MavsBoard

(01-18-2022, 12:24 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]So my focus short term is find a better Kleber.

I'd settle for another Kleber to add to the existing Kleber.

(01-18-2022, 12:26 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I'd settle for another Kleber to add to the existing Kleber.

That would work.   I would like someone to be more of a threat to score though.    Someone who can create (offense for himself and passing for others) a little would be ideal.

(01-18-2022, 12:30 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]That would work.   I would like someone to be more of a threat to score though.    Someone who can create (offense for himself and passing for others) a little would be ideal.

Gotcha. So, a star PF, basically. That would be great, don't get me wrong, but even that might be a push as a fit with Porzingis, imo...might be. Kind of seems to me like if KP is here, he needs to step up and be the type of player you're describing (but from the 5, to be clear).

(01-18-2022, 12:30 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: [ -> ]That would work.   I would like someone to be more of a threat to score though.    Someone who can create (offense for himself and passing for others) a little would be ideal.

Honestly if they are playing with Luka, Brunson and KP I feel like defense would be more important than offense.  You are basically describing Tobias Harris (who might be gettable for as little as THJ and Powell).  Personally I would prefer a 3&D player like RoCo (who might be gettable for one of Bullock/Powell + second).

Marc Stein: The Mavericks have been frequently linked to a trade pursuit of Indiana's Myles Turner, but league sources say Dallas had already backed off on its interest even before Turner's foot injury and with its team defense already flourishing at No. 4 overall in defense efficiency.

(01-18-2022, 01:14 PM)Smitty Wrote: [ -> ]Marc Stein: The Mavericks have been frequently linked to a trade pursuit of Indiana's Myles Turner, but league sources say Dallas had already backed off on its interest even before Turner's foot injury and with its team defense already flourishing at No. 4 overall in defense efficiency.

Nice to see Nico getting into the media game.

(01-18-2022, 01:14 PM)Smitty Wrote: [ -> ]Marc Stein: The Mavericks have been frequently linked to a trade pursuit of Indiana's Myles Turner, but league sources say Dallas had already backed off on its interest even before Turner's foot injury and with its team defense already flourishing at No. 4 overall in defense efficiency.

Nice to hear. I think it´s pretty obvious we need a playmaker more than a defensive C.

I´d also be surprised, if there was much of a market for Myles Turner. Remember that the Hayward/Pacers thing more or less collapsed, because Ainge didn´t want Myles Turner for free and they couldn´t find a 3rd team either.

I get the argument for his defense, but I´m not convinced there is much of a demand for him between his injuries, the changing center landscape and the fact that he´s been in the league for seven years now, and his stats have basically been more or less identical since his 2nd season. There is no lack of minutes. Maybe a change of scenery will bring that little extra out of him, but how much will teams be willing to bet on that?

A stress fracture sounds a bit more serious than your typical phantom trade deadline injury.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/3309...ources-say

(01-18-2022, 01:37 PM)Tyler Wrote: [ -> ]A stress fracture sounds a bit more serious than your typical phantom trade deadline injury.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/3309...ources-say

...and we are done here. No way teams will pay anything for a C with a stress fracture in his foot, who could likely miss the rest of the year. No point for the Pacers to trade him either at zero value, when they´ll stink/tank for the rest of the year anyway.

Might as well focus on LeVert/Lamb/Warren now, unless the Pacers are crazy enough to trade Sabonis.

This is probably the moment to play some three dimension chess. Get Bamba from the Magic for two 2nd rounders. You can get an immediate contributor, somebody you either like enough to keep or he probably makes a real nice trade piece for Myles Turner. In the end you get Turner for two 2nds plus maybe another small piece.

(01-18-2022, 01:49 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]Get Bamba from the Magic for two 2nd rounders.

Love the Turner take, but don't know how to reconcile it with your often suggested targeting of Bamba. What gives?

(01-18-2022, 02:03 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Love the Turner take, but don't know how to reconcile it with your often suggested targeting of Bamba. What gives?

I think Bamba is a little more mobile than Turner. There is more improvement and upside, too. So say you really want to try a legit C next to Porzingis, you get a cheaper (acquiring costs) version. You can test him for 3-4 months to determine whether he´s worth retaining in FA or he will be a nice trade asset to send to the Pacers in the summer.

Pacers generally don´t go for picks, but rather underappreciated young veterans. Bamba fits that mold. So the argument would be to get such an asset in preparation for a summer trade, plus you get to test drive Bamba and the compatilibity of PF Porzingis/legit C. Better to only sink two 2nd rounders into Bamba, one you likely be able to recover in a RFA trade right now.

Maybe Turner won´t even return this season, so you head into the summer FA without any additional knowledge of the Porzingis PF/legit C theory. Then you go into next season testing your theory, find out it stinks and you had your whole 2022 off-season and roster build on a false assumption for which you paid a lot more assets.

Right now Turner is averaging 13/7 with three blocks. Bamba is averaging 10/8 with two blocks. Both are shooting 33% from three. You want to test that Twin Towers theory, Bamba is your best bet.

I still think this experiment would fail due to insufficient amount of playmakers and Luka being a point power forward. I´d rather have it fail with two 2nd round picks attached than a 1st rounder plus X.

(01-18-2022, 01:49 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]...and we are done here. No way teams will pay anything for a C with a stress fracture in his foot, who could likely miss the rest of the year. No point for the Pacers to trade him either at zero value, when they´ll stink/tank for the rest of the year anyway.

Might as well focus on LeVert/Lamb/Warren now, unless the Pacers are crazy enough to trade Sabonis.

This is probably the moment to play some three dimension chess. Get Bamba from the Magic for two 2nd rounders. You can get an immediate contributor, somebody you either like enough to keep or he probably makes a real nice trade piece for Myles Turner. In the end you get Turner for two 2nds plus maybe another small piece.

I am confused by your Bamba love.  We already have more centers than we know what to do with.  Do we really need to add another?  If we are going to make small moves to improve the team, lets see if we can improve the 4 spot (as mentioned above) and possibly dump THJ to make tax room for DFS and Brunson.

I can think of one team that might still be interested in Turner.  Portland is in tanking mode and current center is likely walking at the end of the year.  I could totally see them trading for Turner and being perfectly happy with him on the bench for the rest of the season.

(01-18-2022, 02:19 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]So say you really want to try a legit C next to Porzingis

I do not. 

What I mean is: what makes you think Bamba will ever be a player worth having in the modern NBA, even if developed? Seems like just a guy, to me, and that's before he starts to lose a step (which seems to happen even younger for the big guys, usually). 

I don't particularly despise the player or anything, but I think he'd play (on a good team) about as much as MBrown will play here in important games, which is to say almost not at all.

What am I missing with Bamba? What makes you think he's such an attractive target?

(01-18-2022, 12:26 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I'd settle for another Kleber to add to the existing Kleber.

Theis. If they are hellbent of wanting another big.

(01-18-2022, 12:26 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I'd settle for another Kleber to add to the existing Kleber.

The name in my head that I cannot get out is Jerami Grant.  Defensively we'd always have a big tweener on the floor between him and Maxi.

I also think that it fixes a lot of the short roll 4 on 3 situations that we struggle with at times when Luka gets doubled in the playoffs.

(01-18-2022, 02:41 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I do not. 

What I mean is: what makes you think Bamba will ever be a player worth having in the modern NBA, even if developed? Seems like just a guy, to me, and that's before he starts to lose a step (which seems to happen even younger for the big guys, usually). 

I don't particularly despise the player or anything, but I think he'd play (on a good team) about as much as MBrown will play here in important games, which is to say almost not at all.

What am I missing with Bamba? What makes you think he's such an attractive target?

I can totally do without the PF/C experiment. I want to play small and go for another 20 PPG playmaker, but the Mavs might be dead set on this theory.

They did start the season with about 4-5 centers on the roster afterall. I honestly don´t know what their real thoughts are on this Porzingis Twin Towers PF stuff, but I´d much prefer to invest some minutes into a former lottery pick that has some tools and mobility to test that theory properly at a fairly low cost. 

Plus I think there is some potential with Bamba. He´s had just 190 NBA games. This season is the first he played real minutes. He´s got to 10/8 with 2 blocks and almost 2 assists, while shooting sub 0.500 from the field and only getting to the line once per game. He has the body to develop into this rim-runner type that has done great with us, especially with a savant like Luka. He also seems like the type of player that would benefit from playing with other good players. So assuming you can get his FG% up by 10% and his FT attempts up by two per game, you are looking at a 14/10 projection with 2 blocks. And I doubt he´ll cost much more than the MLE to retain next summer.

I think that´s the kind of forward projections we have to nail.

Jarrett Allen and Lauri Markkanen were two such players that became available last year. Bamba/Bagley are it this year. Myles Turner could totally be such a player. I just think the cost will be totally unreasonable compared to all these other guys mentioned.

(01-18-2022, 03:25 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]Jarrett Allen and Lauri Markkanen were two such players that became available last year. Bamba/Bagley are it this year

Yeah, I'm with you. Leaving positional need aside for a second, I think I just don't think as highly of Bamba's potential as you do. I would've LOVED Jarrett Allen. Lauri Markkanen...ok. Bagley...maybe, if it's a steal of a deal and contract and you don't have to play him unless he earns it. When it comes to Bamba, I just don't have much interest. But, based on your continued suggestion, I'll keep an eye on him.

(01-18-2022, 01:49 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]...and we are done here. No way teams will pay anything for a C with a stress fracture in his foot, who could likely miss the rest of the year.

Yeah for sure, I was one that advocated for bringing in Turner, but news of the stress fracture pretty much closes the door on that. Stress fractures are incredibly slow to heal and they have to be shut down for a very long period of time, otherwise it will basically never heal. It's not an out for two weeks and then they'll be fine kind of injury. They will just continually reaggravate if they don't rest enough. 

If I remember correctly Seth Curry and Javale McGee had stress fractures while they were here and they both basically missed an entire year before they were right again. Maybe we can revisit the Turner idea in a year, but I'm out for now too.

(01-18-2022, 03:25 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]I can totally do without the PF/C experiment. I want to play small and go for another 20 PPG playmaker, but the Mavs might be dead set on this theory.

They did start the season with about 4-5 centers on the roster afterall. I honestly don´t know what their real thoughts are on this Porzingis Twin Towers PF stuff, but I´d much prefer to invest some minutes into a former lottery pick that has some tools and mobility to test that theory properly at a fairly low cost. 

Plus I think there is some potential with Bamba. He´s had just 190 NBA games. This season is the first he played real minutes. He´s got to 10/8 with 2 blocks and almost 2 assists, while shooting sub 0.500 from the field and only getting to the line once per game. He has the body to develop into this rim-runner type that has done great with us, especially with a savant like Luka. He also seems like the type of player that would benefit from playing with other good players. So assuming you can get his FG% up by 10% and his FT attempts up by two per game, you are looking at a 14/10 projection with 2 blocks. And I doubt he´ll cost much more than the MLE to retain next summer.

I think that´s the kind of forward projections we have to nail.

Jarrett Allen and Lauri Markkanen were two such players that became available last year. Bamba/Bagley are it this year. Myles Turner could totally be such a player. I just think the cost will be totally unreasonable compared to all these other guys mentioned.

I am out on Bamba.  Bagley is a guy I haven't given up on.  I know he has been hurt a lot and has had stretches of bad play, but I can't figure out why it hasn't worked out better there.   I am not sure what he views himself and if he would be ready to accept a smaller role where he is not the lead option.   But he is a guy who would interest me.    Kings will probably try to attach him to a bigger deal and that may be hard to compete with.   In two years, it wouldn't surprise me if there are a lot of teams who wished they would have gone after him.  Although, maybe he is buried on a bench in two years too.

(01-18-2022, 03:25 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]I can totally do without the PF/C experiment. I want to play small and go for another 20 PPG playmaker, but the Mavs might be dead set on this theory.

They did start the season with about 4-5 centers on the roster afterall. I honestly don´t know what their real thoughts are on this Porzingis Twin Towers PF stuff, but I´d much prefer to invest some minutes into a former lottery pick that has some tools and mobility to test that theory properly at a fairly low cost. 

Plus I think there is some potential with Bamba. He´s had just 190 NBA games. This season is the first he played real minutes. He´s got to 10/8 with 2 blocks and almost 2 assists, while shooting sub 0.500 from the field and only getting to the line once per game. He has the body to develop into this rim-runner type that has done great with us, especially with a savant like Luka. He also seems like the type of player that would benefit from playing with other good players. So assuming you can get his FG% up by 10% and his FT attempts up by two per game, you are looking at a 14/10 projection with 2 blocks. And I doubt he´ll cost much more than the MLE to retain next summer.

I think that´s the kind of forward projections we have to nail.

Jarrett Allen and Lauri Markkanen were two such players that became available last year. Bamba/Bagley are it this year. Myles Turner could totally be such a player. I just think the cost will be totally unreasonable compared to all these other guys mentioned.

I find it encouraging that they are starting Maxi with KP now.  I don't think they are that married to the two center approach (the other big name target was JC who is clearly a 4).  They may determine they only need it for a random 10 minutes a game (it has not been much more than that for several weeks) and Powell or even Chriss can do that.

Also, you are comparing Turner and Bamba with basic counting stats.  Turner is not desirable due to his counting stats (including blocks),  he is desirable because his defensive impact on the court is elite.  Bamba is nowhere near that and likely never will be.

Allen and LM were restricted.  Their availability was limited.  Allen is having a great year, but he got 20 mil as a restricted free agent.  His cost would have been insane.  I have not seen anything to suggest LM is worth mare than the 16 mil and assets he cost.