(10-27-2020, 07:26 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]you would need to trade a player and there's no guarantee that drafted player is better than everything you gave up to get them. I don't buy it.
Of course it is no guarantee. BUT if you trust your scouting department then you spend current talent that is possibly at its ceiling to get that player your scouts are saying is special.
Just as a thought exercise:
Wonder if the Mavs think Killian Hayes is a future star. Wonder if he starts to slip in the draft to the end of the top 10 (?), they might go ALL IN to grab someone like him. An 18 year old with a ceiling they think is STAR level.
(10-27-2020, 07:27 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ]Do they think of Gallinari and Harris as stars? Interesting.
Nope, but I bet they think of Gordon Hayward as one, and they might think of Oladipo as one, too.
I wonder who they are targeting in the lottery. Maybe Saddiq Bey or Patrick Williams since it says they want a SF/PF type player?
I also don't recall hearing about their interest in Harris. Harris + Simmons for everyone not named Luka/Porzingis it is then!
SBey or Nesmith are my best guesses, but who knows. I think there are others higher who are worth being picked where they'll go (not many) but I don't think any of them are good enough to justify spending what it might take to move up.
Do we even know what it might cost to move up to, say...14? 10? Is #18, #31 and Wright enough for that?
(10-27-2020, 06:00 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Does anyone here have access to this and the willingness to summarize? Is there really a quote that claims they're willing to trade into the lottery?
A little trick for Dallas News I use. Their protection of the site comes a second or two after the site is loaded. So quickly ctrl A, ctrl C when the site loads and you can read your article in appropriate APP
(10-27-2020, 07:39 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2020, 07:27 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ]Do they think of Gallinari and Harris as stars? Interesting.
Nope, but I bet they think of Gordon Hayward as one, and they might think of Oladipo as one, too.
I think they just consider a star as a clear 3rd option 15-20 ppg type guy depending on skillset.
The issue with THJ is that he's inconsistent with his points and he doesn't give you that defense you need for a 2 way guy. I think more realistically its in that 18-22 ppg type scorer they are looking for.
Guys I'm talking about: Derozan, Dinwiddle, Bogdan, Harris, Buddy, Holiday, Lowry, Schroder, Gallo, Oubre, Hayward, Dipo
I think they may consider the young guys with upside or defensive guys as ones as well.
Gobert, Aaron Gordon, Covington, etc.
There may be a 3rd tier of old expensive guys like Blake Griffin, Chris Paul, etc as an extremely unlikely.
Obviously alot of those don't fit from an age or skill standpoint or they aren't under contract.
I think the most likely to be traded guys that fit from a guard standpoint remain:
Jrue, Buddy, Dipo
Wings/Bigs:
Griffin, Hayward, Gordon
It's going to drive people here crazy if it happens, but close your eyes and imagine Donnie pacing around on the phone, trying to pry Hayward away from Ainge.
That seems like such a Dallas move to me.
(10-27-2020, 07:59 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2020, 06:00 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Does anyone here have access to this and the willingness to summarize? Is there really a quote that claims they're willing to trade into the lottery?
A little trick for Dallas News I use. Their protection of the site comes a second or two after the site is loaded. So quickly ctrl A, ctrl C when the site loads and you can read your article in appropriate APP
Good tip! Thanks!
The Mavs currently have a strong desire to move up in the lottery. Not that they are willing. They are looking.
The most important part of the article tho:
Not surprisingly, I’m told that in the wake of Doncic’s monster 28.8-point, 9.4-rebound, 8.8-assist, All-NBA first-team season, more than a few player agents have whispered to the Mavericks that their client sure wouldn’t mind being part of Dallas' promising future.
The rest is just the same type of stuff we are kicking around here and not a report of any sort. I did find it interesting that he said Sixers are likely to split up Simmons and Embiid. I don't think that's the case. But interesting to hear it from an NBA guy. (I do think they explore it just not likely. )
(10-27-2020, 08:10 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]It's going to drive people here crazy if it happens, but close your eyes and imagine Donnie pacing around on the phone, trying to pry Hayward away from Ainge.
That seems like such a Dallas move to me.
I find it highly unlikely due to his 34 mill salary. You pretty much have to include THJ.
I actually don't mind a deal for Hayward due to you shunning Wright and/or Powell's salary to get it done. But there is no way Boston does a deal for what we have to offer. They'd be better off letting him walk then take money back from us. They already have enough guards as is with Wright. And Powell doesn't make much sense anywhere with the injury.
Other than that, I think it is logical the team wants to improve and they are exploring all possible options. I am sure all teams are exploring all possible options.
Harris makes sense regarding what was said - Mavs are willing to eat some salaries and he fits the SF/PF description. He does make some sense on our team, especially if he can be had cheaply. Kleber, Curry, Powell for Harris and Thybulle (or draft compensation)? Philly gets quality role players and flexibility, Dallas improves while loses future flexibility. If Giannis is off the table (perhaps Mavs know that), that doesn't sound so bad. Perhaps add Wright for Richardson. If Philly doesn't want to have Powell, they can have Wright+Jackson. We would still have MLE and picks. We could even still move up. A lot of options in this "win now" scenario.
Let's say it is Kleber, Curry, Powell for Harris and Thybulle. We draft BPA and cover the hole with MLE. Let's say we draft a guard, so MLE goes for PF. Or the other way around. Guard MLE can be Burke, PF MLE can be Millsap, for example. We can also resign Lee for some veteran leadership at SG. We can still upgrade Wright+pick for a more established player like Schroeder we discussed. Our team would look something like:
Luka, Brunson, Wright
THJ, Burke, #31, Lee
DFS, Thybulle
Harris, #18
KP, WCS, Bobi
Starting five looks great, bench a little weak, so I would still look for upgrades - either move up in the draft for something more certain or "upgrade" Wright.
No on Harris even if you get to dump Powell. That doesn't move the needle for me.
(10-27-2020, 08:28 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2020, 07:39 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Nope, but I bet they think of Gordon Hayward as one, and they might think of Oladipo as one, too.
and you know this how?
I could see the Mavs liking Gordon Hayward but I think Celtics could get a trade that makes more sense from another team.
(10-27-2020, 08:28 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]No on Harris even if you get to dump Powell.
Yeah, yeah, we would all love our Gianis, Kawhis and other all stars. Mavs would love them too. But what if they can't have them and they know it?
(10-27-2020, 08:28 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]I could see the Mavs liking Gordon Hayward but I think Celtics could get a trade that makes more sense from another team.
Replying more to the "nope" (that the Mavs view Harris and Gallinari as stars) than the rest of the post.
Just when I was convinced Wright would be the only move and probably use one of the picks to move him for something. Now it appears anything is possible. We just need a dance partner.
Gobert looks to be a not so secret flirt. Now I worry we don't hold out for the best deal
Whatever that might be...
In all honesty, I can see Harris re-uniting with Bobi as a personality fit to this team. He's pretty far overpaid, but what is the compensation for taking on such a large contract? I think it needs to be more than just Powell even though that is an awful looking contract right now, esp if we're giving them lots of needed 3pt scoring with Curry and Kleber (do they even want Powell AND Kleber from us with Horford still on their roster?).
The Wright for Richardson swap is a good addition to bridge that gap, or maybe a couple of their unnecessary picks from this draft that help us move even further up in the draft? Get a 3rd team involved?
I've looked and looked.... And the only team I can find that fits the "we'll take your bad contracts for a star" bit is the Sixers. That sure seems like Mavs were saying to them "We'll take Harris or Horford to get Simmons."
If it's not that... I think it's a lot of smoke blowing.
(10-27-2020, 08:28 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2020, 07:39 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Nope, but I bet they think of Gordon Hayward as one, and they might think of Oladipo as one, too.
and you know this how?
How do I know that's my bet? Well, because I'm me. Now you know, too, because I told you.
(10-27-2020, 08:38 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2020, 08:28 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]I could see the Mavs liking Gordon Hayward but I think Celtics could get a trade that makes more sense from another team.
Replying more to the "nope" (that the Mavs view Harris and Gallinari as stars) than the rest of the post.
Ah - I see now. Sorry for the "nope," lol.
No, I don't
think they view those players you mentioned as "stars." They're catch and shoot guys mostly, no?
(10-27-2020, 08:52 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ]In all honesty, I can see Harris re-uniting with Bobi as a personality fit to this team. He's pretty far overpaid, but what is the compensation for taking on such a large contract? I think it needs to be more than just Powell even though that is an awful looking contract right now, esp if we're giving them lots of needed 3pt scoring with Curry and Kleber (do they even want Powell AND Kleber from us with Horford still on their roster?).
The Wright for Richardson swap is a good addition to bridge that gap, or maybe a couple of their unnecessary picks from this draft that help us move even further up in the draft? Get a 3rd team involved?
Certainly there are a lot of options with Philly, I didn't even study three teams options. The main thing for them - they want to be contenders. So pure salary dumps are not an option for them, they have to get valuable players back.
As for Harris. He is basically a picture perfect third "star". He efficiently scores 20 ppg, he is a good shooter (I bet his percentage would skyrocket from last season with Mavs spacing and Luka passing), he is an ok defender, he is very durable and he will certainly not come in claiming he is something more than a third "star". His contract runs through his prime, so that is also not bad. The only negative is, that he is overpaid by arround 10 mil per season. So if you don't believe perfect stars will be available, he seems like an option to consider.
Edit: IMHO, he is a far better fit than Gobert who would cost much more to trade for and who would demand similar money in 2021 free agency.
Edit 2: if Harris deal would be for Kleber/Curry/Powell (while also getting Thybulle and keeping our pick), we would still have around 15 mil to play with in 2021 free agency (115 mil cap assumption). Get rid of Wright and we are above 20 mil in cap space.
(10-27-2020, 08:57 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ]I've looked and looked.... And the only team I can find that fits the "we'll take your bad contracts for a star" bit is the Sixers. That sure seems like Mavs were saying to them "We'll take Harris or Horford to get Simmons."
If it's not that... I think it's a lot of smoke blowing.
That was my take as well, although it's definitely a massive long shot. Maybe they were hoping the cap/tax would drop far enough that the Sixers would be forced into a Simmons or Embiid salary dump.
(10-27-2020, 09:14 PM)loki Wrote: [ -> ]That was my take as well, although it's definitely a massive long shot. Maybe they were hoping the cap/tax would drop far enough that the Sixers would be forced into a Simmons or Embiid salary dump.
It's just, Sixer didn't bring Rivers in because they want to rebuild or because tax is of a big concern to them. If they are trading a star, it will be for a star. My guess though, Embiid and Simmons stay another season unless something really great comes along.