(05-24-2022, 11:56 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]I´m not the biggest fan of Tobias Harris. He´s a steady player. He plays as the team does. He´s just not a difference maker for that kind of money. He escaped a lot of criticism due to Simmons/Harden, but for $40M i expect you to step up and in occasionally to carry the team, when you are needed.
He didn´t do it in Philly, I doubt it would be any different here, but I don´t hate the Harris for THJ/Bertans trade for cap cleaning purposes.
We´d get off $33M a year earlier. If you want to make a big trade for say Lillard in the summer of 2023, it doesn´t hurt to already have the hypothetical 2024 max slot in place.
If its really THJ/Bertans for Harris, you have to pull that trigger. Harris is the best player in the deal and you are getting cap relief. I'm skeptical we could get him for that cheap.
(05-24-2022, 10:37 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]I also agree Bullock is a keeper. He is one of the few main cogs that allows us to play the way we do. If anything we should be looking to add on that type of player archetype, not get rid of him for an injured guy and Josh Green 2.0.
Is Jae Crowder for the TPE a viable thing or will it be expired by the time the Mavs can realisticaly make a deal?
The TPE expires June 27. Crowder salary fits into it, sizewise. But whether he is actually a good candidate depends on PHX -- I don't know that PHX is looking to move him, and likely they would want value in return if they did. Although who knows, maybe they need to reduce salary in order to pay Ayton, where "salary reduction" is the value.
(05-24-2022, 11:49 AM)VintagePejav2 Wrote: [ -> ]The TPE expires at the end of the league year. They can use it at the draft, a typical spot for trades before the new league year and free agency opens.
More and more, I think the Mavs should try to absorb another veteran wing into the TPE. Crowder, Alec Burks, Royce O’Neale, Justin Holiday, and a couple of others could fit.
This seems like a likely avenue they might pursue, where they swap pick 26 for _____ (a player already able to fill a hole) and the TPE is used instead of a player match. I like your list.
Another avenue for TPE would be if you could swap Powell for Richaun Holmes. You're letting SAC get off of salary if they want to go in a different direction. If you can get Holmes to waive part of his kicker, where he fits the TPE, then you use the old one but get a new one (expiring June 2023) and it's an even bigger TPE. The same concept would work if you swapped Powell rather than a pick for Crowder or Burks on your list, or for other matching salary player less than 10.8M.
(05-24-2022, 02:35 PM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]If its really THJ/Bertans for Harris, you have to pull that trigger. Harris is the best player in the deal and you are getting cap relief. I'm skeptical we could get him for that cheap.
I'm not convinced Harris is the best value in that deal. He is a guy paid $40M who isn't an impact player at all. I just don't want to commit 40M to that.
Depth is an issue, and you need your 40M to provide 2 players at least. Unless you get a real game-changer. He isn't.
I would much rather try to send one or the other and get back a player who can help who is making 15-20M. A variation of another Bullock or DFS, 3 and D, but maybe a bit overpaid? Need someone who can shoot 3s. Maybe include pick 26 if needed.
In the meantime, I utilize these 2 guys and try to coach them up into better versions of themselves. I think either or both could potentially have way more trade value at the TDL. Don't think Harris ever will.
(05-24-2022, 06:01 PM)F Gump Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not convinced Harris is the best value in that deal. He is a guy paid $40M who isn't an impact player at all. I just don't want to commit 40M to that.
Depth is an issue, and you need your 40M to provide 2 players at least. Unless you get a real game-changer. He isn't.
I would much rather try to send one or the other and get back a player who can help who is making 15-20M. A variation of another Bullock or DFS, 3 and D, but maybe a bit overpaid? Need someone who can shoot 3s. Maybe include pick 26 if needed.
In the meantime, I utilize these 2 guys and try to coach them up into better versions of themselves. I think either or both could potentially have way more trade value at the TDL. Don't think Harris ever will.
Without retooling the offense, Bertans is dead weight. I also think we've seen the best and worst of Dinwiddie. This is not an endorsement for Harris but I can't say I'd hate the idea of the swap, especially if you can get off of Bertans money sooner.
(05-24-2022, 06:01 PM)F Gump Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not convinced Harris is the best value in that deal. He is a guy paid $40M who isn't an impact player at all. I just don't want to commit 40M to that.
Depth is an issue, and you need your 40M to provide 2 players at least. Unless you get a real game-changer. He isn't.
I would much rather try to send one or the other and get back a player who can help who is making 15-20M. A variation of another Bullock or DFS, 3 and D, but maybe a bit overpaid? Need someone who can shoot 3s. Maybe include pick 26 if needed.
In the meantime, I utilize these 2 guys and try to coach them up into better versions of themselves. I think either or both could potentially have way more trade value at the TDL. Don't think Harris ever will.
Nobody said he is the best value, but he is the best player. He would be basically replacing the minutes you are getting from THJ and Bertans combined, only with better defense and better offense. One of the themes of this playoffs is that we don't seem to have enough guys that can do anything offensively other that shoot open shots. He would be a big help in this area. Also, if we are going to go with small ball centers in the future, adding his size and rebounding would be a bonus.
Is he over paid? Of course. But he probably provides more value than THJ and Bertans combined and will cost less long term cap. Its hard to argue with that.
(05-24-2022, 05:06 PM)F Gump Wrote: [ -> ]The TPE expires June 27. Crowder salary fits into it, sizewise. But whether he is actually a good candidate depends on PHX -- I don't know that PHX is looking to move him, and likely they would want value in return if they did. Although who knows, maybe they need to reduce salary in order to pay Ayton, where "salary reduction" is the value.
Saric is the only guy that makes some sense for our TPE. They don´t give up Crowder and I hope nobody is even entertaining the idea of Payne.
(05-25-2022, 12:11 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]Saric is the only guy that makes some sense for our TPE.
I think Saric could be a nice addition. He is a good player. Holmes is the other option imho. Not much that makes sense after that either for us or for the "giving" team, imho.
I don't see how Saric fills a need for this team, he's basically another Bertans. That would be a really disappointing use of our TPE.
(05-25-2022, 02:59 AM)Branduil Wrote: [ -> ]I don't see how Saric fills a need for this team, he's basically another Bertans. That would be a really disappointing use of our TPE.
Saric is much more physical than Bertans. He can put it on the floor, finish inside, take it coast-to-coast and is a great passer, while Bertans is just a far superior shooter, but Saric is damn clutch.
To be honest I think Saric has been one of the most mis-used players in the league. Just look at his pre-NBA highlights
(05-25-2022, 03:40 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]Saric is much more physical than Bertans. He can put it on the floor, finish inside, take it coast-to-coast and is a great passer, while Bertans is just a far superior shooter, but Saric is damn clutch.
To be honest I think Saric has been one of the most mis-used players in the league. Just look at his pre-NBA highlights
He's also coming off an ACL injury and didn't play a game this season. And the last time he played he averaged an amazing 0.1 bpg, didn't know it was possible to have bpg that low as a 6'10" guy. Not much of a rebounder either. So whether he's better than Bertans or not, he'd be playing the same role, and he'd require another rim-protector on the floor with him. If we're gonna save Sarver money he needs to sweeten the pot, and add a late-1st pick at minimum.
(05-25-2022, 03:40 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]Saric is much more physical than Bertans. He can put it on the floor, finish inside, take it coast-to-coast and is a great passer, while Bertans is just a far superior shooter, but Saric is damn clutch.
To be honest I think Saric has been one of the most mis-used players in the league. Just look at his pre-NBA highlights
I like Saric and he would fit the Mavs style. If the Mavs could get the 20/21 small ball center version it would be a steal but trading for injured players is always risky.
Would add that Saric is an underrated defender. Obviously not a rim protector but once the Suns started to use him exclusively at center his on/off numbers looked great. In 20/21 the Suns defense was 4.5 points better with him on the floor. If he hasn´t lost his mobility he would fit into Kidd´s switch and rotation heavy scheme
dirkfansince1998 Wrote:I like Saric and he would fit the Mavs style. If the Mavs could get the 20/21 small ball center version it would be a steal but trading for injured players is always risky.
Would add that Saric is an underrated defender. Obviously not a rim protector but once the Suns started to use him exclusively at center his on/off numbers looked great. In 20/21 the Suns defense was 4.5 points better with him on the floor. If he hasn´t lost his mobility he would fit into Kidd´s switch and rotation heavy scheme
Yeah it´s a risk, but not really, since it´s an expiring contract, too. Ideally though you don´t use the TPE, but rather salaries to get some cap and luxury tax relief. And there is a strategic component to such acquisitions, too. Saric will be 29 years old, so if he´s healthy, he still has a good 3-4 years at the top level left. He´s not such a high demand player that he´ll be expensive or is likely to bail on the Mavs. So basically you can test him, and if he succeeds you have a valuable roleplayer in his prime. Call it the Bobby Portis special.
Since I believe this will tie into the Ayton extension, maybe you can even get a pick out of this considering that he´s still injured as we speak and might not be available at the start of the next season.
(05-24-2022, 11:49 AM)VintagePejav2 Wrote: [ -> ]More and more, I think the Mavs should try to absorb another veteran wing into the TPE. Crowder, Alec Burks, Royce O’Neale, Justin Holiday, and a couple of others could fit.
Don't forget about THJ. Veteran wing who arguably better than all the guys you listed. Obviously very different than a guy like Crowder but if team's are going to zone up against Dallas and concede open looks you really need another guy who can knock down open shots. THJ is streaky but he's a zone buster if he can stay on the floor defensively.
(05-25-2022, 09:46 AM)vfromlmf Wrote: [ -> ]Don't forget about THJ. Veteran wing who arguably better than all the guys you listed. Obviously very different than a guy like Crowder but if team's are going to zone up against Dallas and concede open looks you really need another guy who can knock down open shots. THJ is streaky but he's a zone buster if he can stay on the floor defensively.
That last sentence is the kicker. Their defense seems predicated on 2 defensive wings (Dorian, Bullock, Green, Frank) and a defensive center (Maxi). During the regular season the Maxi/Dorian/Bullock grouping had a defensive rating of 102 (and 111 offense). The other two players need to handle the offensive load including creating for themselves and others (Luka, Brunson, Dinwiddie). Dinwiddie kind of took over Timmy's role as one of the two offensive guys on the court. While Tim is a way better shooter, I think Din's ability to get to the rim and playmaking make him a little more valuable in that 6th man role.
This is why I think the primary goals this offseason (other than re-signing Brunson) is getting a defensive center to help out Maxi, and getting another 3&D who can help out Dorian and Bullock (possibly through internal development with Green/Frank).
The long term goal should be to get a legit 2 way wing that can play the Bullock role on defense but provide offensive creation. Ironically when they get that player Timmy would be a much better fit.
(05-25-2022, 11:33 AM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]The long term goal should be to get a legit 2 way wing that can play the Bullock role on defense but provide offensive creation
I know this doesn't solve the 2-way portion of it, but if we're looking for a wing that can create on offense and is overpaid, why not Gordon Hayward?
Dude can't stay healthy, but Charlotte needs to do something there if they want to retain Bridges. Despite his lack of health he's still a 16ppg scorer on near 46/40/85 efficiency.
And I can definitely see Charlotte being interested in a guy like Powell. Perhaps the Mavs can wrangle PJ Washington in the deal as compensation for taking on Hayward.
Really well said mvossman, I think we're on the same page. But you see what happens when you have two one-dimensional shooters on the floor. Teams will zone up and dare them to make threes. Live by the three, die by the three. I agree this team, as constructed, needs two strong wing defenders but guys like Crowder and Royce O'Neal seem like more of the same.
I 100% agree swapping Green+Ntilikina minutes for a tough vet who can also give DFS-Bullock a rest would help but I'm not sure it moves the needle dramatically. Would those guys shoot a higher percentage if given 30 MPG rather than 40 MPG? I don't think so. Dorian is already at 43% and Bullock at 40% for the playoffs. It's live by the three, die by the three.
I think we all see some development from DFS with regard to attacking closeouts but it feels a little like a rodeo when he goes to the bucket. Reggie doesn't like to dribble. Green can get to the rim but struggles finishing and shoots like his eyes are closed. Ntilikina is a circus with the ball. Internal development is ideal but I honestly think THJ is the best, most likely option, unless he's traded of course.
(05-25-2022, 12:19 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]I know this doesn't solve the 2-way portion of it, but if we're looking for a wing that can create on offense and is overpaid, why not Gordon Hayward?
Dude can't stay healthy, but Charlotte needs to do something there if they want to retain Bridges. Despite his lack of health he's still a 16ppg scorer on near 46/40/85 efficiency.
And I can definitely see Charlotte being interested in a guy like Powell. Perhaps the Mavs can wrangle PJ Washington in the deal as compensation for taking on Hayward.
I wanted to trade KP for Hayward last offseason. He is in a similar category with Tobias Harris as an over paid wing with size and a good offensive game that wont kill you defensively. A cheaper contract, but he has way more injury concerns. I could see him overtake Bullock spot in the starting lineup and make the offense way more dynamic without too much drop off defensively. Maybe something like THJ + Powell? Maybe they toss in PJ Washington and we toss in the pick? That would be a very productive offseason.
On the bright side only four weeks until the draft and five until free agency. So much better when your season doesn´t end in April.
