(01-12-2022, 11:20 AM)hakeemfaan Wrote: [ -> ]Looks like he shot well in the playoffs in fewer games last year but struggled the previous two years when he played more games in the playoffs.
When I say bigger names, I do mean players like Tobias Harris and Green. Most casual fans would readily say they are an upgrade over THJ and Bullock. I am just cautioning against that mindset. Grass is always greener on the other side.
I don't think there is any question that Harris is a better player than THJ (I think Green is better than Bullock as well). The issue is he is more expensive. Doing this trade takes on an extra 16 mil in salary. We are already concerned about going deep into tax with DFS and Brunson extensions. I would be surprised if Cuban is willing to go this route.
(01-12-2022, 11:25 AM)sefant Wrote: [ -> ]Negative defender. Pass
Bullock lowkey has been fantastic on defense, basically from the get go. People just hating on him because he forgot how to shoot. Otherwise he made the defense way way better unlike JRich. Tim McMahon called Luka defense "abmysal" on the Lowe podcast just a few weeks ago. Tho being 6th overall on defense with the mess Luka/THJ creating early on is an amazing feet from multiple guys.
You could argue the rest of the guys had to play near best defense in the league to be 6th. At some point the combo Luka/THJ played ~ 500 min together, and were dead last in DefRtg. Right now they are hovering around 25th i think.
People made fun of the offseason, but the "new guys" + Josh Green in my opinion playing a BIG role to the defensive puzzle. This isn't just all Kidd and the coaching staff with a better defensive scheme.
Bullock has the best defensive on/off on the team.
- Bullock +7.2 on defense
- Josh Green +5.4 on defense
- Frank +5.2 on defense
- S. Brown +3.4 on defense
- JRich was -4.8 in comparison
Thanks to Rick ignoring Josh Green, the Mavs roster basically added 4 plus defenders. If i look at the roster last season, the only defenders on the team were DFS/Kleber and maybe WCS. KP was a liability last year, and is basically a top 10 rim protector in the league.
Last season: DFS, Kleber, WCS
This season: DFS, Kleber, KP, Bullock, Josh Green, Frank, S. Brown
Mavs without Bullock are 22th on defense. Tho i would be careful with getting rid of him. Its hard to say, but i fully believe the main reason for the better defense is also having more defenders on average on the floor.
Luka + Bullock on the floor = best defense in the league
Brunson + Bullock on the floor = best defense in the league
KP + Bullock on the floor = best defense in the league
Luka/Green +7.9
Luka/Bullock +6.2
Luka/all the other guys: negative (from the season start)
KP/Green +10.3
KP/Frank +9.8
KP/Burke +8.6
KP/Bullock +8.2
KP/S.Brown +6.8
KP/DFS +2.9
Imo you see clear pattern that more defenders around Luka/KP are working best.
Luka/KP are -5.5 on the season
Luka/Brunson is -0.5 on the season
But now you see this:
Luka/Bullock/KP are +19.3 in 114 min
Luka/Bullock/Brunson are +14.4 in 144 min
If your argument is that you want to focus on defense, Harris is not a great defender but he is better than THJ, and Green is an elite team defender. He is not going to be a downgrade from Bullock.
(01-12-2022, 08:46 AM)SamStetz Wrote: [ -> ]Sam Amick: The thing with Philly that’s interesting is you hear some chatter that they wouldn’t mind getting off Tobias Harris’ money. He’s a hell of a player but that’s a huge contract
Here is where the Mavs swoop in and take Tobias along with a first and a boatload of 2nds.
(01-12-2022, 11:32 AM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]If your argument is that you want to focus on defense, Harris is not a great defender but he is better than THJ, and Green is an elite team defender. He is not going to be a downgrade from Bullock.
Chemistry is also an argument. I think Bullock is a good team player and it would hurt to move on from him especially after things started to click.
But it's not like the Mavs are getting back a scrub in Danny Green. He's still shooting better than Bullock this year from 3 and he's still a good team defender. Probably not at the level of Bullock, but still good.
(01-12-2022, 11:45 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]Probably not at the level of Bullock, but still good.
I actually feel like Bullock's defense has been disappointing, more so even than his shooting, which shows signs of being a legit asset to the team in the near future. I feel like he's not a great on ball defender at all. Not sure what everyone is seeing that's so easy to praise from him on that end.
I do like his lightning quick release, however. At this point I could stand to lose either he or THJ, but not both. I think at least one of those dudes needs to be here shooting 5+ 3's per game if this offense has any chance of reaching potency.
(01-12-2022, 12:06 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I actually feel like Bullock's defense has been disappointing, more so even than his shooting, which shows signs of being a legit asset to the team in the near future. I feel like he's not a great on ball defender at all. Not sure what everyone is seeing that's so easy to praise from him on that end.
I do like his lightning quick release, however. At this point I could stand to lose either he or THJ, but not both. I think at least one of those dudes needs to be here shooting 5+ 3's per game if this offense has any chance of reaching potency.
He gets beaten of the dribble. Just like any other player in the modern NBA. But he recovers well and generally makes the right rotations. Also like his ability to get over/through screens. With Bullock, Frank and an improving Green the Mavs have three guys that can stay attached to the ballhandler after the screen.
(01-12-2022, 12:06 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I actually feel like Bullock's defense has been disappointing, more so even than his shooting, which shows signs of being a legit asset to the team in the near future. I feel like he's not a great on ball defender at all. Not sure what everyone is seeing that's so easy to praise from him on that end.
I do like his lightning quick release, however. At this point I could stand to lose either he or THJ, but not both. I think at least one of those dudes needs to be here shooting 5+ 3's per game if this offense has any chance of reaching potency.
He certainly isn't on the level of Maxi of DFS (or Frank or even Green) as a defender but I would argue that he's a much better defender than Hardaway and seems to understand rotations much better. You also never have to worry about his effort on that end. I do agree that what we've seen so far on that end is not as good as what we were expecting so maybe that may be where the disconnect is? I just think he's clearly the type of guy who fits into a high switching scheme that Kidd is trying to build, despite the early results.
Agree on the fact that either him or Hardaway needs to stay past the TDL. Nice to see his shooting come around because it was tough to watch him early this season.
(01-12-2022, 12:21 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: [ -> ]With Bullock, Frank and an improving Green the Mavs have three guys that can stay attached to the ballhandler after the screen.
Totally agree that Ntilikina and Green are both GREAT at getting over screens. Uncommonly so, in fact. I haven't noticed Bullock being a plus in that area, really, but I'll watch again, more carefully.
I think he gets beat off of the dribble far more than just about any other player on the roster, personally.
Seeing all these supposedly top-notch defenders come in and look meh makes me appreciate DFS more and more.
We keep thinking we've found another guy on his level but they never compete
(01-12-2022, 12:38 PM)Jym Wrote: [ -> ]Seeing all these supposedly top-notch defenders come in and look meh makes me appreciate DFS more and more.
We keep thinking we've found another guy on his level but they never compete
For real. I was worried that bringing Bullock in on a longer term deal meant that DFS' time here was done after this year but he just keeps on showing up and improving and showing value. It's kind of wild honestly.
(01-12-2022, 12:38 PM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]I can understand Barnes, and Sabonis does not really fit, but John Collins seems like a good offer. Doubt they are getting anything better than that.
Value wise. Fit next to Embiid and Harris (if they cannot move him) is really bad. Three guys that cannot really defend the perimeter. Two PFs with mediocre inside defense.
(01-12-2022, 11:27 AM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]I don't think there is any question that Harris is a better player than THJ (I think Green is better than Bullock as well). The issue is he is more expensive. Doing this trade takes on an extra 16 mil in salary. We are already concerned about going deep into tax with DFS and Brunson extensions. I would be surprised if Cuban is willing to go this route.
Better is subjective. Harris is a better talent but THJ seems like the consummate teammate. Green and Bullock are interchangeable.
Yes. The salary is an issue too. I don’t see this as a big enough upgrade to justify the salary differnce. The only argument against that could be it is probably easier to get more value for Harris than for THJ down the road if we decide to move on.
(01-12-2022, 12:52 PM)hakeemfaan Wrote: [ -> ]Better is subjective. Harris is a better talent but THJ seems like the consummate teammate. Green and Bullock are interchangeable.
Yes. The salary is an issue too. I don’t see this as a big enough upgrade to justify the salary differnce. The only argument against that could be it is probably easier to get more value for Harris than for THJ down the road if we decide to move on.
I'm not really an advocate for this trade because I'm not sure how good a fit Harris is and not sure he is worth the extra cap/tax hit.
But I also think there has been a little too much emphasis on "consummate teammate" with this FO and not enough on talent. We have been overpaying for guys like Powell and THJ because they are great teammates, but this team is hurting for talent and has done very little to improve it the last three years. I'm more than ready to trade out "teammate" (Powell/THJ) for more talent.
(01-12-2022, 01:06 PM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not really an advocate for this trade because I'm not sure how good a fit Harris is and not sure he is worth the extra cap/tax hit.
But I also think there has been a little too much emphasis on "consummate teammate" with this FO and not enough on talent. We have been overpaying for guys like Powell and THJ because they are great teammates, but this team is hurting for talent and has done very little to improve it the last three years. I'm more than ready to trade out "teammate" (Powell/THJ) for more talent.
I used to be in that boat and let’s just get talent in here and we will figure out the rest. I am still in that boat but that talent level has to be much better for me to just ignore chemistry.
Tobias always has great numbers and got great contracts but his career to me seems like a tease. I honestly can’t remember a single game where I felt Tobias was carrying his team. THJ definitely is an inferior talent and maddeningly inconsistent but when hot he has carried this team quite a few games.
I agree with you that whenever we talk upgrades we immediately focus on the flaws and engage in paralysis by analysis. At the same time we sometimes tend to overrate folks on other teams and not look at their flaws even though they are staring us in the face and assuming that being here will eliminate those flaws. KP comes predominantly to mind.
With Green vs Bullock, I don’t really think either is clearly better than the other talent wise, and I still remember how Green turned us down recently . Not that high on getting folks who chose not to come here when they had a chance.
(01-12-2022, 12:32 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...8001992710
Woj is sounding more and more like Baghdad Bob carrying the water for Morey's propaganda. He's shredding his own credibility for access.
In the process, however, he does articulate the Philly position on Harris pretty clearly. If teams want to trade a high-priced forward for Simmons, Harris has to also be on the way out.
That does open the window for a 3rd team like Dallas to trade for Harris if they're interested.
I think Harris is a good player but that contract is a downer.
I wonder if there is a massive 4 team trade possible here.
Time to fire up the trade machine.
EDIT: Ok I did it. Here is the massive 5 team, 15 player trade.
Hawks get: Bullock, Ben Simmons, PJ Washington
Hornets get: KP+ Lamb
Pacers get: Gordon Hayward, and Okongwu
76ers get: John Collins, Cam Reddish, LaVert, Ish Smith, Gallinari
Mavs get: Tobias Harris, Danny Green, and Sabonis
Lets say the Mavs throw whatever picks necessary as well.
Before I get people angry this was just for fun.
(01-12-2022, 11:32 AM)mvossman Wrote: [ -> ]If your argument is that you want to focus on defense, Harris is not a great defender but he is better than THJ, and Green is an elite team defender. He is not going to be a downgrade from Bullock.
THJ is coming off the bench, will you bring Harris and his 35-40 mill off the bench too? Harris defensive metrics aint looking any better compared to THJ so far.
I mentioned it somewhere in the Kidd thread, currently the trifecta of defensive evil Luka - THJ - Brunson, barely seeing minutes together on the floor. They are also negative in the 14 minutes, despite going 5-0 in the last 5 games. Ok Luka missed a game, tho essentially 4 games. The sample sizes aren't big, but its something to watch for in the next few weeks.
Its way too early, but it seems coaching staff found ways to use THJ better. If you want to be a THJ hater, you could say they found ways to minimize his damage
You could argue THJ isn't good enough to adjust the lineups for him. But unless the rotation is pure luck by the coaching staff they are trying to go with more defense around THJ.
I don't see Harris as an ideal fit with Luka and nor you can start Luka/Brunson with Harris, if your goal is top 10 (5) defense longterm. And a 35 mill bench player is gross. Harris has lowkey had a terrible year. Mavs already made the mistake once, to think a former Sixers will look better due to Luka. His contract is Westbrook back. No way you trade for Harris. Mavs would be the laughing stock of the league, if it doesn't work out.
THJ also had better playoffs compared to Harris imo. Harris poor playoffs going unnoticed due to the Simmons drama.
I would also say THJ had better playoffs compared to Harris. And Clippers are way better than the Hawks/Knicks.