(11-10-2023, 10:39 AM)surfpuckmd Wrote: [ -> ]RC is a better coach than Mike Malone and Ty Lue. Carlisle has overachieved with three different franchises. He's proven much more than either Ty Lue and Malone. Malone has won with the league's greatest player and maybe the league's best starting five. Ty Lue has frankly underachieved with the Clipper's roster (lots of injuries contributed) I'm also not really sure how great Steve Kerr is. I think he's a good coach but he's also had one of the greatest rosters of the 21st century during his tenure. They've had a massive advantage due to their ownership's willingness to spend without limit. Carlisle has won with some really subpar rosters at four different stops.
The young coaches you mention all seem like really talented coaches. They haven't proven enough though to make a top-5 list. I think Udoka also should be on that list of great young coaches as well.
RC might be an asshole but there is not a better word to describe Jason Kidd than asshole. The difference is RC is also a good coach. Kidd is not.
I'm just going off of results, and all of those guys have won more than RC has done in years. Since 2012, Carlisle has had 1 50 win season, has made the playoffs 6/13 years and has never made it out of the 1st round since 2012!
Lue won with the Cavs and commanded a legendary 3-1 comeback against one of the greatest teams of all time. You mention injuries with the Clippers, yet he's still managed to get them to a WCF appearance just 2 years ago.
Greatest starting 5 is a stretch for the Nuggets with teams like Boston and Phoenix in the league from a talent perspective. The Nuggets are so scary because the coach has them locked in and they all play on a string on top of having the league's best player. Malone is a big part of the Nuggets success.
You're weighing heavily Carlisle's ability to win with subpar talent, yet he still hasn't won more than any of the coaches above for the last decade.
And Kidd might definitely be an asshole, but he at least knows how to ingratiate himself with his star players and manage motley personalities. RC's personality has definitely cost him chances to win. I can't say the same about Kidd.
As long as RC's attitude is handled with professionalism by the team then it has led to pretty strong results. He always talked about how players need to be ready because he loves doing in game tinkering with rotations and he's had a lot of success doing it. The problem with that is that a lot of players thrive with a set role so some personalities clash with his way of running things. Rick is by far a better X's and O's coach than the vast majority of the NBA (Kidd included) but the NBA is such a players ego driven league that sometimes that doesn't matter.
Also, poor Jerrace Walker already getting the Rick "maybe in a few years kid" treatment.
(11-10-2023, 07:12 AM)khaled1987 Wrote: [ -> ]I actually think Donnie was a part of the reason Rick left tbh. He was the one he worked with him for 13 years and they probably understand each other.
Donnie was actually decent GM imo, but he was a bit outdated, undermined and needed a fresh voice.
Rick knew that a new GM usually means lack of support for him in the team, as most directors will want to hire "their guy" rather than being stuck with the old one.
He knew what is coming, owner wants a change, franchise’s player isn't connected to him, a new decision makers, and above all there was a mess in past years that there was no guarantee that it wasn't going to be repeated with new faces.
He spared everyone the trouble and moved on, to a project he knows and whom he will have control over.
Pacers are good, and if they even reach a conference final within next few years it will be considered a success for him considering lack of true super star there
Tyrese Haliburton could become one. He's fantastic.
(11-10-2023, 10:20 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]At the end of the day the problem with Rick is that he is an asshole who grates on his locker room so much that eventually they tune him out (or worse they give up completely).
It's happened at every single stop. There is no arguing against Carlisle's X's and O's. He probably has a good case to be top 10 all time in that regard. But there is more to coaching than just a game plan and I don't think it's a coincidence that Kidd has taken this team further than Carlisle had since 2011.
I also highly HIGHLY doubt Carlisle would be able to manage Kyrie.
Also RC hasn't been a top 5 coach for years now.
1. Spolestra
2. Kerr
3. Mike Malone
4. Ty Lue
5. Pop
Are all pretty clearly ahead of him. Then you got guys like Nick Nurse, Taylor Jenkins, and even Mark Daignault.
He doesn't even work here anymore and you still feel the need to run him down. I'm glad he escaped from "fans" like you. Lol, the thought of someone who could write THIS ^^^ calling someone else "an asshole."
I didn’t agree with some of the things RC did, but I did know he was a good coach. I also agree that he kinda started not being able to get through to the players at the end of his tenure, so it was best that he leave.
(11-10-2023, 02:31 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]He doesn't even work here anymore and you still feel the need to run him down. I'm glad he escaped from "fans" like you. Lol, the thought that someone who could write THIS ^^^ calling someone else "an asshole."
Lol
I'm not running Rick down. I'm simply stating the truth as to why his time with the Mavericks ended and why I don't think he'd be a good fit with the team as currently constructed. He was a difficult person to work with and several people have reported that they believed he was an asshole and difficult to work with. So much so that even Rick himself described himself as such:
Quote:“I tell guys all the time that I may be an a------, but I’m not a bulls----er,” Carlisle said. “I tell them the truth.”
-https://www.espn.com/blog/dallas/mavericks/post/_/id/4694394/the-cold-hard-truth-rick-carlisle-is-not-nice
2 years ago after Carlisle left we got this relative hit piece from Cato:
Quote:While Carlisle adapted to Doncic, they still never got along. Even outward, public examples of Doncic showing him disrespect on the court are too many to list. Doncic deserves his own share of blame for this too, of course. But Carlisle was often difficult to deal with: lashing out verbally at non-star players he disliked or having angry outbursts directed at inanimate objects behind closed doors. All humans exist in shades of gray, and that side of Carlisle doesn’t invalidate touching stories that have also been shared about him in the past days or moments where he went out of his way to connect with a beat writer for his team. But in every corner of the Mavericks organization, there’s a shared sense of relief they no longer have to deal with his worst moments.
I even gave Carlisle his due praise in the post above. I called him a top 10 X's and O's guy of all time and yet you think it's ironic I'm calling him an asshole? I was an ardent Carlisle defender up until his last year where even Luka displayed his displeasure with Carlisle multiple times!
Lets call a spade a spade. I still think RC is a solid coach. He is no longer a top coach in the league. It is what it is.
As a side note, do you think RC would be able to coach Kyrie and keep the locker room? Do you think RC would have started Lively 2 games into the season?
(11-10-2023, 03:02 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]Lol
I'm not running Rick down. I'm simply stating the truth as to why his time with the Mavericks ended and why I don't think he'd be a good fit with the team as currently constructed. He was a difficult person to work with and several people have reported that they believed he was an asshole and difficult to work with. So much so that even Rick himself described himself as such:
2 years ago after Carlisle left we got this relative hit piece from Cato:
I even gave Carlisle his due praise in the post above. I called him a top 10 X's and O's guy of all time and yet you think it's ironic I'm calling him an asshole? I was an ardent Carlisle defender up until his last year where even Luka displayed his displeasure with Carlisle multiple times!
Lets call a spade a spade. I still think RC is a solid coach. He is no longer a top coach in the league. It is what it is.
As a side note, do you think RC would be able to coach Kyrie and keep the locker room? Do you think RC would have started Lively 2 games into the season?
Look how hard you're working to bad mouth the greatest coach in Mavs' history. Going so, so far out of your way. Sad. I didn't even read it. Too busy feeling sorry for all the haters of the great Coach Rick Carlisle.
Rob Williams out for the year and will require knee surgery.
(11-10-2023, 04:54 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]Rob Williams out for the year and will require knee surgery.
I'm sure the haters will pin this on Rick Carlisle, somehow.
We haven't seen a successful inbounds play in years and we still out here hating on Rick?
(11-10-2023, 04:54 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]Rob Williams out for the year and will require knee surgery.
That's a massive blow to any team desperate for a big man and needed his services. *cough* Mavs, Grizz.
Also hurts any Ayton trade too.
(11-10-2023, 05:50 PM)IamDougieFresh Wrote: [ -> ]We haven't seen a successful inbounds play in years and we still out here hating on Rick?
Right?
He's ONLY THE GREAT RICK CARLISLE, ARCHITECT OF THIS SORRY FRANCHISE'S ONE AND ONLY CHAMPIONSHIP.
(11-10-2023, 03:28 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Too busy feeling sorry for all the haters of the great Coach Rick Carlisle.
lol like one person out of 12 said something remotely bad about Rick just now.
(11-10-2023, 05:55 PM)StrandedOnBeauboisHill Wrote: [ -> ]lol like one person out of 12 said something remotely bad about Rick just now.
I know. It's infuriating and I won't take it anymore.
(11-10-2023, 05:55 PM)StrandedOnBeauboisHill Wrote: [ -> ]lol like one person out of 12 said something remotely bad about Rick just now.
And all I said was that Rick was not a nice person. I'm shocked that this was such a controversial take.
(11-10-2023, 05:57 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]And all I said was that Rick was not a nice person. I'm shocked that this was such a controversial take.
He can design ATO's.
He can play jazz piano.
He's awesome at ping pong.
He takes time to do tik Tok's with his daughter.
He got Dirk a championship (and vice versa) so we didn't have to hear for the rest of our days about how Dirk was too soft to get it done.
He's one of the nicest people on planet Earth.
![[Image: waltergotme.gif]](https://media.tenor.com/bj7D0gpVJ4UAAAAd/waltergotme.gif)