization where you barely know anyone, and then a close family member dies? Thats tough.
We've seen flashes of what WCS can be at his peak. And those flashes are a Brandan Wright lite with better defense. Basically Powell's role to a T with some upside. IF WCS can actually fill in those shoes THEN Powell's job is in jeopardy. And I believe a training camp and offseason will help WCS immensely with filling out that role.
(Also, I wouldn't be so sure that Powell is the day 1 starter. KP looked like an All-NBA player when he started at the 5. I think we see the return of Maxi+DP bench mob with WCS and Boban playing spot minutes).
Ya, I think WCS is more of the player the FO wishes they had in DP than what DP really is. Time will tell if his work and skill set translates on this team, but I like the thought of him being that “goonie” he was talking about in the podcast. As far as that, while all players may have that in them, there are those who understand the role better than others. I think if you told Maxi or DP to be that guy, it would take more of a learning process for them to figure it out than someone like KP and WCS.
If he gets more consistent minutes like we know DP would (and probably will still get with all the benefit of the doubt he gets around here), I think he would prove to be a good rotation piece more so than DP.
(10-09-2020, 01:44 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ]If he gets more consistent minutes like we know DP would (and probably will still get with all the benefit of the doubt he gets around here), I think he would prove to be a good rotation piece more so than DP.
I was just looking up some stats.
In 157 minutes in Dallas, WCS had a total of 11 blocks. In the same season, Dwight played 1061 minutes and had a total of 22 blocks. WCS had a total of 61 blocks on the season. Dwight has never had more than 50. WCS lowest amount of blocks on a season was 44.
WCS is just another type of dude when it comes to rim defense.
(10-09-2020, 01:13 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]I think we see the return of Maxi+DP bench mob with WCS and Boban playing spot minutes).
I agree. WCS will be behind Powell, it doesn't matter if Powell comes from bench or start. Powell will also get every opportunity to get back to where he was. All you guys are seriously underestimating the level of commitment Mavs made to Powell. WCS would have to show absolute monster games to overtake him.
(10-09-2020, 01:44 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ]Ya, I think WCS is more of the player the FO wishes they had in DP than what DP really is.
Nope. Mavs are not stupid, they know exactly what Powell is and they paid for that. There are tons of things Powell is bringing to the table that WCS is not. And I am not just talking about elite rim running. There is leadership, there is hard work ethic, culture, energy he plays with is lifting others and so on.
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