(01-04-2022, 06:58 PM)dynamicalVoid Wrote: [ -> ]You weren't asking me...but I am curious what vet plug and play role players are worth.
What are THJ and Maxi worth draft asset wise? Without complicating it with a teams need and all.
What is JBs hype worth draft asset wise?
I assume DFS isn't worth 16 or is he? He's worth more than 29, imo.
I was thinking of asking the same question. Would the Mavs trade Brunson for # 16 and DFS for # 29. Kind of like take a step back in Luka's first year of his new contract.
(01-04-2022, 06:58 PM)dynamicalVoid Wrote: [ -> ]What are THJ and Maxi worth draft asset wise? Without complicating it with a teams need and all.
What is JBs hype worth draft asset wise?
I assume DFS isn't worth 16 or is he? He's worth more than 29, imo.
I think THJ value is neutral. This means if the matching salary is similar quality player the deal is draft neutral (no picks), if the player coming back is bad contract, than we could get some asset
I think Maxi is perhaps worth a (very) late first rounder to a contender.
JB and DFS are both expiring, so their value is tricky. Can you extend them next season? Do you even want to extend them (luxury tax)? Can the other team extend them? I think both are worth a FRP from a contender, but not much more.
(01-04-2022, 07:06 PM)chaparral Wrote: [ -> ]Would the Mavs trade Brunson for # 16 and DFS for # 29. Kind of like take a step back in Luka's first year of his new contract.
I am not sure why would they do that, unless they are certain both are walking in the summer for whatever reason. I think it is not very likely those picks can produce better players. Of course if you have another trade lined up where those picks are needed, that is a different story.
(01-04-2022, 07:08 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ]I think THJ value is neutral. This means if the matching salary is similar quality player the deal is draft neutral (no picks), if the player coming back is bad contract, than we could get some asset
I think Maxi is perhaps worth a (very) late first rounder to a contender.
JB and DFS are both expiring, so their value is tricky. Can you extend them next season? Do you even want to extend them (luxury tax)? Can the other team extend them? I think both are worth a FRP from a contender, but not much more.
I am not sure why would they do that, unless they are certain both are walking in the summer for whatever reason. I think it is not very likely those picks can produce better players. Of course if you have another trade lined up where those picks are needed, that is a different story.
A few reasons. 1. I'm w/KL in the belief that Cuban will not pay the LT next year. 2. At what age do superstar players win titles - Luka is 22. 3. New GM/Coach will want their own players. 4. We have had this same team now for 3-1/2 seasons and we are a .500 w/ill-fitting parts.
So, let's take a few steps back, add some picks, lower the salary cap and get some new blood in here that fits better w/Luka. I can only hope that our new OJT GM has this same thought.
Pretty interesting. The talk eventually gets to Ben Simmons and both Bill and House seem to think he ends up in Dallas.
https://youtu.be/KL8oUkJjl2A
(01-04-2022, 07:53 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]The talk eventually gets to Ben Simmons and both Bill and House seem to think he ends up in Dallas.
I really hope this happens. The free throw stuff along with Luka's struggles there are the most concerning thing for me....but I dream of Luka and Simmons pick and rolls.
(01-04-2022, 08:09 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]I really hope this happens. The free throw stuff along with Luka's struggles there are the most concerning thing for me....but I dream of Luka and Simmons pick and rolls.
Bill's suggested deal is a 3-team in which Dallas sends out Porzingis AND Brunson and gets back Simmons and one additional (presumably small) piece. Would you do that?
Interestingly, Porzingis goes at #17 in the "bad contracts" draft. A few players this board covets went ahead of him.
(01-04-2022, 08:24 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Bill's suggested deal is a 3-team in which Dallas sends out Porzingis AND Brunson and gets back Simmons and one additional (presumably small) piece. Would you do that?
Yes I would. I just don't see the fit of either KP or JB with Luka in the long run so I would send out both because I am trying to build around Luka and I am going to keep trying things until something starts to click. I think Simmons would be flippable again if need be.
(01-04-2022, 08:24 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Bill's suggested deal is a 3-team in which Dallas sends out Porzingis AND Brunson and gets back Simmons and one additional (presumably small) piece. Would you do that?
I think Simmons is a good player, but I don't think that improves Mavs. I think it puts them at basically same position as they are today and a new set of questions how to build around Luka and Simmons. They would still need one good player to really lift the ceiling of the team.
I think Simmons has been and can be great but it seems like going out of the frying pan with KP's injuries and fit and into the fire with Ben Simmons mental issues (not shooting the ball) and fit (what does he do to spacing?). Simmons also intimated that he wants his own team and that will not happen in Dallas, obviously. Is Luka just another Embiid situation in his eyes? I'd hope you can fix some of the shooting issues but that's a gamble. For a move that big, I just wish what we were getting back was "safer" but maybe that's not reasonable if KP is involved.
(01-04-2022, 08:09 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]I really hope this happens. The free throw stuff along with Luka's struggles there are the most concerning thing for me....but I dream of Luka and Simmons pick and rolls.
What makes you think Simmons has any interest at all in being a roll man? He wants to either dominate the ball as a point guard or hide in the dunkers spot. He has no interest whatsoever in sacrificing his body setting picks. I think too many people get caught up in the idea of Ben Simmons and can't see what he actually is. He's very talented but you can't make someone care.
(01-04-2022, 11:16 PM)sterlingmallory Wrote: [ -> ]What makes you think Simmons has any interest at all in being a roll man? He wants to either dominate the ball as a point guard or hide in the dunkers spot. He has no interest whatsoever in sacrificing his body setting picks. I think too many people get caught up in the idea of Ben Simmons and can't see what he actually is. He's very talented but you can't make someone care.
I have said elsewhere that the Mavs would of course do their due diligence before pulling a Simmons trade. If they look into it and he has interest in playing alongside Luka and being a small ball 5 for stretches then I am in.
Point is, your concerns are VERY real and I don't dismiss them. But as a fan-GM I cannot look into them. But from a basketball standpoint I would try the Simmons-Luka experiment as long as Simmons was interested in it as well.
All the fan-GM stuff is a lot of fun but I'd be shocked if Cuban allowed KP to be traded.
(01-04-2022, 08:09 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]but I dream of Luka and Simmons pick and rolls.
It'd be a lethal combo in NBA 2k. I don't think Simmons has any interest in being a center that's a rim roller primarily.
(01-04-2022, 07:26 PM)chaparral Wrote: [ -> ]A few reasons. 1. I'm w/KL in the belief that Cuban will not pay the LT next year. 2. At what age do superstar players win titles - Luka is 22. 3. New GM/Coach will want their own players. 4. We have had this same team now for 3-1/2 seasons and we are a .500 w/ill-fitting parts.
So, let's take a few steps back, add some picks, lower the salary cap and get some new blood in here that fits better w/Luka. I can only hope that our new OJT GM has this same thought.
This FO has never traded assets for picks, and I would be stunned if Cuban (Nico) did it now. The only pick I could see them trading for is their own from the Nicks, but that's only because it would allow them more access to their own picks for trading. They may decide they need new blood, but situation and history suggest it will trading for players, not through the draft.
(01-04-2022, 09:14 PM)cow Wrote: [ -> ]I think Simmons has been and can be great but it seems like going out of the frying pan with KP's injuries and fit and into the fire with Ben Simmons mental issues (not shooting the ball) and fit (what does he do to spacing?). Simmons also intimated that he wants his own team and that will not happen in Dallas, obviously. Is Luka just another Embiid situation in his eyes? I'd hope you can fix some of the shooting issues but that's a gamble. For a move that big, I just wish what we were getting back was "safer" but maybe that's not reasonable if KP is involved.
So if I had to pick one scenario that would be "safer" that I could actually see happening would be CJ McCollum. Would you pull that trigger? Maybe something like KP/Bullock for CJ/Nurkic?
(01-04-2022, 08:24 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Bill's suggested deal is a 3-team in which Dallas sends out Porzingis AND Brunson and gets back Simmons and one additional (presumably small) piece. Would you do that?
Specifically, he throws this out there:
Dallas: Simmons, _____
Portland: KP
Philly: Brunson, Covington, Nurkic
IMO, Brunson and Covington make a ton of sense in Philly. Nurkic makes less sense with Embiid, but he'd be a big upgrade over Drummond. And Portland is getting a steal, as they're only letting go of two guys likely on the outs this summer anyway.
To answer your question -- if it's primarily Brunson/KP for Simmons, I think it's a big risk. If it works, Luka/Simmons could be one of the most uniquely dominant pairings in the league like Jordan/Pippen. And if it doesn't, you just traded two guys who could possibly each be better than Simmons in the long run. If you asked me last summer, I would have been all for it (I probably even suggested it at some point). But after seeing how Brunson and KP are developing this season, I'm not so sure.
But for the sake of argument, if we were to tweak the deal with Nurkic coming to Dallas and another contract like Powell going to Philly, I'd be a lot more interested. Give me Simmons for Brunson and Nurkic for KP, and that's a deal I'd be more willing to take my chances with.