MavsBoard

(01-10-2022, 12:49 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]He would have been a Mavs target in the next year or so for me.

I still have a strong desire to pair Luka and JC. Bring. It. On.

(01-10-2022, 12:55 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]I still have a strong desire to pair Luka and JC. Bring. It. On.

Who is our center in that scenario?

(01-10-2022, 06:51 PM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]Who is our center in that scenario?

I would prefer another non traditional big in that scenario. Another hybrid big like JC.

(01-10-2022, 08:56 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]I would prefer another non traditional big in that scenario. Another hybrid big like JC.

So would Maxi and Powell fit that bill?  Would you trade KP for Collins straight up and run with Maxi/JC/DFS/Luka/Brunson?

(01-10-2022, 09:38 PM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]So would Maxi and Powell fit that bill?  Would you trade KP for Collins straight up and run with Maxi/JC/DFS/Luka/Brunson?

I would 100% do that. Then evaluate it and see if you need to do another move.

(01-10-2022, 09:41 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]I would 100% do that. Then evaluate it and see if you need to do another move.

JC supposedly can't be traded until March 3rd, which is after the deadline. Curses!

(01-10-2022, 10:29 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]JC supposedly can't be traded until March 3rd, which is after the deadline. Curses!

Per the Athletic:

“I’ve banged my head on the wall a couple of times trying to figure it out myself, there’s really no excuse,” Collins said Friday nightafter the Hawks’ 134-118 loss to the Lakers in Los Angeles. “All I can say is it’s unacceptable and we have to dig down and do the things necessary to win or this is going to be the result every night.”

Collins, 24, is eligible to be traded on Jan. 15.

(01-11-2022, 08:46 AM)SamStetz Wrote: [ -> ]Collins, 24, is eligible to be traded on Jan. 15.

(01-10-2022, 10:29 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]JC supposedly can't be traded until March 3rd, which is after the deadline. Curses!

Looks like its actually Jan 15.  But like the Pacers, its hard to see them wanting KP.  So we are looking at another three way to make it work.  

One interesting question would be would you rather have Collins or Turner?  I think in the past I would have chosen Turner because I like that dominate rim protector to go with Luka (and possibly Brunson) who can space the floor and give Luka tons of room.  But watching this defense play like it has with Powell and Maxi tells me maybe you could still have a good defense with simply swapping out KP for Collins.  And Collins is obviously the better offensive player.

(01-11-2022, 10:50 AM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]But like the Pacers, its hard to see them wanting KP.  So we are looking at another three way to make it work.  

Yeah, the trick is finding a team who actually wants Porzingis. I honestly do not know that such a team is out there. I know I would want no part of him on his current contract, even if I wanted a player fitting his description.

(01-11-2022, 12:08 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, the trick is finding a team who actually wants Porzingis. I honestly do not know that such a team is out there. I know I would want no part of him on his current contract, even if I wanted a player fitting his description.

Based on his recent play, I would honestly want him on this team if Luka wasn't on it. I would still be nervous about availability issues, but for me the fit with Luka is 100% why I want KP traded.

(01-11-2022, 12:15 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]Based on his recent play, I would honestly want him on this team if Luka wasn't on it. I would still be nervous about availability issues, but for me the fit with Luka is 100% why I want KP traded.

The implication being that it's a freak thing, he and Luka not fitting together? Or even that Luka is the one who's an uncommonly difficult fit? If so, I'm not sure I agree. 

I see some of the same issues with Luka you do, but I feel like existing with him on offense from KP's position is a simple matter of setting screens and enjoying the easy shots. If KP can't/doesn't want to do that, I wonder who he would fit well with.

(01-11-2022, 12:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]The implication being that it's a freak thing, he and Luka not fitting together? Or even that Luka is the one who's an uncommonly difficult fit? If so, I'm not sure I agree. 

I see some of the same issues with Luka you do, but I feel like existing with him on offense from KP's position is a simple matter of setting screens and enjoying the easy shots. If KP can't/doesn't want to do that, I wonder who he would fit well with.

All I know is that I enjoyed him as part of the recent stretch when Luka was out. 

KP's On/Off +/- was +19.4 (!) during those 10 games...+15.6 O, +3.8 D. 

If Luka wasn't on this team I could totally see keeping KP on this team


Whose fault is that? KP? Luka? I don't know. But I like the Mavs with Luka (sans KP) and I like the Mavs with KP (sans Luka) and have seldom liked the Mavs with Luka+KP.

Here is the team with Luka+KP and without Luka+KP for the last two seasons:




Now the 330 minutes together this year is somewhat low (highest Mavs pairing is JB+DFS at 767 minutes this year and the Mavs 5th highest pairing has 566 minutes together this year), but it still shows us how poor the fit has been

(01-11-2022, 12:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]The implication being that it's a freak thing, he and Luka not fitting together? Or even that Luka is the one who's an uncommonly difficult fit? If so, I'm not sure I agree. 

I see some of the same issues with Luka you do, but I feel like existing with him on offense from KP's position is a simple matter of setting screens and enjoying the easy shots. If KP can't/doesn't want to do that, I wonder who he would fit well with.

I think it was Dirkfan who broke down who would be ideal fits for Luka and KP.  I think he came up with guys like Curry and Lillard would be good matches for KP.  In retrospect, a KP for Wiggins trade in the offseason might not have been that bad.  Wiggins is looking like a legit 3&D wing who can create his own shot.  Then you get Holmes in free agency and start Holmes/DFS/Wiggins/Luka/Brunson.  OH well.

Honestly KP makes a lot of sense in Portland.  They are desperate to improve for Lillard, Nurkic is in his last year and does not seem happy there, and Covington is in his last year.  They would be ripe for a TDL trade.  It's too bad McCollum isn't better.  He might actually be a better fit with Luka than Brunson due to being a better catch and shoot player, but he is just as bad defensively and it seems like he is on a downward slide (although that might just be the shit show that is Portland right now).  Maybe something crazy like KP/Powell/Bullock for CJ/Nurkic/Covington?

(01-11-2022, 12:51 PM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]Maybe something crazy like KP/Powell/Bullock for CJ/Nurkic/Covington?

Yes please.

(01-11-2022, 12:51 PM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]I think he came up with guys like Curry and Lillard would be good matches for KP.

Both pick and roll players, no? 

I'm not so sure I agree. Maybe their age and status would make KP more amenable to adjusting to them though.

(01-11-2022, 12:26 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]All I know is that I enjoyed him as part of the recent stretch when Luka was out. 

KP's On/Off +/- was +19.4 (!) during those 10 games...+15.6 O, +3.8 D. 

If Luka wasn't on this team I could totally see keeping KP on this team


Whose fault is that? KP? Luka? I don't know. But I like the Mavs with Luka (sans KP) and I like the Mavs with KP (sans Luka) and have seldom liked the Mavs with Luka+KP.

First, let me say that the “news” reported yesterday is most likely Indy ringing the bell asking for final offers (because we are really really really close to pulling the trigger).

Next, let’s take as fact your assertion that KP and Luka together don’t optimize either player.  Logic would dictate that sooner or later Dallas would break up the band and Luka would be the one staying.  So, for arguments sake, lets make that a given.

Next, let’s also make it a given that KP isn’t going to Indy or NY.  So, my questions:

1. Who out there needs KP?

2. What is his market value and how does it compare to Turner’s value.

3. Does simply adding Turner instead of KP to the current roster make us better?


I personally think Turner is better than he has shown in Indy and therefore will attract multiple bidders.  Replacing KP with him is a big help financially toward retaining JB and DFS.  I think he has the bulk to defend guys that our current roster struggles to defend (like AD and Jokic).  He plays with force and I could see Kidd really valuing his D.    I’m not sure Turner would harm our O much (if at all), but would improve our D.  I think between his D and his ability to pick and pop that he can play alongside any of Powell, Maxi, DFS or even four guards and be just fine.  My answer to number 3 above is Yes.

HOWEVER, I don’t have a gauge as to what, if anything, would need to be added.  Indy will NOT pay LT, so any deal requires Dallas take back extra salary (thankfully we have that TPE).  I’m not sure I’m willing to add much in the way of real talent to KP to get this done (thus question 2) and I’m not sure other teams in a 3-way wouldn’t rather just have Turner for themselves.  Charlotte carries a highly rated O already.  Do they value KP higher than Turner?  How about GS?  Who out there needs KP worse than they need Turner (thus question 1.