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(06-02-2022, 12:30 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: [ -> ]This is where I land also.  Filling two holes with our limited assets is really challenging.  This does a decent job of filling both holes in one deal.  We can extend Barnes and solve the free agent in 23 issue.  I think the tougher question is the one Omahen raises...what if they want both picks (or pick swap in 22 and next available first after that).  

We'd be locked into this roster for awhile, but I imagine Holmes getting the rebounds Powell didn't and hitting that little push shot when Luka passes to him in the mid roll.  I envision Barnes hitting 45% on every 3 that Green or Frank took in the playoffs.  And I envision an above average rim protecting center in at all times between Holmes and Maxi and I'm good with locking into this group for a few years.  It is pretty dramatic improvement IMHO.  How much depends on how off their norm both players were last season in cesspool Sacramento versus what they might be next to Luka.

I'm on board with Omahen.  Its an easy call if its this years pick, but I am much less interested if its a future pick.  Holmes is not going to be that expensive in assets to get, so we would be effectively trading away future options for potentially one year of Barnes.  Even if he doesn't leave he will have a lot of leverage (like Brunson now) as its pay him or lose him for nothing.  I would be more interested in sending out salary filler for Tobias Harris than a future pick for Barnes.
(06-02-2022, 12:30 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: [ -> ]...both players were last season in cesspool Sacramento versus what they might be next to Luka.

The above might be the biggest pendulum swing available for players in the NBA  Wink
(06-02-2022, 10:45 AM)michaeltex Wrote: [ -> ]Brown/Pinson/Burke/Frankie/Chriss are all nightly DNP-CD guys, or at least were last season.(I skipped Boban because, well he's Boban.) I know there were injuries and what not, but is there really any upside to these guys other than towel waving?

Bobi and Pinson are chemistry/occasional player types, but since that's what the FO wants to do, it is what it is. It leaves 13 other slots to fill with players of various usefulness.

But let me opine about those bottom 5 players.

The fact that they don't play all 15 on a regular basis, or even 13, shouldn't be a cause for alarm. That's how it works in the NBA - teams have about 9-10 guys who get the minutes, and the others are deep backups who rarely play. So the fact the Mavs have 5 guys who rarely play is NBA business as usual. And it's a catch-22 in getting good players into those slots, because the player who can play wants to go someplace where he can regular minutes (in someones top 10) and better pay than you offer for those last 5 slots (which should be at or near the minimum salary, except for young developing draftees).

As for whether they have the correct bottom 5-6, they obviously will be weeding out some, just because of numbers. Theo is getting promoted, and pick 26 (who won't be NBA ready, when picked that low) is being added, so 2 have to go. Because of the cost (including a high tax), they are not likely to want to just cut anyones, unless they simply have no choice. IOW attrition will weed out a couple anyhow.

Bobi and Theo will be 2 of those bottom 5-6 players retunring. Pick 26 will presumably make the team and squeeze out someone, and he will be one of the bottom 5-6 also.

Franky seems like a keeper because he's cheap with upside, with use at times as a good defensive wing or a point (needing more work on his offense). Green is similar. Both are young and on cheap deals. But it's possible they pick one to keep, and swap one.

Burke imo is actually a very good fit in this sort of slot and likely to be kept. He knows the offense, has some skill, is willing to wait his turn, and is a backup for THREE key players (ie, if you're missing any of Luka, Brunson, or Dinwiddie, he's needed as a ball-handling playmaker). He's probably slightly overpaid, but not by enough to quibble about. (He will make 3.3, and his minimum is over 2.6.)

Chriss is on a minimum, looks like he has some upside and might make sense as the emergency big on a cheap deal, but could be supplanted by pick 26 or someone else added in free agency. We won't count Bobi as an emergency C since he isn't ever really used, and he isn't young with upside either, so there's probably an opening for Chriss or someone else to be the 3rd string, developing C. Why not Chriss, unless they end up with more than 2 other C's (right now, it's DP and Maxi).

Brown has shown us nothing and obviously should go (unless they see something in practice that he hasn't had a chance to show in games).

Trades could change the mix, of course. But unless they have more than 15 and are backed into a corner, don't see them waiving a bunch, and certainly don't expect they will be starting over on the bottom all at once. They do need to have in the mix some that they feel can emerge eventually into regulars, and that are being developed. It looks like they do have room for maybe 3 of those (however, hopefully 1 or more of those who develop into regulars in time might already be there, among Chriss, Franky, and Green.)
About Hayward, while he looks very desirable at first glance, he has a major issue.

He is always hurt. He only is able to play 40-50 games a year, it seems. And he's significantly hurt right now, missing the last 1/3 of the season (while Charlotte was fighting for a playoff berth) with some sort of vague foot issue.

While trading some of these guys feels like an upgrade, it might be just the opposite. And his contract is big, so he would be hard to move.
(06-02-2022, 04:11 PM)F Gump Wrote: [ -> ]About Hayward, while he looks very desirable at first glance, he has a major issue.

He is always hurt. He only is able to play 40-50 games a year, it seems. And he's significantly hurt right now, missing the last 1/3 of the season (while Charlotte was fighting for a playoff berth) with some sort of vague foot issue.

While trading some of these guys feels like an upgrade, it might be just the opposite. And his contract is big, so he would be hard to move.


Hayward will never replicate what he did in Utah. He might have a flashback every now and then, but that gruesome ankle injury he suffered a few years back just started a trend of him being constantly hurt all the time.
(06-02-2022, 09:24 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: [ -> ]Dalton Trigg put up a trade idea 

If Dalton Trigg was the Mavs writer for the Athletic, I would immediately sign up again. He's a favorite of mine.
(06-02-2022, 09:24 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: [ -> ]Dalton Trigg put up a trade idea that I like better than something I proposed a while back.  I thought Sacramento might like Hardaway as a win-now (OK, play-in now) type piece in a deal for Holmes and Harkless.  Expiring Harkless is there to make the money work.  He is a Duffy guy and free after the current season.

Trigg's deal sends out more assets but replaces Harkless with Barnes.  Many commentators have said we need both a center and a competent scoring wing.  This deal accomplishes both.  Barnes is absolute money on corner 3's, but also creates nearly half of his 2-point shots unassisted.  That would give us one more guy (besides a PG) who can create for himself while also able to play off the ball competently.  His TS% in in the 91st percentile.  He was terrible defensively this last season, but has been at least average in the past and has had seasons where the good O and average D balanced to a plus performer.  Sacramento might be willing to deal because Barnes is entering the final year of his contract and could walk for nothing next summer.

The compensation that Trigg proposes for Holmes/Barnes is:

THJ
Green
22 Pick or 25 pick
Powell

As we know, Holmes fits into our TPE on draft night, so including Powell would be optional for Sacramento.  Sacramento has the 37th overall, so the 22 pick could be a swap.  The Kings have a $4mm TPE, so the Green part of this could create a small TPE.  Barnes is 30 and trading for him means you will be dealing with 31 year old Barnes (Schwartz) next summer for a new contract.  We are adding two competent playoff rotation players here without giving up anyone who contributed to the WCF run.  Playoff rotation probably looks something like:

Holmes/Maxi       Boban
Barnes/DFS        Bertans/Chriss
DFS/Bullock        Brown
Brunson/SD        Frank/Pinson
Luka/SD             Burke

My main nit to pick here is that I think you would have Barnes comes off the bench here. You'd still want Bullock to start for his defense and then have the option to bring in Barnes at any time for some more offensive creation.
My only pushback against the Trigg idea is that it is based on the thought that SAC might toss in the towel and go into full rebuild mode. Unfortunately I think they are on the opposite end of the spectrum right now in their thinking (even if they are thinking wrong), and that they are looking for moves to make them immediately be better.

You might get Holmes if they don't see him as helpful, and want to get off his money to do something else, because he's been replaced by Sabonis and is being paid a lot for a much smaller role. But not sure they would ship out Barnes, because I don't think they have a ready replacement.

With them drafting at 4, that could change, of course.

I would have no problem if the Mavs included 26 and Green in such a deal, but I'd want pick 37 sent this way. I think there will be some desirable long-shots still on the board at 37, with my favorite being a draft-and-stash in Europe of Kamagate, and 37 is not too high for a player to be handed a two-way that doesn't eat up a roster slot.
https://www.hawksquawk.net/topic/435676-.../#comments

Eh, maybe he knows stuff or maybe it is all made up.  Entertainment purposes only.

Mavs: Mavs have had extreme interest in Capela, Turner, and high interest in Gobert. I clearly expect Dallas to upgrade the center position. What Dallas wants to improve most is the secondary scorer to Luka. They are targeting Zach LaVine as their priority target as well as resigning Jalen Brunson. Dallas wants to make a splash. Another player I’ve heard they want to make a run at, Tyler Herro.
My biggest problem with Barnes is if he is taking a big shot at an important time, I think he is missing.  That may not be fair, but that is how I feel.   That is why I was fine moving him when we did.   Looking back, I wish we were able to take more advantage of his cap savings.

I am not tied to the first round pick.  But I hope we keep it unless it is a part of a no brainer type of trade.  Pick # 26 is by no means a sure thing.  If fact, it is probably more likely the pick doesn't work out.  But I really want to see how this new regime treats the draft.   We may never get the full picture, but I think we can read into things a little.  Even if they missed this pick, but hit on a pick next year (I know they don't have a pick next year at this time) it would be such a welcomed move.   Finding a guy on a rookie contract who fits into your future is what this team needs to invest in.  Even if that player may need a year or two to develop in your system.
(06-03-2022, 07:13 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]My biggest problem with Barnes is if he is taking a big shot at an important time, I think he is missing.  That may not be fair, but that is how I feel.   That is why I was fine moving him when we did.
Even if how you feel is true, he is so much further down the list of guys taking those shots that it will rarely happen. Also, him spending time away from the 1st option role has done him a lot if good and he seems like he’s found comfortability in the role he’s at (3rd-4th option with the starters). I myself want him as the starting big wing/closing C. I think he’d do well in that role for the most part.
(06-02-2022, 08:09 PM)Hypermav Wrote: [ -> ]https://www.hawksquawk.net/topic/435676-.../#comments

Eh, maybe he knows stuff or maybe it is all made up.  Entertainment purposes only.

Mavs: Mavs have had extreme interest in Capela, Turner, and high interest in Gobert. I clearly expect Dallas to upgrade the center position. What Dallas wants to improve most is the secondary scorer to Luka. They are targeting Zach LaVine as their priority target as well as resigning Jalen Brunson. Dallas wants to make a splash. Another player I’ve heard they want to make a run at, Tyler Herro.

Capella seems tough to me.  Atlanta is in a similar position to Dallas.  They don’t need picks.  They need to consolidate resources to get rid of ill-fitting pieces to upgrade at least one position.  I don’t see what we have that helps them.

LaVine has to be a S&T.  I see no path to him AND resigning Brunson.  Herro is at least technically legal.  Is he the two-way back court mate we are looking for in a big splash off-season move?  Obviously no on the defensive side.  Is the ”O” good enough to make up for the defensive deficiencies?  Maybe.  I can see Miami wanting to move him now rather than pay him a year from now (Schwartz).  But, for what?  Maybe some of what we get from NY in an expanded S&T for Brunson?  Otherwise, I don’t see Dallas having nearly enough.  BTW, I think Yurtseven is an interesting center prospect.
Maybe I'm misisng something but what's technically wrong with S&T Brunson at 20 for Robinson at 12.5 then moving Burks into the TE? Obviously apron but that seems straighforward by moving THJ to Detroit, Orlando or a similar team with space. No advolcating for this deal but someone above said it violates "all kinds of rules" so ...?
The price for moving THJ would be prohibitive.

Signing Brunson and keeping him, then not pursuing anything that triggers the Hard Cap is the best way to go. This is about building assets: Signing and Trading Brunson which then puts a Hard Cap on the payroll is counterintuitive to that process.

Use the TE, Sign Brunson then figure out how to best use THJ as a trade piece or as a rotation player. I personally like the idea of THJ/Bullock at one wing with Bullock/DFS at the other, but I also see that being a very expensive rotation.

I like the 3 Guards; I like our Wings; I like Maxi;

I don't like Powell as a starter; I don't like Bullock/Maxi pulling 40+ mpg; I don't like how much Maxi has to do as a 2-way player.

AND I don't like how Boston is showing how much further we need to improve this rotation in order to compete at the highest level making this run appearing as a flash rather than a foundation.
Was pointed to this site, it's a pretty small sample, but maybe Turner is what he is rebounding.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/myles-t...since-2019

Shooting helps, but I'm pretty sure a guy like Robert Williams would be great. Great at both perimeter/paint D, rebounding and lob threat with no outside game. Powell has always been undersized and can't jump anymore since the achilles. He's never been a guy to really posterize people even pre-injury. Haven't seen what Luka is like with a guy that dunks over people yet. If it were up to me I'd say deal with the negative PR and get Jaxson Hayes. Lobs aren't as good in the playoffs as initial actions but they're always there after things become scrambled.
Lavine seems like a chimera to me frankly... but what about Beal? It shouldn't cost a lot of assets...the Wizards have a good young core and I guess they should take a step back... They are also good business partners of ours. Brunson(ST)85x4?/THJ/Green at Wizards.
T.Bryant/Beal to Mavs (or ideally Gafford)
(06-03-2022, 03:24 PM)Mikelorenzo Wrote: [ -> ]Lavine seems like a chimera to me frankly... but what about Beal? It shouldn't cost a lot of assets...the Wizards have a good young core and I guess they should take a step back... They are also good business partners of ours. Brunson(ST)85x4?/THJ/Green at Wizards.
T.Bryant/Beal to Mavs (or ideally Gafford)

Why would Beal not cost a lot of assets?  Don't think that would be near enough.

I feel like guys like Lavine and Beal are not the kind of guys we should be targeting.  The best fit with Luka would be a legit two way player that can reduce his burden offensively and help cover for his limitations defensively.  If we are going to spend all of our assets and cap space for a player, I would rather it be that 2 way player than one of those offense only guys.
(06-03-2022, 03:24 PM)Mikelorenzo Wrote: [ -> ]Lavine seems like a chimera to me frankly... but what about Beal? It shouldn't cost a lot of assets...the Wizards have a good young core and I guess they should take a step back... They are also good business partners of ours. Brunson(ST)85x4?/THJ/Green at Wizards.
T.Bryant/Beal to Mavs (or ideally Gafford)
TBH, I'm a little gunshy on Beal. No issues with his game or abilities. Just that he's been the lead dog for a while and might not like playing #1A or #2 to Luka. I worry that we get back into another KP-type discontent.
If I published Beal...because of the rumors that we were chasing Lavine and I felt that it would be "easier to get" more major, he comes from being injured, his team is mediocre and he is about to sign an albatross contract (which he does not deserve)... I would also prefer a star level 2-way type (Anunoby/Siakam/Ayton...etc) but I am aware that if they were even remotely available, our offer would not be competitive and easily beaten by at least 10/15 teams...per that I think we can only hope to improve by taking risks (KP)/Hayward/Isaak? or assuming an albatross contract..Harris/Gobert.. If it was up to me, go after Gobert
(06-03-2022, 04:34 PM)michaeltex Wrote: [ -> ]TBH, I'm a little gunshy on Beal. No issues with his game or abilities. Just that he's been the lead dog for a while and might not like playing #1A or #2 to Luka. I worry that we get back into another KP-type discontent.

Also Beal was rumored to be one of the main guys that didn't like Dinwiddie when he was there. I would be very worried about chemistry if we put them back in the same locker room.