(11-17-2020, 02:48 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ] (11-17-2020, 02:35 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ]Boston, Philly, Brooklyn, Denver, GS are the only contenders that don't have all their picks exhausted...
Isn't that enough? That's five teams driving the price up. Not to mention they all arguably have more picks than Dallas. Weren't you the one claiming that you can see a scenario where there won't be a bidding war for Jrue?
Those five teams usually fight for same couple of top guys, because it is also an arms war. "It is better for me to overpay a pick than my competitior gets him". As you can see on the example of LAL and LAC.
Depends on the player was the point I was trying to make. I don't think Dallas is in a great situation to capitalize. But someone is for sure.
I still do not think there was a bidding war for Jrue. Why would you bid up Jrue when Harden may be had as well? I'd say everyone of those teams would be calling about Harden.
While I think it was a massive overpay by Milwaukee.. They also dumped Bledsoes deal. That cost extra no doubt. But 3 picks projected around 30? Mavs could have offered 2 this year the same or better. But the potential of it being a disaster by the bucks? Priceless for New Orleans ha. But if Giannis is there for the next 10 years that's not likely much of anything for the Pelicans.
The inclusion of MPJ immediately trumps that deal for me. I'd argue the same for Levert. Same for GS picks or any of Boston's guys. All those great assets someone thought would be sent... I don't think they were ever on the table. That's the bidding war that I thought everyone else thought might happen with Jrue and I sincerely don't think it happened.
That being said. Jrue went for way more than I thought he would. I didn't think someone like Milwaukee would exhaust all remaining assets for him. That's the exact type of move I didn't want to the Mavs to do. I actually had been saying I preferred not to do a Jrue deal if it exhausted all of our remain assets which are still limited. Not while he is an UFA next summer still.
(11-17-2020, 02:56 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ] (11-17-2020, 01:02 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ] (11-17-2020, 12:53 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]8) Dipo for real damn cheap (like 31 and Wright)
Scott, I know this isn't the point of your post, and I'm hijacking a little, but this is something I'm really fascinated by this morning:
I think it's important that we all understand what Windhorst MEANT by "Oladipo has no value...contract related."
1) IND is obviously not going to move him for a package like what's above.
2) No team is paying more than that for a RENTAL.
3) Because of 1 and 2, any trade for a player like Oladipo, in his contractual situation, would basically require an agreement between Oladipo and his new team that a contract extension be in place in order to make the trade. It's the only way both teams can get what they want in the deal.
4) While there are teams who value what COULD BE with Oladipo (maybe including the Mavs), it's the guaranteed money on that potential contract, and not the trade cost, that's preventing a market from forming. That's what all the notes about "teams want to see Oladipo play for a while before trading for him" have meant. It all makes total sense to me now.
So, and this is crucial to understand, IF that market materializes NOW (from the Mavs or any other team), given the events of the past 24 hours, I think it's safe to assume that it's at least a little bit of a panic move.
This got buried, and I think it's important, so I'm bumping it.
While i agree with that last bit about a team getting desperate and overpaying, your points 1-3 i disagree. Indy takes on risk by keeping a disgruntled player into the season(reports he wanted out last year). That’s cancer on a team going nowhere(similar situation to Jimmy Butler on MIN). Mavs ONLY want to pay the rental price. Any extension trade would likely cost too much. We would also want the ability to let him walk if he turns out to be fraud. Everything works perfect then we re-sign him
(11-17-2020, 02:51 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ] (11-17-2020, 02:44 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ]I'm thinking we trade 18, Wright and Jackson for Oubre at this point.
Sorry, but I don't think OKC is selling at this price. I think it would have happened already, if they are
Maybe they don't.
But they risk the market shrinking for him if they carry him into the season IMO. For one a team like the Mavs can't trade a 1st for him. I'm sure there would be other sticking points with the Stepien rule for somebody.
He won't resign there unless they overpay.
IMO they need to trade him now. Does anyone beat that price? Maybe so with all the craziness ha
(11-17-2020, 03:03 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ]While I think it was a massive overpay by Milwaukee.. They also dumped Bledsoes deal. That cost extra no doubt. But 3 picks projected around 30? Mavs could have offered 2 this year the same or better. But the potential of it being a disaster by the bucks? Priceless for New Orleans ha. But if Giannis is there for the next 10 years that's not likely much of anything for the Pelicans.
Wow, so that makes Mavs really stupid for not dumping Powell and Wright with #18 and #31. It's same value, according to your evaluation. Donnie should be fired.
You know, those 2 unprotected picks come after 2024. So there is some chance Milwaukee will suck by then. Which should be great for Pelicans, being in their prime and still drafting them picks.
(11-17-2020, 03:09 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ]IMO they need to trade him now.
No, they don't. Wannabe contenders have much greater need to have a good player than OKC to dump him. OKC can wait.
Any chance Mavs trade THJ/Wright/Jax/Boban for Rubio/Oubre/Green come Thursday evening?
(11-17-2020, 03:13 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]Any chance Mavs trade THJ/Wright/Jax/Boban for Rubio/Oubre/Green come Thursday evening?
I think OKC part is clearly better, so I would say no.
(11-17-2020, 03:12 PM)JamesConway Wrote: [ -> ]https://twitter.com/apooch/status/132879...94983?s=21
hm, that is the Nets beat writer who is usually pretty credible. the hell
Hope Giannis doesn't sign early and waits on the season. Going to the West might all of the sudden look a little better i guess
Please stop arguing about how much Oubre is going to cost. If we're going to spend assets on a guy who is terrible at defense, he'd better be Lavine or Hield, not the "potential" of Oubre.
(11-17-2020, 03:08 PM)Jason Terry Wrote: [ -> ]While i agree with that last bit about a team getting desperate and overpaying, your points 1-3 i disagree. Indy takes on risk by keeping a disgruntled player into the season(reports he wanted out last year). That’s cancer on a team going nowhere(similar situation to Jimmy Butler on MIN). Mavs ONLY want to pay the rental price. Any extension trade would likely cost too much. We would also want the ability to let him walk if he turns out to be fraud. Everything works perfect then we re-sign him
Hey, I am just telling you what the experts are saying.
Indiana wants a good offer for him, and Oladipo wants a new contract. They are working together to get him somewhere (maybe somewhere he wants, specifically) but there's no market for him AT THAT LEVEL because the teams in question aren't willing to give him a new contract. So, why would they offer trade assets for a player who they aren't sure they want to keep?
Indiana COULD have lowered their trade cost ask to the level that would entice someone to take a chance and hope it works out, as you suggest, but they DID NOT. Instead, they decided to start the season with him, hoping that when he plays, if he plays well, the offers they want might be there. This actually might be successful, and it might actually be in Oladipo's best interest. I suspect this is why the "I am committed to Indiana" article came out exactly when it did.
Really, we're talking about Miami, Dallas and Toronto. Those are the teams who've been planning around 2021, and all three have been linked to Oladipo. It's possible, now that Giannis is off the board, that one of those teams will rethink their reluctance to gamble, agreeing to trade for him, extend him, call him their guy, etc. But, I don't think it's possible that Indiana backs off of their plan to hold firm and wait until a REAL market forms. I don't think there's a scenario, unfortunately, where you get him for junk and then get a year to evaluate whether he fits long term.
Again, I didn't just dream this up. THIS IS THE WORD ON THE STREET from people who know. And, it makes perfect sense.
(11-17-2020, 03:03 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ] (11-17-2020, 02:48 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ] (11-17-2020, 02:35 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ]Boston, Philly, Brooklyn, Denver, GS are the only contenders that don't have all their picks exhausted...
Isn't that enough? That's five teams driving the price up. Not to mention they all arguably have more picks than Dallas. Weren't you the one claiming that you can see a scenario where there won't be a bidding war for Jrue?
Those five teams usually fight for same couple of top guys, because it is also an arms war. "It is better for me to overpay a pick than my competitior gets him". As you can see on the example of LAL and LAC.
Depends on the player was the point I was trying to make. I don't think Dallas is in a great situation to capitalize. But someone is for sure.
I still do not think there was a bidding war for Jrue. Why would you bid up Jrue when Harden may be had as well? I'd say everyone of those teams would be calling about Harden.
While I think it was a massive overpay by Milwaukee.. They also dumped Bledsoes deal. That cost extra no doubt. But 3 picks projected around 30? Mavs could have offered 2 this year the same or better. But the potential of it being a disaster by the bucks? Priceless for New Orleans ha. But if Giannis is there for the next 10 years that's not likely much of anything for the Pelicans.
The inclusion of MPJ immediately trumps that deal for me. I'd argue the same for Levert. Same for GS picks or any of Boston's guys. All those great assets someone thought would be sent... I don't think they were ever on the table. That's the bidding war that I thought everyone else thought might happen with Jrue and I sincerely don't think it happened.
That being said. Jrue went for way more than I thought he would. I didn't think someone like Milwaukee would exhaust all remaining assets for him. That's the exact type of move I didn't want to the Mavs to do. I actually had been saying I preferred not to do a Jrue deal if it exhausted all of our remain assets which are still limited. Not while he is an UFA next summer still.
The context of the move is important. Bucks have their backs against the wall and going all in is their only hope to keep Giannis. Jrue was the best fit so they ante’d up. New Orleans has one of the best GM’s in the league now. They got max they could for Jrue and AD.
Still think there was a bid war behind the scenes. Denver(and possibly other teams) gave what they thought was a decent offer and Bucks just more desperate
I'm a little surprised we haven't seen more mid-level players traded as teams try to shore up roster holes before the draft. We've seen the big shoes drop, but it's been pretty quiet among the role guys other than the Shroder trade.
(11-17-2020, 03:15 PM)sefant Wrote: [ -> ]Hope Giannis doesn't sign early and waits on the season. Going to the West might all of the sudden look a little better i guess
Nah. Irving, Harde, Harris, Durant and Jordan will be horrible defensively and they will need three balls to make everyone happy. I see lot's of ways this goes terribly wrong. Talented offense, though
(11-17-2020, 03:09 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ] (11-17-2020, 03:03 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ]While I think it was a massive overpay by Milwaukee.. They also dumped Bledsoes deal. That cost extra no doubt. But 3 picks projected around 30? Mavs could have offered 2 this year the same or better. But the potential of it being a disaster by the bucks? Priceless for New Orleans ha. But if Giannis is there for the next 10 years that's not likely much of anything for the Pelicans.
Wow, so that makes Mavs really stupid for not dumping Powell and Wright with #18 and #31. It's same value, according to your evaluation. Donnie should be fired.
You know, those 2 unprotected picks come after 2024. So there is some chance Milwaukee will suck by then. Which should be great for Pelicans, being in their prime and still drafting them picks.
(11-17-2020, 03:09 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: [ -> ]IMO they need to trade him now.
No, they don't. Wannabe contenders have much greater need to have a good player than OKC to dump him. OKC can wait.
That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying New Orleans probably asked for a bit extra to take on Bledsoes bad deal. He offers 0 value and he's not cap friendly.. That's a negative trade value recipe.
New Orleans got a good deal. If Giannis leaves anytime in the next 7 years they'll have an incredible deal.
But a Supermax extension would theoretically tie him there the next 6 years possibly only 5. It's hard to see most of those picks being worth anything with the max extension.
The gamble that they flounder at some point or Giannis eventually asks to be traded makes it worthwhile for New Orleans.
But I'd say it's a 75% chance those picks are all around 25 or later each year. It's the same gamble OKC made with LAC. A great gamble IMO because as we've seen with the clips... It can possibly not go as planned.
I am becoming increasingly unimpressed with our 2021 free agency prospects.
(11-17-2020, 03:13 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]Any chance Mavs trade THJ/Wright/Jax/Boban for Rubio/Oubre/Green come Thursday evening?
I believe this is impossible due to aggregation rules.
They could get 2 of the 3 tho in 2 separate deals since the Green deal hasn't been finalized.
If the Nets land Harden, are they still going to pay Joe Harris whatever it takes or they going to let him walk? Someone is going to end up way overpaying him (Hawks).
(11-17-2020, 03:19 PM)HanspardsShowerVoice Wrote: [ -> ]I'm a little surprised we haven't seen more mid-level players traded as teams try to shore up roster holes before the draft. We've seen the big shoes drop, but it's been pretty quiet among the role guys other than the Shroder trade.
What I've noticed is that so far, not a single player for player trade has occurred. It has been 100% about draft capital to start over in exchange for good players to contenders, so far. I guess it will be that way until after the draft, maybe?
Given the Mavs' assets are cheap role players (not worthless) and not draft capital (which they've already used on Porzingis) I think we're jumping the gun with all the doom and gloom. It might be that during this portion of the trade season, the Mavs are SELLERS (#18) not BUYERS. If the lack of movement is them properly evaluating that one, specific draft asset they have, I think that might be a good thing.