(04-17-2023, 07:25 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]Saw the fourth quarter of the Lakers game this morning. Quite the performance. I said a few months ago that Reaves sort of reminds me of Brunson. Different player, but just a guy who will help you win you important games. I wasn't expecting it to happen in his first playoff game. Nice showing from Rui too. Just shows you if you are good on the edges and have stars, you can build teams quickly. Rui for a few second round picks and Reaves undrafted. It just really depresses me the Mavs always give picks away and appear to don't really scout looking for hidden guys. It is weird because two of the biggest successes have been second round picks....maybe three if you count Crowder (Obviously Jalen and I think Jaden will be deemed a big success too).
I would love to know what Luka is thinking now. Seeing Jalen on Saturday and then the re-built Lakers yesterday, he needs to have some doubts. Especially considering the Mavs prize free agent took about 10 games before they figured out he couldn't play.
I wasn't able to watch the games yesterday, but it looked like a good day for basketball...besides the injuries.
What was the package for the Clippers picking up Plumlee, Gordon, Bones and Russell? A few second round picks right? We will see if that works out, but these were the type of fringe moves I was hoping Dallas would make at the deadline. Maybe not these same players. I guess it would help if they didn't punt all their second round picks though.
Plumlee was acquired for Reggie Jackson, then waived by Charlotte and signed with Denver. Hyland was acquired for 2 2nd round picks, Kennard was traded to Memphis for 2 2nd round picks, Wall was traded to Houston, then bought out for Gordon. Westbrook was waived by Utah and signed with the Clippers. So the Clippers received 4 2nds for those deals. Not bad...
when first round picks are exhausted in the market and are mainly concentrated in the hands of just a few teams, second rounders appear to have better values. after the kyrie deal we had no 2nd round available for trade. that said, even if we had multiple 2nd round picks, do you believe our FO guys, as idiotic as they've always been, could have done anything good to strengthen our squad?
(04-17-2023, 07:48 AM)LukaMVP Wrote: [ -> ]when first round picks are exhausted in the market and are mainly concentrated in the hands of just a few teams, second rounders appear to have better values. so after the kyrie deal we had no 2nd round available. that said, even if we had multiple 2nd round picks, do you believe our FO guys, as idiotic as they've always been, could have done anything good to strengthen our squad?
I would like to see Nico get a few more picks to see if Jaden was blind luck or if that was skill on his part. Because to be honest, the rest of the job he has done has not been stellar. It would be nice to see if he had this skill. Not expecting 100% success rate either. Unfortunately, it doesn't appear this will be something we are going to be able to judge a lot.
Good news...Mark Cuban is on the charge rule. We will not be blindsided by this like we were the take foul.
(04-17-2023, 07:46 AM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: [ -> ]Plumlee was acquired for Reggie Jackson, then waived by Charlotte and signed with Denver. Hyland was acquired for 2 2nd round picks, Kennard was traded to Memphis for 2 2nd round picks, Wall was traded to Houston, then bought out for Gordon. Westbrook was waived by Utah and signed with the Clippers. So the Clippers received 4 2nds for those deals. Not bad...
They received 4 seconds? Or did they end up pick neutral? Nice haul. Typically these type of deals don't move the needle much, but you are just looking to fill some holes. It looks like they did well.
(04-17-2023, 07:18 AM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: [ -> ]Those are pretty decent observations, but I disagree with a couple of your FRAUD predictions unless you're basing it on just one game. Memphis has been the 2nd or 3rd seed all season. The loss of Adams and Clarke is HUGE for them. They're tough-minded, cocky, and overconfident sometimes, but when they're healthy and clicking they are still one of the best teams in the league. Philly isn't a fraud either. They just happen to be in the same conference as Milwaukee and Boston. Phoenix is good, but I don't think they can overcome the Clipper's depth and the fact they haven't been together long enough to learn how to play with KD because he's been in and out of the lineup with injuries. The Clippers are the worst matchup for them.
Jim Harden = fraud
Embiid = Jokic’s son and spastic flopper
CPflop and Devin “charmin soft” Booker = FRAUDS
Grizz = Theses dudes really went in a corny off with the Suns and it’s too close to call
(04-17-2023, 09:11 AM)IamDougieFresh Wrote: [ -> ]Jim Harden = fraud
Embiid = Jokic’s son and spastic flopper
CPflop and Devin “charmin soft” Booker = FRAUDS
Grizz = Theses dudes really went in a corny off with the Suns and it’s too close to call
That's your opinion, and you're entitled to it. I can't call a team a fraud (Memphis) when they've been consistently good all season including an 11-game winning streak until they suffered 2 key injuries and the Ja drama. Can't do it.
(04-17-2023, 02:49 AM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ]Gobert is a dinosaur that gets exposed every playoffs. Once teams go small, he is just an average wing with zero offensive game.
He still would be probably the 2nd best center to ever don a Mav uniform. Despite his limitations his game excels at all the things we're desperately searching for.
Rebounding. Rim protection. Lob finishing. He's overpaid, but it's Cuban's money not mine.
(04-17-2023, 12:27 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]He still would be probably the 2nd best center to ever don a Mav uniform. Despite his limitations his game excels at all the things we're desperately searching for.
Rebounding. Rim protection. Lob finishing. He's overpaid, but it's Cuban's money not mine.
Reminds me of similar takes on this board when the Mavs signed DAJ. Gobert´s decline isn´t quite as bad but he is trending in the same direction. Block numbers are down. DFG% in the paint isn´t what it used to be. Rebounding numbers are down.
Some of it could be because he simply doesn´t fit next to another "slow" big like Kat. But if that is the case I am not sure if he is the right answer for a team that wants to build around Luka and his athletic limitations.
(04-17-2023, 12:27 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]He still would be probably the 2nd best center to ever don a Mav uniform. Despite his limitations his game excels at all the things we're desperately searching for.
Rebounding. Rim protection. Lob finishing. He's overpaid, but it's Cuban's money not mine.
All this narrative about "The owner is cheap, so he can't build a team" should be significantly diminished under the new agreement.
It's no longer about just being willing to pay the luxury tax. Now, a high payroll inhibits you significantly in how you can build a roster. Limits flexibility in dollar-mismatched trades. Can't sign MLE players, etc.
(04-17-2023, 12:36 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: [ -> ]Reminds me of similar takes on this board when the Mavs signed DAJ. Gobert´s decline isn´t quite as bad but he is trending in the same direction. Block numbers are down. DFG% in the paint isn´t what it used to be. Rebounding numbers are down.
Some of it could be because he simply doesn´t fit next to another "slow" big like Kat. But if that is the case I am not sure if he is the right answer for a team that wants to build around Luka and his athletic limitations.
All of these are fair points and are great reasons why not to do it.
But I'm looking around the league and its hard to find a better center that could be had for cheaper. Gobert's contract, and general decline, is enough for Minnesota to pay to get off of his deal. I'm operating under the assumption that they hated the twin towers experiment and are willing to throw in a great defensive wing in McDaniels in such a deal. The Mavs securing a defensive wing in the mold of DFS and getting their defensive minded center (while getting off of some bad money) is enough to make it worthwhile.
The Bullock+THJ+Bertans for McDaniels+Gobert deal actually saves the Mavs money this year and keeps them right under the luxury tax.
I don't know. As much as I'd like a Duren/Gafford/Hartenstein, I don't think those guys will be readily available. Gobert is. And even in his decline he's still a top 10 guy at his position.
(04-17-2023, 03:30 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]All of these are fair points and are great reasons why not to do it.
But I'm looking around the league and its hard to find a better center that could be had for cheaper. Gobert's contract, and general decline, is enough for Minnesota to pay to get off of his deal. I'm operating under the assumption that they hated the twin towers experiment and are willing to throw in a great defensive wing in McDaniels in such a deal. The Mavs securing a defensive wing in the mold of DFS and getting their defensive minded center (while getting off of some bad money) is enough to make it worthwhile.
The Bullock+THJ+Bertans for McDaniels+Gobert deal actually saves the Mavs money this year and keeps them right under the luxury tax.
I don't know. As much as I'd like a Duren/Gafford/Hartenstein, I don't think those guys will be readily available. Gobert is. And even in his decline he's still a top 10 guy at his position.
I just don't see them including McDaniels in any deal. He made a legit jump this year. Also, there one saving grace that they said a lot was they were able to keep McDaniels in the Gobert trade. It would be high comedy to see them move him to get off Gobert.
They may be stuck with Gobert. Minny has made huge mistakes, but their GM is still pretty well thought of. They will look for a way out of this. It will either be two ways. Move KAT for a big package and build around Edwards and McDaniels or move Gobert. To move Gobert, they may need to look at packages for near expirings such as Bertans and THJ. I can't imagine there will be a lot of demand for Gobert with teams giving up good assets. May be a sort of KP type package.
Let me add, this is a pretty important playoff series for KAT. Can he be a top 30 NBA player. If so, a threesome of Edwards, KAT and McDaniels show some promise. Not contender status and they are limited with draft picks, but a good sneaky move or two and that could be a solid team. KAT needs to show up though in the playoffs.
(04-17-2023, 03:30 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]All of these are fair points and are great reasons why not to do it.
But I'm looking around the league and its hard to find a better center that could be had for cheaper. Gobert's contract, and general decline, is enough for Minnesota to pay to get off of his deal. I'm operating under the assumption that they hated the twin towers experiment and are willing to throw in a great defensive wing in McDaniels in such a deal. The Mavs securing a defensive wing in the mold of DFS and getting their defensive minded center (while getting off of some bad money) is enough to make it worthwhile.
The Bullock+THJ+Bertans for McDaniels+Gobert deal actually saves the Mavs money this year and keeps them right under the luxury tax.
I don't know. As much as I'd like a Duren/Gafford/Hartenstein, I don't think those guys will be readily available. Gobert is. And even in his decline he's still a top 10 guy at his position.
I think you can effectively mark Duren off your list. He's a stud already at 19. Paul George's comments about him were very telling.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/__vvMNT08C4
(04-17-2023, 03:30 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]The Bullock+THJ+Bertans for McDaniels+Gobert deal actually saves the Mavs money this year and keeps them right under the luxury tax.
I am not sure what makes you think Gobert is available and even more, what makes you think Gobert is available for a bunch of junk while giving up an elite player. How does Minny get better doing this? Losing two starters and they don't get any assets back. This guarantees they will be even worse next year while most of their picks are owed to another team. As you said, they even increase their payroll next season for getting worse. I just don't see any logic in this
(04-17-2023, 03:46 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]Duren/Gafford/Hartenstein
Edit: should have replied to SleepingHero, not Chicagojk
Duren is certainly not available, at least not for cheap. He was good and can improve a lot. Gafford and Hartenstein are career back-ups. Their teams might be reluctant to trade them as they might see them as important part of their core, but I also don't really see them as huge improvements for Mavs needs. Neither is worth near the #10 or unprotected FRP, imho.
There is NO WAY they include McDaniels in any trade. There is also NO WAY they trade Gobert after 12 months on a "four 1st round picks"-loss for a Dinwiddie/Bertans like package They will ride this out at least another full season. After three years of play-offs you have a much needed answer on KAT. Any young player can stink up one play-off series, he might even stink up a 2nd series (not a good start for KAT on that), but if he goes for the three-peat next year you are much more comfortable moving either KAT or Gobert in 2024.
Edwards/McDaniels are 21/22 years old. They won´t rush this.
These trades are just a fantasy imho. Though as Chicago pointed out Gobert would be the perfect Cuban target. Grossly overpaid, 31 years old, and living off his reputation. As such you should find it more likely that Cuban gives the Wolves at least the #10 pick, the 2027 pick, Kleber/THJ/Bertans.
The combination of the league going young and Cuban is a deadly combination.
League: Let´s get rid of any 30+ year old BIG MONEY player that is not a legit superstar with good health, an impeccable work ethic and locker room reputation.
Mark Cuban: Come to papi, Kyrie and Rudy.
So conclusion, you won´t get Gobert for cheap in the next 12 months, but if you give the Wolves our remaining two 1st round picks, they might do it. Whether that´s good or bad news, I leave up to you.
(04-17-2023, 03:30 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]top 10 guy at his position.
Is that still the case? Just looking at starting centers. Off the top of my head...
Jokic
Embiid
Sabonis
Davis
Adebayo
Lopez
Jackson Jr (Adams is injured)
Allen
Ayton
Turner
Claxton
Kessler
Porzingis
Horford
Vucevic
Valanciunas
Capela
Poeltl
Don´t see a case for him over the top 5. Next two are among the top 3 in the DPOY race. Basically doing what Gobert is supposed to do / used to do. Next four are just as good on defense and offer more on offense (Ayton maybe slightly worse on defense but way better on offense). Meaning that I would have at least 11 guys in front of Gobert.
(04-17-2023, 04:45 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: [ -> ]Is that still the case? Just looking at starting centers. Off the top of my head...
Might not be after looking at your list.
Jaren Jackson Jr named DPOY.
(04-17-2023, 06:09 PM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: [ -> ]Jaren Jackson Jr named DPOY.
Availability matters and he only played 63 games. Only played 28mpg. Probably a couple of guys that deserved it over him.
(04-17-2023, 06:20 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: [ -> ]Availability matters and he only played 63 games. Only played 28mpg. Probably a couple of guys that deserved it over him.
He averaged 3 blocked shots per game, most in the league. Not to mention all the shots he changes. He had 7 blocks the other night. That's why he won despite the other stats you pointed out.