Mavericks Receive
Thaddeus Young
Zack Lavine
Khris Dunn
Chicago Receives
Tim Hardaway Jr.
Dennis Schroeder
2025 1st Rd Pick Top 20 protected
OKC Receives
Courtney Lee
Golden 2nd Rd. Pick
Chicago 2nd Rd. Pick
Jalen Brunson
Trade Exception Trade Taj Gibson from the Knicks
(12-03-2019, 01:35 AM)deronjohn Wrote: [ -> ]Mavericks Receive
Thaddeus Young
Zack Lavine
Khris Dunn
Chicago Receives
Tim Hardaway Jr.
Dennis Schroeder
2025 1st Rd Pick Top 20 protected
OKC Receives
Courtney Lee
Golden 2nd Rd. Pick
Chicago 2nd Rd. Pick
Jalen Brunson
Trade Exception Trade Taj Gibson from the Knicks
What are you trying to accomplish with this trade? It is a pretty redundant trade that costs a LOT of future salary, doesn't address a majority of the issues that confront the Mavs, ends all hope of '21 cap flexibility, and sends away pretty much all available trade assets. In all actuality, this trade is what I fear most - more redundant one-way players.
Dunn is a great defender. I like him as a backup PG - but we already have Wright holding that down and Brunson is arguably a better 2way player on top of that.
Lavine - I don't know why he would be a target at all. His advantage over Hardaway is shot creation at the the cost of defense. pass.
As for Thad, I already posted about my objections to him.. just expensive redundancy that doesn't really move the needle at the right position.
Seems like a very complex trade that costs a lot but doesn't move the needle in the areas we need help in - adding 2way wing and a versatile defending upgrade to replace Powell at C that can rim run and/or shoot. It almost seems like the NY trade where the other team is trying to clear cap space, except it is missing the KP coming back!
(12-03-2019, 01:59 AM)Mavsfan12 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2019, 01:35 AM)deronjohn Wrote: [ -> ]Mavericks Receive
Thaddeus Young
Zack Lavine
Khris Dunn
Chicago Receives
Tim Hardaway Jr.
Dennis Schroeder
2025 1st Rd Pick Top 20 protected
OKC Receives
Courtney Lee
Golden 2nd Rd. Pick
Chicago 2nd Rd. Pick
Jalen Brunson
Trade Exception Trade Taj Gibson from the Knicks
What are you trying to accomplish with this trade? It is a pretty redundant trade that costs a LOT of future salary, doesn't address a majority of the issues that confront the Mavs, ends all hope of '21 cap flexibility, and sends away pretty much all available trade assets. In all actuality, this trade is what I fear most - more redundant one-way players.
Dunn is a great defender. I like him as a backup PG - but we already have Wright holding that down and Brunson is arguably a better 2way player on top of that.
Lavine - I don't know why he would be a target at all. His advantage over Hardaway is shot creation at the the cost of defense. pass.
As for Thad, I already posted about my objections to him.. just expensive redundancy that doesn't really move the needle at the right position.
Seems like a very complex trade that costs a lot but doesn't move the needle in the areas we need help in - adding 2way wing and a versatile defending upgrade to replace Powell at C that can rim run and/or shoot. It almost seems like the NY trade where the other team is trying to clear cap space, except it is missing the KP coming back!
I am glad you asked that question
During the draft you take Lavine, Taj Gibson, Justin Jackson 2020 1st Rd Pick for Brad Beal
(12-02-2019, 08:36 PM)SkenfromLMF Wrote: [ -> ]How close are the Mavs to their hard cap?
I am afraid the Mavs will be restricted to matching trades, and using the Trade Exception... Meaning the usual Multipliers may/likely not be available to make legal trades.
Good question. I kinda forgot about the hard cap this season until another article/vid in the Owner thread reminded me. The Mavs qualified for the hard cap in all three ways that a team can - by doing a s/t for DWarp, using the MLE on Seth, and using the BAE for Bobi. The hard cap for the 2019/20 season is $138,928,000.
Depending on what site you look at, the mavs are roughly around 120.5M and 121.5M, meaning we could take on 17-18M in salary before hitting the cap.
(12-03-2019, 02:04 AM)deronjohn Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2019, 01:59 AM)Mavsfan12 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2019, 01:35 AM)deronjohn Wrote: [ -> ]Mavericks Receive
Thaddeus Young
Zack Lavine
Khris Dunn
Chicago Receives
Tim Hardaway Jr.
Dennis Schroeder
2025 1st Rd Pick Top 20 protected
OKC Receives
Courtney Lee
Golden 2nd Rd. Pick
Chicago 2nd Rd. Pick
Jalen Brunson
Trade Exception Trade Taj Gibson from the Knicks
What are you trying to accomplish with this trade? It is a pretty redundant trade that costs a LOT of future salary, doesn't address a majority of the issues that confront the Mavs, ends all hope of '21 cap flexibility, and sends away pretty much all available trade assets. In all actuality, this trade is what I fear most - more redundant one-way players.
Dunn is a great defender. I like him as a backup PG - but we already have Wright holding that down and Brunson is arguably a better 2way player on top of that.
Lavine - I don't know why he would be a target at all. His advantage over Hardaway is shot creation at the the cost of defense. pass.
As for Thad, I already posted about my objections to him.. just expensive redundancy that doesn't really move the needle at the right position.
Seems like a very complex trade that costs a lot but doesn't move the needle in the areas we need help in - adding 2way wing and a versatile defending upgrade to replace Powell at C that can rim run and/or shoot. It almost seems like the NY trade where the other team is trying to clear cap space, except it is missing the KP coming back!
I am glad you asked that question
During the draft you take Lavine, Taj Gibson, Justin Jackson 2020 1st Rd Pick for Brad Beal
You are thinking ahead of me, my man. I am just looking at ways to fill holes this season, while preserving future flexibility - you are next level acquiring assets for bigger things. Dream big!
Taj Gibson and Marcus Morris are two other PF types you could try to bring in here that would move Powell to the bench. Marcus Morris can play SF and even play-make although he is more likely to chuck a lot of shots.
(12-02-2019, 11:19 PM)HanspardsShowerVoice Wrote: [ -> ]Why is anyone concerned with post defense in a 5 when post offense by a 5 is obsolete in the NBA?
Post offense by a 5 is obsolete but a lot of PF's create a lot of offense post and otherwise. These guys need to get locked down. Right now Powell is drawing these assignments. Just to name a few names you have Jokic (center/PF hybrid), Aldridge, Anthony Davis, Kevin Love, Jaren Jackson, and so on, most of which have given Powell a lot of trouble this year. Even old Marc Gasol gave Powell problems. You need a guy that can guard the skilled big on the other team and Powell does not offer much resistance. The Mavs need a guy who can both do PF things (guard out on the perimeter) and center things (ie rebound, roll to the rim, set good screens).
I'm totally on board with upgrading Powell on defense, but I'm not concerned with how you guard Embiid in the post. Number 1, I'm not going to build my team to hyphetically match up against 1 other player in another conference. Two, Embiid actually shoots a lot of 3s. The best post up center in the league doesn't even want to be a post up center in 2019. More concerned about how can switch on a stretch big on the perimeter and keep KP under the rim than I am about being muscled by some 2019 version of Shaq that doesn't actually exist.
As far as Jokic ... Denver runs the offense through Jokic at the top of the key. He's more of an offensive facilitiator than a true old school post up center. He's only getting 5.6 post ups per game. I think people get overly concerned about hypothetically giving up paints in the post "feels" like you're being bullied or immasculated, when the math says the Mavs just really need more and more 3 point defense. It's like football defensive coordinators who are like "Dammit, I don't care if we give up 30 points through the air, we're not going to have the opponent impose their will on us through the run game !!!"
(12-03-2019, 11:30 AM)HanspardsShowerVoice Wrote: [ -> ]I'm totally on board with upgrading Powell on defense, but I'm not concerned with how you guard Embiid in the post. Number 1, I'm not going to build my team to hyphetically match up against 1 other player in another conference. Two, Embiid actually shoots a lot of 3s. The best post up center in the league doesn't even want to be a post up center in 2019. More concerned about how can switch on a stretch big on the perimeter and keep KP under the rim than I am about being muscled by some 2019 version of Shaq that doesn't actually exist.
As far as Jokic ... Denver runs the offense through Jokic at the top of the key. He's more of an offensive facilitiator than a true old school post up center. He's only getting 5.6 post ups per game. I think people get overly concerned about hypothetically giving up paints in the post "feels" like you're being bullied or immasculated, when the math says the Mavs just really need more and more 3 point defense. It's like football defensive coordinators who are like "Dammit, I don't care if we give up 30 points through the air, we're not going to have the opponent impose their will on us through the run game !!!"
Right I am not that concerned with Embiid either as he is a bit of a unicorn. You might put Boban out there to keep him from killing you inside and force him to shoot more jumpers which are hit or miss.
I've been pleasantly surprised by DFS but that does seem to be the position we can upgrade without messing with the offensive flow too much.
I'm thinking someone like Otto Porter.
Otherwise I think a lot depends on KP getting his shot and confidence together. Not sure what other moves I would make.
Tristan Thompson seems like a player who should be able to fill out the roll man-role while providing an upgrade inside.
'15-'16: 91st percentile as a PnR rollman
'16-'17: 79th percentile as a PnR rollman
17-'18: 81st percentile as a PnR rollman
Then LeBron left CLE and his numbers took a hit:
- '18-'19: 61st percentile as a PnR rollman
- '19-'20: 35th percentile as a PnR rollman
==> Imo his dip here in PnR-plays is explainable and I'd expect him to bounce back to his older numbers quickly once he plays with a better PG than the kids CLE has at that position.
On the boards Thompson has a higher TRB% and his On-Off-numbers on the boards are also a big plus in comparison to Powell.
I think he is the big man-target who makes the most sense a) stylistically and b) should be within our reach asset-wise without depleting our rotation too much. CLE has a high payroll for a lottery squad and he will be an UFA next summer. Seems like an ideal fit as a trade target for the Lee-contract. Maybe throw in a 2nd round pick and another minimum-guy to make the numbers work (Broekhoff would be enough) and you should be there already.
PF: Porzingis | Kleber
C: Thompson | Powell
would be a heck of a frontcourt with two good rim runners as well as two floor spacers.
(12-03-2019, 05:13 PM)JamesConway Wrote: [ -> ]Tristan Thompson seems like a player who should be able to fill out the roll man-role while providing an upgrade inside.
'15-'16: 91st percentile as a PnR rollman
'16-'17: 79th percentile as a PnR rollman
17-'18: 81st percentile as a PnR rollman
Then LeBron left CLE and his numbers took a hit:
- '18-'19: 61st percentile as a PnR rollman
- '19-'20: 35th percentile as a PnR rollman
==> Imo his dip here in PnR-plays is explainable and I'd expect him to bounce back to his older numbers quickly once he plays with a better PG than the kids CLE has at that position.
On the boards Thompson has a higher TRB% and his On-Off-numbers on the boards are also a big plus in comparison to Powell.
I think he is the big man-target who makes the most sense a) stylistically and b) should be within our reach asset-wise without depleting our rotation too much. CLE has a high payroll for a lottery squad and he will be an UFA next summer. Seems like an ideal fit as a trade target for the Lee-contract. Maybe throw in a 2nd round pick and another minimum-guy to make the numbers work (Broekhoff would be enough) and you should be there already.
PF: Porzingis | Kleber
C: Thompson | Powell
would be a heck of a frontcourt with two good rim runners as well as two floor spacers.
I really, I mean, REALLY like this idea. I think Thompson is the best fairly cheap frontcourt partner for KP. And with Powell back on the 2nd unit, he'll be playing against other teams bench players, which should increase his production.
Tristan Thompson is an interesting guy but is he guarding 4s or 5s most nights? Is he someone who can get out to the perimeter? I haven't watched Thompson since the last finals he was in where he actually played significant minutes.
Watching some YouTube videos Thompson's defense looks pretty salty. There are so many guys like this that could be had for not a lot. I hope the Mavs are smart and grab one to start which will put Powell back into his rightful place as an excellent bench PNR player.
Thompson is the same size as Powell and Kleber. 6'9" 238 lb. Is he more than who we have already? More of the same isn't bad, if the price is right, but IMO that just adds to the inconsistent minutes to the bench and people's pet players (not that that has anything to do with decision making). I will say, he seems to push our two around when they play so if he has that "grown man strength" to go with it, that would be something different. Same age as them too.
Myles Turner looks like a great fit with Luka and KP.
Turner is having a simialr year to KP and is just as up and down each game.
So it is hard to judge his value, Sabonis seem to have jumped him in team priority.
Any chance Indy would do Lee + Maxi + Jackson + GSW 2020 2nd rd pick + 2 other 2nd rd pick.
for
Turner and McDermott
Maxi would be a good fit next to Sabonis and Jackson adds to their youth movement.
Turner and KP would be an awesome shot blocking duo and both can shoot from deep range.
Bit of a pipe dream maybe as other team can offer more, but everyone probably thought the same about KP
(12-03-2019, 09:45 PM)Aussiebballer Wrote: [ -> ]Myles Turner looks like a great fit with Luka and KP.
Turner is having a simialr year to KP and is just as up and down each game.
So it is hard to judge his value, Sabonis seem to have jumped him in team priority.
Any chance Indy would do Lee + Maxi + Jackson + GSW 2020 2nd rd pick + 2 other 2nd rd pick.
for
Turner and McDermott
Maxi would be a good fit next to Sabonis and Jackson adds to their youth movement.
Turner and KP would be an awesome shot blocking duo and both can shoot from deep range.
Bit of a pipe dream maybe as other team can offer more, but everyone probably thought the same about KP
In my opinion, Kleber should be close to untouchable there are not many 3&D guys that can guard Centers and Power Forwards and switch on defense. Kleber is a freaking steal at that price.
This Mavs team has chemistry and I hope they do not blow it up and let them grow and be opportunistic in the trade market and add without much subtraction
The only contract i would move is Courtney Lee's and the Trade Exception.
I think those are enough pieces to improve us dramatically via trade.
Trade Exception to New York for Taj Gibson
Courtney Lee + Utah 2nd Rd Pick to Memphis for Trevor Ariza/Jae Crowder/Michael Kidd Gilchrist/Morris Twin
Myles Turner's career has been mostly ups-and-downs. Everyone expected him to take a leap a few years back and that didn't happen. Not saying he is a bad player or anything, but he might be what he is as this point.
Honestly can't say I watch Indy that much
I may once Oladipo is back
They have Goga Bitadez getting pine poisoning on the bench, which seems a waste so they may consider moving Turner at some point.
Is Turner able to guard guys like A Davis, Embiid and Jokic?
This is probably what the Mavs are missing, plus another quality wing defender.
I like TT over Turner. As was posted above, TT is an outstanding PnR player and a stout and versatile defender (+3.7 RAPTOR - better than anyone on our roster). As an added bonus, he is an elite rebounder - particularly on the offensive side, averaging 4 a game. Can you imagine giving the best offense in the league an extra 4 looks per game? His height has never really been an issue - he doesn't play short. He has been a decent shot blocker this season at 1.2 per.
Turner has legit size and is an elite shot blocker. He is a poor rebounder and a worse defender than TT - despite his prodigious shot block totals (-1.5 RAPTOR - which is worse than Powell). He does bring the 3pt range to the table.
I think that TT is a great fit here. I like his game, his experience, and his attitude. I also love his contract, which is expiring, while Turner's has 4 years on it. I have been on the TT acquisition train all season as the Mav's target big, along with OPJ as our 3D+ wing. Either of those two would be a huge boost for the Mavs. Both would be parade time.
TT could be salary matched with Lee + anything over min filler. Roby even works. I don't think that Brunson would be a filler for Cle as they have 2 young pg lottery picks. I am not saying he could be acquired for that - just that it is the salary match for him.
I am going to go out on a limb here and say that if the Mavs could pull off those two trades, I wouldn't care what future assets they had to cash in, or even if they had to take back salary for '21. A core of Luka/OPJ/DFS/KP/TT (all 26 and under except for TT who is the old man at 28), is all-in as far as I am concerned. I resign TT in FA and go to battle with that crew for the foreseeable future. That team has great offense and defense with solid 2way players. It is young. It rebounds, blocks shots, and stretches the floor. I could imagine giving up on the Giannis dream for such a lineup - and he would still be in play via s/t. haha. Never say die.
Not sure the Cavs are wanting to bottom out that bad.
They have invested a lot in the PG position over the last 2 drafts and if TT is an elite PNR player then they probably want to keep him to help out their PGs.
Maybe they trade him if they think he will leave in free-agency, which is likely unless they over pay him.
Don't know what his market would be since he is an expiring.
![[Image: THE-trade.png]](https://i.ibb.co/RygVH7h/THE-trade.png)
Here is basic framework - you take back salary from one of the teams with the trade exception - both teams have candidates - and throw young players/picks at whoever needs them to say yes. Then go to war.
(12-04-2019, 02:26 AM)Aussiebballer Wrote: [ -> ]Not sure the Cavs are wanting to bottom out that bad.
They have invested a lot in the PG position over the last 2 drafts and if TT is an elite PNR player then they probably want to keep him to help out their PGs.
Maybe they trade him if they think he will leave in free-agency, which is likely unless they over pay him.
Don't know what his market would be since he is an expiring.
See, here is the deal - the stats show that CLE doesn't utilize the PnR like they used to. If you look at the percentiles that were posted above, he was killing it on the PnR while LeBron was there, and then poof... suddenly he doesn't? Also, Beilein is a proponent of 5 out - and he has been praising Nance lately for his ability to hit 3's. I don't think TT is in their plans after the season.
So you have a player that has history as a really good PnR player on a team that values other skillsets and under utilizes what he does.