(11-11-2020, 04:39 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]Are people too low on Oubre? How come ppl don't like him? He seems to fit the profile of what the Mavs need. I don't think I'd want to give up 18 but 31/Wright/Jackson would be a good deal imo.
Of course it would. Pretty sure he wouldn't be available for that. The 18 is the rub. I'd rather have a guy who might be able to help us in a year or two on a rookie deal than a guy on a big full priced deal who is either going to walk in a year or whose retention would prevent us from getting superior free agents (like you-know-who). I'm not to bother to look him up, but IIRC, Oubre's defense is pretty horrible.
(11-11-2020, 04:39 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]Are people too low on Oubre? How come ppl don't like him? He seems to fit the profile of what the Mavs need. I don't think I'd want to give up 18 but 31/Wright/Jackson would be a good deal imo.
Ok, but...what's being rumored is #18 and DFS, so that's what we've been talking about.
I would assume that, if DFS's name is being floated in these talks, it's not as a throw in, and can't be interchanged with Jackson just because we'd prefer it that way. DFS is the one with value, not Jackson. #18 is probably the MOST valuable thing the Mavs have to offer.
I'm not saying they'd do one or any of the deals we've talked about, but I think #18 is the BEGINNING of their cover charge to get into the party, tbh.
Someone might want Wright, but not to give the Mavs a better player. Someone might want Jackson, but not to give the Mavs a better player.
To do the kind of deals we've been debating here for months, it's quite clear that at least one of #18, DFS, Kleber or Curry is going away, and probably more than one. It is what it is.
I have said all along that I'd be ok just bringing the team back and waiting if great opportunities don't present themselves right away, and I still am. But, let's not talk ourselves into the idea that the players above are untouchable.
If we trade DFS in any CP3 to Suns trade, one of the first calls I make post trade is to Orlando, and I offer Wright for Aminu and future draft compensation (probably 2 second rounders) because they still need a guard and Dallas would need a defensive minded wing
(11-11-2020, 05:01 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ] (11-11-2020, 04:39 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]Are people too low on Oubre? How come ppl don't like him? He seems to fit the profile of what the Mavs need. I don't think I'd want to give up 18 but 31/Wright/Jackson would be a good deal imo.
Ok, but...what's being rumored is #18 and DFS, so that's what we've been talking about.
I would assume that, if DFS's name is being floated in these talks, it's not as a throw in, and can't be interchanged with Jackson just because we'd prefer it that way. DFS is the one with value, not Jackson. #18 is probably the MOST valuable thing the Mavs have to offer.
I'm not saying they'd do one or any of the deals we've talked about, but I think #18 is the BEGINNING of their cover charge to get into the party, tbh.
Someone might want Wright, but not to give the Mavs a better player. Someone might want Jackson, but not to give the Mavs a better player.
To do the kind of deals we've been debating here for months, it's quite clear that at least one of #18, DFS, Kleber or Curry is going away, and probably more than one. It is what it is.
I have said all along that I'd be ok just bringing the team back and waiting if great opportunities don't present themselves right away, and I still am. But, let's not talk ourselves into the idea that the players above are untouchable.
I can't see any scenario where Mavs are giving away 18 + DFS for Oubre. That is terrible value. I still stand by the idea that Mavs will be adding not subtracting players but ya never know!
(11-11-2020, 05:13 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]I can't see any scenario where Mavs are giving away 18 + DFS for Oubre. That is terrible value. I still stand by the idea that Mavs will be adding not subtracting players but ya never know!
Ok, neither can I. But, that's not what was rumored. What was rumored is that #18 and DFS are involved, with no specific suggestion as to HOW, and the same rumor claims it's a 4 team deal.
Do you have any ideas within these parameters that WOULD make sense? That's the discussion today, if you'd like to join.
(11-11-2020, 05:17 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Do you have any ideas within these parameters that WOULD make sense?
The ones posted by @"DanSchwartzman" from that trusted poster of his are the only ones that make sense to me whatsoever.
(11-11-2020, 05:17 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ] (11-11-2020, 05:13 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]I can't see any scenario where Mavs are giving away 18 + DFS for Oubre. That is terrible value. I still stand by the idea that Mavs will be adding not subtracting players but ya never know!
Ok, neither can I. But, that's not what was rumored. What was rumored is that #18 and DFS are involved, with no specific suggestion as to HOW, and the same rumor claims it's a 4 team deal.
Do you have any ideas within these parameters that WOULD make sense? That's the discussion today, if you'd like to join.
Ya I looked through all those and I am not giving up 18 + DFS unless I am getting 10 out of the deal probably. And that's if you are really confident that the guy at 10 is a big upgrade over 18 + DFS combined. I hope Mavs aren't in the mix for Rubio. Oubre would be good if Mavs don't overpay.
For the record, I think the ONLY interest the Mavs might have in Oubre would revolve around his expiring contract. Yes, he could play in the rotation here, and maybe even start, but I think the goal would be the contract.
That's what got me on the Rubio thinking after a little reflection. We KNOW they like him. We THINK he's a bad fit with Luka, but we don't KNOW what THEY think about that.
If you believe that they'd go for Gallo or Hayward at $17 million per (I know many people don't, but I think they might) then it stands to reason that there are other players at that general price point they'd be willing to work around.
Look, I'm just grasping at any straw I can to try to figure out a way this makes sense without the fairy tale that the Mavs are going to get the 10th pick out of it. IF THEY GET #10, SOMEHOW, SIGN ME UP, but I just can't see it.
(11-11-2020, 05:21 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ] (11-11-2020, 05:17 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Do you have any ideas within these parameters that WOULD make sense?
The ones posted by @"DanSchwartzman" from that trusted poster of his are the only ones that make sense to me whatsoever.
Hate to say it, but I can definitely see the Beverly/Oubre combo being a Mavs move. Not what I'd do, but I can see them pulling the trigger on that.
(11-11-2020, 05:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]the fairy tale that we're going to get the 10th pick out of it
The fairy tale is that the Mavs are going to trade DFS + 18 and NOT get #10. That's the real fairy tale IMO.
Moving back 8 spots in a draft that is pretty even in talent is not a big price for getting DFS on a bargain. A base of DFS+18 for 10 is completely realistic.
(11-11-2020, 05:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Hate to say it, but I can definitely see the Beverly/Oubre combo being a Mavs move.
That was Dan's own idea....I was talking about the poster that had the Mavs swapping 18 and 10.
(11-11-2020, 05:24 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ] (11-11-2020, 05:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]the fairy tale that we're going to get the 10th pick out of it
The fairy tale is that the Mavs are going to trade DFS + 18 and NOT get #10. That's the real fairy tale IMO.
Moving back 8 spots in a draft that is pretty even in talent is not a big price for getting DFS on a bargain. A base of DFS+18 for 10 is completely realistic.
If you say so. That hasn't been my read at all. I hope you're right!
(11-11-2020, 05:27 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]If you say so.
What do YOU say?
Would you trade 18+DFS for anything less than 10?
(11-11-2020, 05:25 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ] (11-11-2020, 05:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Hate to say it, but I can definitely see the Beverly/Oubre combo being a Mavs move.
That was Dan's own idea....I was talking about the poster that had the Mavs swapping 18 and 10.
Yes, and I was saying the NEXT one is actually MORE realistic (in my opinion). It was very easy to understand your point. I was adding another one.
Oubre is better than DFS, I don't think anyone is disputing that. His injury is concearning, so his price can't be DFS + #18. Maybe a Harrell S&T might happen.
LAC in: Rubio, DFS (one of the best performers on our series).
DAL in: Oubre, Harrell (rumors).
PHO in: Paul (main piece).
OKC in: Shamet, fillers, picks (Presti love them picks).
(11-11-2020, 05:28 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ] (11-11-2020, 05:27 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]If you say so.
What do YOU say?
Would you trade 18+DFS for anything less than 10?
Yes! I'm not sure I would do it as part of this move, but there could be other players involved not mentioned, and I can definitely imagine the Mavs making such a move. I agree that they wouldn't do it for Oubre alone. But I have similar issues with the logic of someone trading down from #10 to #18 just for DFS (and I LOVE DFS).
(11-11-2020, 05:25 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ] (11-11-2020, 05:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Hate to say it, but I can definitely see the Beverly/Oubre combo being a Mavs move.
That was Dan's own idea....I was talking about the poster that had the Mavs swapping 18 and 10.
Beverly/Oubre seems very Mavs-ish. I would get that Wright+Jackson would be outgoing. I don't see #10 being in the mix there at all. If you just had to give up 31 then I think Oubre + Bev is a clear upgrade over Wright + Jackson.
I don't watch a ton of Oubre but I didn't think he had a reputation as a bad defender, I thought the opposite. His defensive highlights look pretty good to me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvD0qBNKQ24. I know a highlight video isn't the final word but you don't get these type of videos made at all if you are terrible at defense.
(11-11-2020, 05:31 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Yes! I'm not sure I would do it as part of this move, but there could be other players involved not mentioned, and I can definitely imagine the Mavs making such a move. I agree that they wouldn't do it for Oubre alone. But I have similar issues with the logic of someone trading down from #10 to #18 just for DFS (and I LOVE DFS).
18 + DFS is fair value depending on what's at 10 and what you think will be there at 18. The beauty of DFS is that his contract is dirt cheap and he can start or come off the bench. If 10 is a superstar then ya that's not worth a trade-down but I thought this was a weak draft?
Oubre was below Justin Jackson for DRPM this past year, 6th worst among small forwards. Now, that stat has a lot to do with team defense, but it sure doesn't look good.