MavsBoard

We'll get Oladipo AND Holiday (well a different one, Justin).

Luka, Dipo, Holiday, DFS, KP

I'm out on Dipo, far less for his decline (you should be able to re-sign him to a decent non-max deal, I guess...) than for the fact that he is a guy who needs to prove himself, in a contract year, who needs to have the ball in his hands.

The last thing in the world this Mavs team needs is a contract year shooting guard whose idea of stat padding is based on double-digits per game steals from Luka freaking Doncic. Talk about setting us back. That would be only slightly better than Barnes, and quite a bit worse even than THJ.

You got this all backwards. The whole plan 2020/2021 should be based around getting rid of Powell and Wright for expiring contracts at minimal costs. We move THJ+Powell to the Hornets for Batum first. Send Wright+ two future 2nd round picks to the Bulls for Felicio. Then we sign the best trade value for the full MLE (Saric?) and WAIT. We keep the powder sweet, clean and sexy.

We got the cap cleaned to sign Giannis and then pull of the signature sealing blockbuster trade for Beal with our assets: Saric + Kleber + Curry + Brunson + 18 + 31 + two future 1st. 

Luka
Beal
DFS
Porzingis
Giannis





I bet that´s exactly what Pat Riley plots in Miami right now. Seal Giannis by packaging Robinson, Herro, Nunn, Crowder, and future 1sts for Beal. Oladipo is just a decoy.

(10-16-2020, 03:22 PM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]I bet that´s exactly what Pat Riley plots in Miami right now.

You lost your bet. What Riley is plotting is to sign 2 max free agents and keep Adebayo, Herro, Robinson and Nunn.

(10-16-2020, 03:22 PM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]You got this all backwards. The whole plan 2020/2021 should be based around getting rid of Powell and Wright for expiring contracts at minimal costs. We move THJ+Powell to the Hornets for Batum first. Send Wright+ two future 2nd round picks to the Bulls for Felicio. Then we sign the best trade value for the full MLE (Saric?) and WAIT. We keep the powder sweet, clean and sexy.

We got the cap cleaned to sign Giannis and then pull of the signature sealing blockbuster trade for Beal with our assets: Saric + Kleber + Curry + Brunson + 18 + 31 + two future 1st. 

Luka
Beal
DFS
Porzingis
Giannis





I bet that´s exactly what Pat Riley plots in Miami right now. Seal Giannis by packaging Robinson, Herro, Nunn, Crowder, and future 1sts for Beal. Oladipo is just a decoy.

I like that you’re thinking BIG, and I like the end game. I don’t think they’ll do something that would so drastically hurt their team his season. I think part of why they’re in the national conversation for Giannis is that they’re a playoff team. The farther they can go in the playoffs next year, the more he will want to come here. I don’t think they let go of THJ without a replacement (like Oladipo or Holiday) for that reason. I agree with everything else you wrote here though.

And then this happens:
https://www.si.com/nba/mavericks/news/ex...-extension

Which flies in the face of plan powder. We heard this same thing earlier in the year but I wasn't sure if that was just posturing on part of the Mavs. How can you get a max FA if THJ is on the books?

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I think you would have to dump both Powell and Wright to have a shot at a max FA assuming that Tim's salary is similar to what it is now. I do believe Powell's extension shows you the framework of what they would do. I think THJ's salary would be basically the same as an opt-in and then he'd probably get another 3 years with small raises. Wright's salary + Powell in 2021 is curiously close to what THJ's could be. Wright and Powell combined in 2021 are 19.5M and I think THJ with a similar raise structure to Powell would be just over 19M in 2021.

Otherwise how can we believe all this Giannis talk? Even if you dump Wright, 19 mil of THJ + 11 mil of Powell cuts too much into your cap space.

(10-16-2020, 03:27 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-16-2020, 03:22 PM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]I bet that´s exactly what Pat Riley plots in Miami right now.

You lost your bet. What Riley is plotting is to sign 2 max free agents and keep Adebayo, Herro, Robinson and Nunn.

Well that´s gonna be hell of an expensive team.

Giannis 38
Butler 36
Oladipo 28 (since I doubt he gets the full max anyway)
Adebayo 28
Robinson 15
Nunn 10
Herro 4
===========
That´s $159M conservatively + 5 more roster spots and assuming they are not keeping Igoudala, who btw is a nice dustchip at $15M.

Makes more sense to consolidate.


Any way you slice it the Mavs should look to clean their roster of the two dead weight contracts that are Powell and Wright right now.
As a result we´d have a max cap slot and a major trade package: MLE + Kleber+ Curry + DFS + Brunson + 18 +31 + future 1sts.

That is easily good enough to get convert into somebody like Westbrook at worst and Beal at best.

Look what Kawhi said to the Clippers: Get me PG13 and I sign. Well what if Giannis said get me Beal (CP3/Westbrook) and I sign. Then you start to desperately fumble around trying to get rid of Powell and Wright, while building a trade package for Beal at the same time.

There is absolutely no harm getting rid of Powell and Wright right now. Carlisle is not using Wright, and we can easily replace Powell with a better value MLE signing.

@stepback


That article is from February, and I see no quotes that lead me to believe this is an option they’re considering NOW. As like the 5th or 6th fallback option next year, maybe.

(10-16-2020, 04:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]That article is from February, and I see no quotes that lead me to believe this is an option they’re considering NOW. As like the 5th or 6th fallback option next year, maybe.

Dang Fish got me by re-posting an old article on Twitter.

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Okay so here is the news part:

"#Mavs Hardaway himself reiterated this today"

So this is from his mouth but doesn't mean it's gospel that it will definitely happen. I don't have his exact quote.

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"The goal for me, yes, is to return as a Dallas Maverick. That's the goal. Everybody knows how much I love Dallas. How much I want to be apart of the organization. How much I've built those relationships with those guys and people around the community. Yes, that is the plan. And hopefully the plan goes accordingly. I just have to talk to my agent and let him figure it all out. We will have that answer when the time comes, but you guys know where my heart is at."

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So I think Fish was misleading me there with the extension talk. Likely all this means from today is that THJ is opting in which we were sure was going to happen anyway.

Yeah, I would want to stay here if I were he, too. And, I’m sure the Mavs would be fine having him, if bigger plans fall through. But I don’t believe he’ll get another contract this good, personally. He’s definitely going to opt in and collect that $20 million.

(10-16-2020, 04:04 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]And then this happens:
https://www.si.com/nba/mavericks/news/ex...-extension

Which flies in the face of plan powder. We heard this same thing earlier in the year but I wasn't sure if that was just posturing on part of the Mavs. How can you get a max FA if THJ is on the books?

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I think you would have to dump both Powell and Wright to have a shot at a max FA assuming that Tim's salary is similar to what it is now. I do believe Powell's extension shows you the framework of what they would do. I think THJ's salary would be basically the same as an opt-in and then he'd probably get another 3 years with small raises. Wright's salary + Powell in 2021 is curiously close to what THJ's could be. Wright and Powell combined in 2021 are 19.5M and I think THJ with a similar raise structure to Powell would be just over 19M in 2021.

Otherwise how can we believe all this Giannis talk? Even if you dump Wright, 19 mil of THJ + 11 mil of Powell cuts too much into your cap space.

Why are you quoting a February article? Ancient speculative news.

If THJ gets extended at anywhere near his current salary, then Donnie needs to be fired.

I think THJ+#18 for Dipo would be a risk worth taking. I would bet on Dipo regaining his all-star form before betting on THJ maintaining his play AND the pick turning into a solid rotation player.

Of course if they could trade #18+Wright+Powell for Dipo that would be even better.

Marc Berman of the New York Post provided the report:
"If point guard Chris Paul makes his way to the Knicks via a trade, sources have said Anthony is likely to want to follow. Anthony and Paul are close friends and have dreamed of playing together on an NBA team.
[i]"Both players were represented by Knicks president Leon Rose when he was basketball chief of Creative Artists Agency. A source said Rose is amenable to an Anthony return even without Paul."[/i]

Here’s a great podcast episode in which Kevin O’Conner, who is fast climbing my list of go to basketball guys, says some really smart things about Dallas. The Mavs portion is brief but interesting, and starts at right around the 40 minute mark. 

One of the topics discussed is something I’ve tried to communicate around here for the past month about Porzingis. KP is GREAT, but he’s 100% finisher (shoot the shot, catch the lob, etc) and really isn’t all that able to create offense for himself or others. He really needs others to create for him, which is why he’s not on the same level as Davis, Jokic or Adebayo, imo. NOT saying you can’t win with him, because he is a scoring machine and has the ability to pull those dudes away from the basket, which might be the only way ANYONE is going to beat Davis for the next 7 years. But, the Mavs absolutely must find another guy who can CREATE. I’ve been calling this player a “secondary playmaker” for a while, but I suspect when people (including the MBT) say “3rd star” this is essentially what they’re envisioning. 

There’s also some talk about KP’s health, but that’s nothing new to anyone here.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/th...0494961549

In this next episode, at around the 49:30 mark, Jonathan Tjarks, a “national” Mavs fan talks about the same roster flaw from a different angle. 

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/th...0494762595

I’m telling you guys, they’re NOT trying to get Covington’s or OPJ’s right now. I don’t think they believe the roster is even ready for those guys to make a difference, and after watching the teams who advanced in the playoffs, I totally understand why and agree with them. Secondary playmaker. Secondary playmaker. Secondary playmaker. This is why we need to be thinking Oladipo, Holiday, Hayward, etc.

(10-17-2020, 01:40 AM)Branduil Wrote: [ -> ]I think THJ+#18 for Dipo would be a risk worth taking. I would bet on Dipo regaining his all-star form before betting on THJ maintaining his play AND the pick turning into a solid rotation player.

Of course if they could trade #18+Wright+Powell for Dipo that would be even better.

Oladipo is kind of a HIBW’s kind of move in that he’s expiring and you can move on if it doesn’t work.  He’s the secondary playmaker that is needed in the starting lineup and can certainly be a 15 ppg scorer they’ve said they want.

Here is my question though.  Is THJ really the guy we want to give away and the guy Indy wants?  Seems to me THJ still fits just fine in a lineup with Dipo and Doncic (sounds like a podcast).  Lineups were just about as successful with him at SF as they were with him at SG.  Indy has a gaping hole at PF.  Seems to me they would start with Maxi and 18 and then fill in from there.  They have a ton of PG’s, so Wright probably isn’t a priority.  Why not just fill in the needed money with Lee.  Lee’s salary would have to be $7.65mm.  What I’ve mentioned before is the most logical salary for Lee is $5mm above the minimum so that Cuban could pay $5mm and Lee would cost the team that gets him a net cost of about the Vet Min...Bingo.

I know, I know.  Everyone loves Maxi.  But, we still have Jackson, 31 and Wright to play with.  Go back to the Thaddeus Young deal that has been talked about (He built a home in WEST LAKE last year) and your big rotation of KP/Young/WCS/Powell is just fine even without Maxi (plus DFS will get some minutes at PF).  I’d throw an overpayment of most of the MLE at Justin Holiday to get him to agree to a 1 year deal.  Result is good defenders in KP, Young, DFS, Holiday and Oladipo, good playmaking in Luka, Oladipo, Brunson, Curry and Young (yes Young).  Good PnR bigs everywhere and good 3 point shooting everwhere:

KP/WCS
Young/Powell
THJ/DFS/Holiday
Oladipo/Curry
Luka/Brunson

Courtney Lee  is not a trade asset. He will be lucky to get a minimum offer from some team. How many more times will this ridiculous idea be brought up?

(10-17-2020, 01:58 AM)ClutchDirk Wrote: [ -> ]Marc Berman of the New York Post provided the report:
"If point guard Chris Paul makes his way to the Knicks via a trade, sources have said Anthony is likely to want to follow. Anthony and Paul are close friends and have dreamed of playing together on an NBA team.
[i]"Both players were represented by Knicks president Leon Rose when he was basketball chief of Creative Artists Agency. A source said Rose is amenable to an Anthony return even without Paul."[/i]

I think both parts of this are likely.  Agent relationships matter.

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(10-17-2020, 07:41 AM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]Courtney Lee  is not a trade asset. He will be lucky to get a minimum offer from some team. How many more times will this ridiculous idea be brought up?

Watch and learn.

Why else would they keep an injured player who rarely plays on the playoff roster when they were already thin?  Lee provides trade flexibility this off season.  If Cuban pays the first $5mm of $7.65mm, then Lee is a minimum wage guy at his years of service.  If you assume we want to keep THJ, then we really don't have many expiring contracts.  Lee is a perfectly legal way to manufacture an expiring deal.

(10-16-2020, 07:01 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]Why are you quoting a February article? Ancient speculative news.

If THJ gets extended at anywhere near his current salary, then Donnie needs to be fired.

Fish tricked me on Twitter

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(10-17-2020, 07:41 AM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]Courtney Lee  is not a trade asset. He will be lucky to get a minimum offer from some team. How many more times will this ridiculous idea be brought up?

I believe the same as Dan is that Mavs will pay him something extra bc a) they like him and b) they could use salary matching in some deals later on. I don't think they will do something crazy like pay him 10 mil just to give them more salary to swap at the TDL. I could definitely see the Mavs giving him 5 mil though. There is no penalty for them to do so other than it comes out of Cubes' bank account.

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(10-17-2020, 07:14 AM)DanSchwartzman Wrote: [ -> ]Here is my question though.  Is THJ really the guy we want to give away and the guy Indy wants? 

Not sure but I bet that's the offer. THJ and Dipo at least play the same position and salary works pretty cleanly. 18 + THJ for Dipo would be amazing, I would be willing to part with 31 as well. I really think that deal puts us in the running for Dipo.

Again they might get a better deal somewhere else but this is a competitive offer.

(10-17-2020, 02:23 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ] 
I’m telling you guys, they’re NOT trying to get Covington’s or OPJ’s right now. I don’t think they believe the roster is even ready for those guys to make a difference, and after watching the teams who advanced in the playoffs, I totally understand why and agree with them. Secondary playmaker. Secondary playmaker. Secondary playmaker. This is why we need to be thinking Oladipo, Holiday, Hayward, etc.

The Ringer does do a good job with podcasts.  Thanks for posting the spots to listen.  I agree on the need for playmaking.  The trick is figuring out the right amount of playmaking from someone who is also good off the ball. 

Something I find interesting is the way sentiment has shifted this week.  We were discussing team Powder be Damned deals that would add money, then suddenly there's a media story about 2021 and we are back to Plan Powder.  Then someone says Cuban is willing to take on money.  Then someone says we might extend THJ.  Now we are talking HIBW's guys like Dipo.  As I've said many times, we have three paths and we are probably going to be bouncing back and forth among them until something actually happens.

(10-17-2020, 01:40 AM)Branduil Wrote: [ -> ]Of course if they could trade #18+Wright+Powell for Dipo that would be even better.

Even better would be Wright+Powell+Jackson for 1990's era Jordan in his prime!