(01-09-2023, 02:36 PM)cow Wrote: [ -> ]There is a camp here that believes this is a salary clearing move and that's a bummer for a few reasons. First confirming that Cuban is a cheapskate. Second is the long running issue of acquiring talent only to not use them or jettison them for greener pastures at the first opportunity (DAJ, KP, Curry, Richardson, Wright, McGee, etc.) with real possibilities of Wood and THJ. I get basketball is a business but business is a two-way street. It's probably a huge factor for why JB wanted out. Mavs loyalty would remain with Doncic, rightfully so, but no one else and he'd get flipped at the first opportunity.
I really don't like THJ the player or his contract, but he's a standup dude that wants to be here and that is something that shouldn't be taken for granted. If you are trading him just to trade him, that's a bummer.
Im the biggest THJ hater on this forum...
All the dude has to do is show his willingness to not be selfish and I would have no problem with him here.
Time after time after time after time he proves he is blinded by getting his.
All the dude has to do to change everything is show that he isnt about getting his and he wouldnt have as many haters.
Its simple to fix but he wont do it. So its all on him.
(01-09-2023, 02:16 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]I agree. I would not give up Hardy though. I have him #2 behind Luka in my most important guys moving forward (Green #3 and Wood #4). I may be way off and Hardy may be gone in two years but having him and Green hit to a certain degree is really important to this franchise.
Would the Cavs have any interest in Bullock? What about a deal centered around Bullock and Okoro? Or Bullock and Rubio? Probably not, but wouldn't a good shooting Bullock be a fit on that team?
I'm not as high on Hardy as most are. He's a one-dimensional player, and they have plenty of those. If they can get a more well-rounded player, like a 2-way wing who's not over 30, he's gone.
To be fair, getting his is his job. And we paid him for his body of work in Atlanta, New York and with us. Expecting something different seems foolish (not you but the MBT). I also take issue with not being considered the biggest THJ hater.
(01-09-2023, 03:14 PM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not as high on Hardy as most are. He's a one-dimensional player, and they have plenty of those. If they can get a more well-rounded player, like a 2-way wing who's not over 30, he's gone.
Counterpoint: Hardy can dribble and is dirt cheap.
(01-09-2023, 03:19 PM)cow Wrote: [ -> ]Counterpoint: Hardy can dribble and is dirt cheap.
Ok There are plenty of players that can dribble and are cheap. What else is he good at? Not understanding your point here. All he looks to do is shoot the ball. They have enough of those.
(01-09-2023, 03:26 PM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: [ -> ]Ok There are plenty of players that can dribble and are cheap. What else is he good at? Not understanding your point here. All he looks to do is shoot the ball. They have enough of those.
Hardy is the only player on the team that can dribble, shoot the ball and is dirt cheap. If you trade him for that would-be more well rounded player, they are going to fall out of at least one of those categories (dirt cheap) if not more. We need developmental players with upside on the roster and he and Green are it right now.
(01-09-2023, 02:31 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I'd prefer the "dumps" to be guys who aren't useful rotation pieces like McGee and Bertans, and both Bullock and Dinwiddie would be preferable ship outs from among the rotation players
To me the fact that they're actively shopping Hardaway as opposed to the others kind of telegraphs what the plan is and is what many of us have been saying for a while. This season was always going to be a transition season until we finally got off the KP trade so that we can finally have the flexibility to restructure the roster without mortgaging wayyyyy out into the future. After they signed the DFS and Maxi extensions I felt like it became pretty clear that they had created this hierarchy of importance to keep this season as they restructure everything:
Our Lord and Savior:
Luka
Most important assets to hold through this trade deadline:
Green/Hardy/FRPs
Role players they defined as keepers:
Maxi/DFS
To me it was pretty clear that anyone else in our rotation not in this list would not be on our team past either this offseason or next season's trade deadline. Hopefully Wood gets extended so it becomes clear where he sits in the eyes of the front office and I wouldn't be surprised if Powell is another exception.
If you keep those parameters in mind, Bertans and McGee can't be shopped very easily without attaching a pick so I assume those deals are a no go. Dinwiddie and Bullock are still the front runners with their 30 mil in expiring next season to get paired with all our picks to do a MAJOR reconstruction of this roster this offseason so Hardaway is the obvious candidate in terms of someone who is good enough to the point where we can work to get off his contract without attaching other assets. Would it be nice to get a long term piece we think fits? Absolutely! But if they view Wood as a long term piece that fits (as I do) then the thinking may very well be we need to move this contract just to keep Wood, which I'm ok with.
(01-09-2023, 02:31 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I wouldn't expect them to sign and trade LaVert this summer
Also to be clear, I would fully expect us to lose him for nothing as well. Wasn't sure if I made it sounds like that when I said he would be somewhere else. Just a very intentional move to make room for Wood while also getting something to help us through this playoff run and then adios.
(01-09-2023, 03:14 PM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not as high on Hardy as most are. He's a one-dimensional player, and they have plenty of those. If they can get a more well-rounded player, like a 2-way wing who's not over 30, he's gone.
We will see. You may be right and I am overrating him. Right now, I don't expect many favorable outings if he does not make his shots. But hopefully we continue to see him get minutes. My ideal vision is giving him 6 minutes late first/early second. If he plays well, he gets more minutes and some run in the second half.
I don't expect his development to be a rocket ship. There will be plenty of bumps. But seeing gradual improvement and then seeing things click is really fun to watch. Lets hope that is his development.
Long term, I see him as a guy who is going to average at least 20 a game if he gets 30 minutes a game. It is the rest of his game he will really need to improve to be able to get those 30 minutes. I view him as a guy who is going to score against good NBA defenses and not reliant on others to do so.
His development will be different from Green. It took Green until this year to feel like he really belongs on the court (this is a great development imo). I think Hardy thinks he already belongs. There is a balance there though.
(01-09-2023, 03:33 PM)cow Wrote: [ -> ]Hardy is the only player on the team that can dribble, shoot the ball and is dirt cheap. If you trade him for that would-be more well rounded player, they are going to fall out of at least one of those categories (dirt cheap) if not more. We need developmental players with upside on the roster and he and Green are it right now.
Ok fair enough. Cuban probably isn't going to make any moves to bring in better talent anyway.
(01-09-2023, 06:45 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: [ -> ]Not bad by Dalton Trigg...
I just cannot get excited about a soon to be 34 year old whose on/off is -3.9 while playing on a 11-32 team. Fool's gold IMO. Maybe for a straight swap for THJ, but not with FN and 2nds attached.
I just don't see that trade as viable as the Cavs prefer Bojan to Tim anyway and Detroit wants an unprotected FRP. If Detroit is willing to take less, they'd probably just cut the Mavs out of the deal.
If Turner isn't extended (and most recent reports say those talks have gotten shut down by Turner), gotta expect Indy will trade him.
Wood (almost a match) for Turner?
Wood/Hardaway for Turner/Hield?
We were never going to pay the tax next season. It makes too much sense not to when the years leading up to Luka signing his next extension we will need to spend big to stay competitive and avoid losing him. We can’t go all in every year. Need to look at it long term and do this the right way
It makes the most sense for a team with limited assets to max out the value of those assets by trading them at their peak. Buy low sell high and all. Luka, Green, Hardy plus Maxi and DFS is who we try to keep and add to. THJ, Bertans, Bullock and McGee are the guys to move. Out of those THJ is the only one that’s playing close to peak levels. He’s the guy. There’s not enough time for Bertans or Bullock to build up enough value. All of these players are over 30 so it’s not like any are long term. Hardaway having neutral value and able to be swapped for Levert expiring would be a miracle compared to where his value was. THJ is a great guy and has worked hard. It sucks but we need players with different skills than his capabilities. Wood is more important on both ends. It’s a needed sacrifice and it would free up space for Powell to re-sign at a lower rate. We could have flexibility for real moves at a time when we get all our draft picks freed up. If we got any compensation from Cleveland it would be a home run. Levert would give us a similar chance this season. Having his bird rights on top of that is gravy.
Holding onto Hardaway too long is a ticking time bomb where we could be stuck with a negative contract until it expires. That’s riskier IMO than gambling on half a season of Levert. Hardaway is on the wrong side of 30 and injury prone
(01-09-2023, 07:40 PM)F Gump Wrote: [ -> ]If Turner isn't extended (and most recent reports say those talks have gotten shut down by Turner), gotta expect Indy will trade him.
Wood/Hardaway for Turner/Hield?
Or fold in the Cleveland rumor and send Indy two expiring deals
I don't think Indy would be prioritizing cap room. They already have scads. Instead I am figuring their angle would be what might be seen as a better path to their future.
But the revision question might be, who would the Mavs prefer, between Hardaway, Levert, and Hield? I'm guessing that's not an obvious question to answer.
For those who think the way Wood has been “brought along” was “genius”
How genius is it that we have seen 0 games of our best lineups half way through the season and 1 month away from the deadline?
(01-09-2023, 08:09 PM)Jason Terry Wrote: [ -> ]We were never going to pay the tax next season. It makes too much sense not to when the years leading up to Luka signing his next extension we will need to spend big to stay competitive and avoid losing him. We can’t go all in every year. Need to look at it long term and do this the right way
It makes the most sense for a team with limited assets to max out the value of those assets by trading them at their peak. Buy low sell high and all. Luka, Green, Hardy plus Maxi and DFS is who we try to keep and add to. THJ, Bertans, Bullock and McGee are the guys to move. Out of those THJ is the only one that’s playing close to peak levels. He’s the guy. There’s not enough time for Bertans or Bullock to build up enough value. All of these players are over 30 so it’s not like any are long term. Hardaway having neutral value and able to be swapped for Levert expiring would be a miracle compared to where his value was. THJ is a great guy and has worked hard. It sucks but we need players with different skills than his capabilities. Wood is more important on both ends. It’s a needed sacrifice and it would free up space for Powell to re-sign at a lower rate. We could have flexibility for real moves at a time when we get all our draft picks freed up. If we got any compensation from Cleveland it would be a home run. Levert would give us a similar chance this season. Having his bird rights on top of that is gravy.
Holding onto Hardaway too long is a ticking time bomb where we could be stuck with a negative contract until it expires. That’s riskier IMO than gambling on half a season of Levert. Hardaway is on the wrong side of 30 and injury prone
Agreed 110%.
If the expiring money helps to re-sign Wood and a justified amount goes to DP, this trade is good enough for me
(01-09-2023, 08:38 PM)IamDougieFresh Wrote: [ -> ]For those who think the way Wood has been “brought along” was “genius”
How genius is it that we have seen 0 games of our best lineups half way through the season and 1 month away from the deadline?
And it took injuries for Maxi and DP to start him.
Add to the fact that, it took a couple of games before Benedict took out Joel form the rotation.
Yes he did adjust, but doesn't mean what he did had no effects in team wins and a Wood re-sign/extension.