(01-09-2021, 02:58 PM)MFFL Wrote: [ -> ]Are you sure Collins DIDN'T discuss it directly? Maybe Young blew him off so Collins took the next step
Sorry misunderstood your post the first time. This could have happened of course, we dont know thus. He should go to the coach directly. That is not only the next step. This should be the first and only step. If the coach tells him, he does not agree with Collins, then I think he should either agree with coach and continue to play for the same coach, or demand a trade. Throwing Young and the coach under the bus to say that under team meeting, is not what a good teammate does. If he does not agree with the coach strategy and style of play, and it is coaches decision to go with Young in that manner, he can leave the team and ask for a trade. But one can do that in much better style and respect for the team, instead of creating a bad situation for Hawks. This is what he has done now and hurts the franchise.
We need good teammates when we have some losses, and deal with issues better than what Collins did.
The whole thing is Collins not agreeing with coach strategy of him being less involved. Then he should talk to the coach directly, this is the only correct thing to do. Next best thing is to discuss with Trae directly and private about this issue. And the third and worst thing is to involve the entire franchise and media (of course it leaks out after such a meeting, so many hear that). This has hurt Trae, the coach, and everyone in the team and the fans now as well. Collins should have spoken to the coach and instead of hurting the franchise, asked for a trade without making a big thing about it.
(01-09-2021, 04:11 PM)burekemde Wrote: [ -> ]We need good teammates when we have some losses, and deal with issues better than what Collins did.
I really think you're blowing a single incident wildly out of proportion. Yes Collins told Young he wants to be featured more. What's wrong with that? Collins feels he can do more on this team. He told Young that him launching the ball early in the shotclock and how they don't run offensive sets leaves him feeling like he's on the outside looking in.
Its okay for a player to want to be more involved on offense. That falls on the coach for managing touches and how the offense operates. One can be like Steph Curry, whose usage% has been in the high 30s for the last 6 years, and no one dare says he doesn't get people involved. Or one can be like Harden, where its 1 player holding the ball and the rest are statues filled with iso possessions.
Young is trending towards Harden. Collins doesn't like that. Can we blame him? Especially because Collins is a really really good player and to not use him would be a mistake. It's akin to the 7SOL Suns not using Amare or Marion because Nash wanted to shoot more 40ft threes.
(01-09-2021, 04:11 PM)burekemde Wrote: [ -> ]Collins should have spoken to the coach and instead of hurting the franchise, asked for a trade without making a big thing about it.
Also I'm really shocked that you think this entire blowup is on Collins, not Trae. Collins asked his star PG, you know the one who runs the offense and has the ball the most out of everyone, if he can run more offensive sets for him.
Trae in response decides to straight up quit on his team, and voice his displeasure about the coach. The leaks obviously came from someone within the roster. We don't know who leaked it, but given that Collins has just reiterated that Trae is his brother, and that the story includes a conversation with Capela and Trae that only Capela would know, I can assume Collins ISNT the leaker. Further, KOC from the Ringer said that this isn't the first time there have been rumblings from players in ATL that say they do not like to play with Trae. I wonder why that is?
Who is worse, the person bringing up the problems, even though there are better ways to bring it up? Or the person who refuses to fix the problems?
(01-09-2021, 03:31 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, that's what I'm struggling with, too. Maybe @"DrMav" can help us make sense of this?
I don’t know that there’s much that makes sense of how sports leagues are conducting their seasons from a medical sense.
The CDC still recommends 14 day quarantines for individuals who have close contact with someone COVID positive, and they way they define close contact is any of the following:
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Being within 6 feet for 15 minutes or more
- Providing care at home to someone infected
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Having direct physical contact with someone infected
- Sharing eating/drinking utensils
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They sneezed, coughed, or got respiratory droplets on you
The 2 bolded above seems really easy for an NBA team or their competitor to fall victim to, and the italicized seems like it could happen as guys are huffing and puffing during a game though I think could be more up to interpretation. For example at my hospital if you are on supplemental oxygen, there is a certain threshold of delivered oxygen that if you are above would be considered “aerosol generating” due to the higher flow, and thus different PPE is used due to the thought that it is a potentially higher infectious opportunity. I think you could consider an NBA player heavily breathing to be more likely contagious as their respiratory particles will travel further due to higher force of breathing.
Ultimately to me, the way the NBA, NFL, MLB, and soon to be NHL are doing things is about putting on enough of an appearance that they are doing things as safe as possible, while not following recommendations closely enough that playing their season would be completely impossible.
(01-09-2021, 05:21 PM)DrMav Wrote: [ -> ]Ultimately to me, the way the NBA, NFL, MLB, and soon to be NHL are doing things is about putting on enough of an appearance that they are doing things as safe as possible, while not following recommendations closely enough that playing their season would be completely impossible.
Ok...so money is the answer. Forge ahead, no matter what.
I would guess that's probably why extra roster spots weren't added, too. The players are already giving up so much income with the escrow money for this season they'll never get. My completely uneducated guess is that 2-3 extra spots per team, even at the minimum, might have meant they miss out on even more. It's not like adding players creates added revenue, and 50% is 50%, no matter how many ways you split it.
(01-09-2021, 05:29 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Ok...so money is the answer. Forge ahead, no matter what.
I would guess that's probably why extra roster spots weren't added, too. The players are already giving up so much income with the escrow money for this season they'll never get. My completely uneducated guess is that 2-3 extra spots per team, even at the minimum, might have meant they miss out on even more. It's not like adding players creates added revenue, and 50% is 50%, no matter how many ways you split it.
Yeah, absolutely all about the money I think. I know they lost a lot this year and want to make sure the league doesn’t get to a spot it can’t recover.
I wonder if a bubble(s) system was turned down because the players didn’t want to have to do that again, because it actually cost the NBA a lot of money, or both.
The NBA is going to have a much tougher time getting games played as they aren't in the bubble anymore. Teams are flying city to city so there is more potential exposure to Covid.
(01-09-2021, 05:46 PM)DrMav Wrote: [ -> ]I wonder if a bubble(s) system was turned down because the players didn’t want to have to do that again, because it actually cost the NBA a lot of money, or both.
Both, I think, but especially the latter. It might've been impossible, given that all 30 teams would be involved and it would cover a much larger period of time.
(01-09-2021, 05:09 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]Who is worse, the person bringing up the problems, even though there are better ways to bring it up? Or the person who refuses to fix the problems?
Im not sure you understood my point.
I was never questioning Collins actual reasoning of the issue. He is absolutely right, the strategy they currently run is perhaps not the best. The main problem is the actual manner he tried to solve this issue. This he did in completely wrong and selfish way, exposing the entire franchise. Instead of going to the coaches and making his point, arguing why he has a point etc. and why his proposed strategy would be better for the team compared to the current tactics the coach is running now (featuring heavy use of Trae). This would have been the correct way by a teammate to do this. A private discussion with the coach. Keep in mind Trae is not doing this by his own, it is the coach that asks Trae how to run the offense. This is head coachs matter. Not Trae Youngs.
Instead, Collins is making a huge mess, throwing the coach as well as Trae Young under the bus in front of everyone else. He assumed the role of a coach, which he is not. He made that point while everyone else was there in the room, completely disrespecting the coach. And Trae Young as well.
This is not the way to do this. Collins is not the coach. He can suggest new strategies to his coach privately, some good ideas, and hope he can make a point to the coach that he agrees with. This would be a private way dealing with this. If coach agreed, he could change the scheme and listen to Collins. Adapt the tactics. If done in this way, Trae would have respected this way as well. Public would never know. Fans would not be upset. The image of Hawks and Trae Young not hurt.
Trae's response to all that was just as big a failure, sure. He acted completely wrong as well.
So, both of them are not acting properly as teammates. Neither of theose two are championship players. They have some talent, but are lacking leadership, character and maturity.
(01-09-2021, 04:11 PM)burekemde Wrote: [ -> ]Sorry misunderstood your post the first time. This could have happened of course, we dont know thus. He should go to the coach directly. That is not only the next step. This should be the first and only step. If the coach tells him, he does not agree with Collins, then I think he should either agree with coach and continue to play for the same coach, or demand a trade. Throwing Young and the coach under the bus to say that under team meeting, is not what a good teammate does. If he does not agree with the coach strategy and style of play, and it is coaches decision to go with Young in that manner, he can leave the team and ask for a trade. But one can do that in much better style and respect for the team, instead of creating a bad situation for Hawks. This is what he has done now and hurts the franchise.
We need good teammates when we have some losses, and deal with issues better than what Collins did.
The whole thing is Collins not agreeing with coach strategy of him being less involved. Then he should talk to the coach directly, this is the only correct thing to do. Next best thing is to discuss with Trae directly and private about this issue. And the third and worst thing is to involve the entire franchise and media (of course it leaks out after such a meeting, so many hear that). This has hurt Trae, the coach, and everyone in the team and the fans now as well. Collins should have spoken to the coach and instead of hurting the franchise, asked for a trade without making a big thing about it.
From the Athletic article
"
Some Hawks have agreed with Collins’ stance and believe when he’s featured more, the team plays much better. After Collins spoke up in the team’s film session, the message from the coaching staff was that the Hawks have to do a better job of making opposing teams work on defense because of the offensive weapons they now have, and settling on bad looks early in the shot clock is not a recipe for success."
So teammates are on the side of Collins and so is the coaching staff. I'm not sure why Collins is a bad teammate
This happens in locker rooms. It doesn't seem like Collins was criticizing Young, he was criticizing his decisions
(01-09-2021, 06:04 PM)MFFL Wrote: [ -> ]From the Athletic article
"Some Hawks have agreed with Collins’ stance and believe when he’s featured more, the team plays much better. After Collins spoke up in the team’s film session, the message from the coaching staff was that the Hawks have to do a better job of making opposing teams work on defense because of the offensive weapons they now have, and settling on bad looks early in the shot clock is not a recipe for success."
So teammates are on the side of Collins and so is the coaching staff. I'm not sure why Collins is a bad teammate
This happens in locker rooms. It doesn't seem like Collins was criticizing Young, he was criticizing his decisions
Of course his teammates agree with him. Because as I mentioned its a valid point Collins makes. Its the way the point was made that was wrong. You go to the coach privately, and deal with it like this. You dont throw Trae Young under the bus in front of everyone and make divisions, and destroy his confidence like this. Keep in mind, there are several players that do not agree with this. Such as Young and several others. This way you create distractions and divisions in a team in a "camp Collins" and "camp Trae". This is horrible way to approach things.
Collins needed instead to go to the coach directly. If the coach agrees with his idea, the coach adjusts the strategy and tactics and talks to Trae Young directly. Trae Young gets the message like this much better, and adapts his play. The result? A happy Collins and Young that gets the message better.
In any proper working environment, this is how it works, and should work the best way. Regardless whether its sports or elsewhere.
Saying this in a meeting with all staff and players etc. This is basically the same like going public with this. Of course it leaks. And it did. The result? Team divided. Some supporting Collins. Another camp supporting Young.
Collins acted to damage Young. If he wanted to solve the issue, he would have gone to the coach directly.
(01-09-2021, 05:46 PM)DrMav Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, absolutely all about the money I think. I know they lost a lot this year and want to make sure the league doesn’t get to a spot it can’t recover.
I wonder if a bubble(s) system was turned down because the players didn’t want to have to do that again, because it actually cost the NBA a lot of money, or both.
Seems like we're just a couple of weeks away from getting vaccines.
(01-09-2021, 06:11 PM)DallasMaverick Wrote: [ -> ]Seems like we're just a couple of weeks away from getting vaccines.
It depends on who you are and where you live at the moment. Each state has control over distribution individually, for instance mine is only giving to healthcare workers and elderly long term care facility residents at the moment. I think most of not all states are following similar principles, but there is variation. For instance, a couple of my family members in their 80s that still live in their own homes (in Texas) got theirs yesterday at a local grocery store pharmacy.
Things may change as production on currently approved vaccine ramps up and different vaccines get approved to add more volume to the mix. I have also read that once Biden moves into office there will be some changes in that a 2nd dose will no longer be set aside for an individual, but that all available doses can just be given which will speed things up, but I’m not sure how much.
Oladipo stinking it up recently outside of one game.
(01-09-2021, 08:31 PM)jesusshuttlesworth82 Wrote: [ -> ]Oladipo stinking it up recently outside of one game.
There was no way his hot three point shooting was going to hold IMO. It was him shooting an unsustainable percentage that made him look "good" early this season. Just not "buying" his stock yet.
(01-09-2021, 07:59 PM)Omega_Supreme Wrote: [ -> ]Tyrese Maxey put up 39 points today most by a rookie this year.
Mavericks should have took him at 18, I think we will regret passing on that kid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmanUs4qhvs
dang
All good, Tyrell Terry is the next JET.
Minnesotta shot 50 % from three and still lost against SA. Have to play some defense
Their team is locked for two more seasons basically at the tax line and their season might be over till TDL.
(01-09-2021, 07:59 PM)Omega_Supreme Wrote: [ -> ]Tyrese Maxey put up 39 points today most by a rookie this year.
Mavericks should have took him at 18, I think we will regret passing on that kid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmanUs4qhvs
Both he and Saddiq Bey were easy choices ahead of Green. It's going to be tough watching these guys over the next few years.
The only rookie I’m blue about is Halliburton. He plays like a five year vet. Understands the game at such a high level.
I almost wish that we didn’t know Dallas tried to trade up to get him.