(12-16-2019, 07:33 PM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]Thybulle and O´Quinn would fit all our needs
True. I might also take Mike Scott straight up for Curry. Scott isn’t known as a defensive stopper but he might be able to match up with Harrell in a small lineup. He’s a damn fine shooter too. Sixers would only swap him for Curry if they think it brings more balance to their lineup.
Now that I think about it, wasn’t O’quinn the designated beef next to KP in New York?
We are finally back to the days where our draft picks likely don’t make the team. So why collect more second rounders? You don’t see teams clamoring for them in trades. They’re just filler, no? Once in a blue moon you maybe catch lightening in a bottle, as Fish used to say. But we’ve been striking out with first rounders outside the top 3. So I wouldn’t give up much for another second.
(12-16-2019, 07:43 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ]We can do way better and do OKC more favour by taking Roberson in the TE
You can’t propose a reasonable trade with the Mavs taking on $36+ million from the Thunder.
(12-16-2019, 07:33 PM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]Knicks 2020 2nd
Hawks 2020 2nd
Smith
O´Quinn
for
Curry.
That would virtually guarantee you three free shots between 31-36 on draft night. Combined with our own pick (18-22) it would also allow you to move up into the lottery range, maybe picks 12-15, or cash in your four picks for a top player.
I know the Mavs probably don´t think that way, because they value the veteran player over the asset game, but this sounds really interesting to me.
Woj/Lowe mentioned Philly's need for a shooter. They talked in terms of Zhaire Smith and Mike Scott being the outgoing for such a player. Philly has a full roster, so it either needs to be a 2 for 2 deal or Philly has to dump a current player.
I like O'Quinn, but there are several reasons why it probably needs to be Scott from their perspective. Philly needs O'Quinn more than they need Scott as injury insurance for Embiid. Scott makes more and if this ends up being Curry + Anyone (Roby or Broekhoff for instance), then the salary with Q'Quinn instead of Scott doesn't match. Philly is under the LT, but won't be if they take back too much salary in a deal like this.
I think Curry for Zhaire (Scott is essentially a useful throw in) is exceedingly fair. It is a bet that Zhaire will be the better player with time. We have time. Philly is more of a title contender than we are in 2020. IF the scouts believe in the Zhaire's upside, I'd be all in. I'm not sure we are getting any seconds in a deal like this. Smith is the prize here.
(12-16-2019, 08:03 PM)vfromlmf Wrote: [ -> ]You can’t propose a reasonable trade with the Mavs taking on $36+ million from the Thunder.
Of course you can, if you take him in our TE.
Example: Seth+Lee+GSW second for Adams and Roberson in our TE. You keep Brunson for a favour of taking Roberson.
Your proposal with Philly is ok, but Philly needs to give way more than just Scott.
(12-16-2019, 08:10 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ] (12-16-2019, 08:03 PM)vfromlmf Wrote: [ -> ]You can’t propose a reasonable trade with the Mavs taking on $36+ million from the Thunder.
Of course you can, if you take him in our TE.
Example: Seth+Lee+GSW second for Adams and Roberson in our TE. You keep Brunson for a favour of taking Roberson.
Your proposal with Philly is ok, but Philly needs to give way more than just Scott.
Pretty sure that trade exceeds the hard cap...
Any trade that Dallas generats cannot return more than 18 million in salary.
(12-16-2019, 08:06 PM)DanSchwartzman Wrote: [ -> ] (12-16-2019, 07:33 PM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]Knicks 2020 2nd
Hawks 2020 2nd
Smith
O´Quinn
for
Curry.
That would virtually guarantee you three free shots between 31-36 on draft night. Combined with our own pick (18-22) it would also allow you to move up into the lottery range, maybe picks 12-15, or cash in your four picks for a top player.
I know the Mavs probably don´t think that way, because they value the veteran player over the asset game, but this sounds really interesting to me.
Woj/Lowe mentioned Philly's need for a shooter. They talked in terms of Zhaire Smith and Mike Scott being the outgoing for such a player. Philly has a full roster, so it either needs to be a 2 for 2 deal or Philly has to dump a current player.
I like O'Quinn, but there are several reasons why it probably needs to be Scott from their perspective. Philly needs O'Quinn more than they need Scott as injury insurance for Embiid. Scott makes more and if this ends up being Curry + Anyone (Roby or Broekhoff for instance), then the salary with Q'Quinn instead of Scott doesn't match. Philly is under the LT, but won't be if they take back too much salary in a deal like this.
I think Curry for Zhaire (Scott is essentially a useful throw in) is exceedingly fair. It is a bet that Zhaire will be the better player with time. We have time. Philly is more of a title contender than we are in 2020. IF the scouts believe in the Zhaire's upside, I'd be all in. I'm not sure we are getting any seconds in a deal like this. Smith is the prize here.
The last few games are a bad time to propose trading Curry.
(12-16-2019, 09:53 PM)SkenfromLMF Wrote: [ -> ] (12-16-2019, 08:10 PM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ] (12-16-2019, 08:03 PM)vfromlmf Wrote: [ -> ]You can’t propose a reasonable trade with the Mavs taking on $36+ million from the Thunder.
Of course you can, if you take him in our TE.
Example: Seth+Lee+GSW second for Adams and Roberson in our TE. You keep Brunson for a favour of taking Roberson.
Your proposal with Philly is ok, but Philly needs to give way more than just Scott.
Pretty sure that trade exceeds the hard cap...
Any trade that Dallas generats cannot return more than 18 million in salary.
The spread is only about $16 million (so less than the $18.5 of space before we get to the hard cap). The issue is that Lee/Curry misses being a trade match for Adams by about $460k.
(12-16-2019, 10:18 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]The last few games are a bad time to propose trading Curry.
Indeed. I take back my proposal!
Turn Lee for a serviceable player and let's go to war...
Honestly, at this point I think the Mavs should wait till the offseason and package their first, GSW 2nd, UTA 2nd, and the Miami 2nd along with THJ Brunson and maybe Jackson and go ALL in trying to get Beal.
Imagine this team with Beal, instead of THJ?? Beal is a true SG, and can hit it from anywhere. He's one of the most lethal spot up shooters in the league and doesn't make boneheaded mistakes.
It'd have to wait until the offseason, during the draft. But THJ (who'll be an expiring deal), Brunson, Jackson, a first, and 3 2nds is a really strong deal for a rebuilding team.
In the meantime, I think trying to turn Lee into Iggy is the smartest move and wouldn't cost any of the above assets,
(12-16-2019, 11:31 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly, at this point I think the Mavs should wait till the offseason and package their first, GSW 2nd, UTA 2nd, and the Miami 2nd along with THJ Brunson and maybe Jackson and go ALL in trying to get Beal.
Imagine this team with Beal, instead of THJ?? Beal is a true SG, and can hit it from anywhere. He's one of the most lethal spot up shooters in the league and doesn't make boneheaded mistakes.
It'd have to wait until the offseason, during the draft. But THJ (who'll be an expiring deal), Brunson, Jackson, a first, and 3 2nds is a really strong deal for a rebuilding team.
In the meantime, I think trying to turn Lee into Iggy is the smartest move and wouldn't cost any of the above assets,
Wizards can get much better deal than this IMO.
(12-16-2019, 11:31 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly, at this point I think the Mavs should wait till the offseason and package their first, GSW 2nd, UTA 2nd, and the Miami 2nd along with THJ Brunson and maybe Jackson and go ALL in trying to get Beal.
Imagine this team with Beal, instead of THJ?? Beal is a true SG, and can hit it from anywhere. He's one of the most lethal spot up shooters in the league and doesn't make boneheaded mistakes.
It'd have to wait until the offseason, during the draft. But THJ (who'll be an expiring deal), Brunson, Jackson, a first, and 3 2nds is a really strong deal for a rebuilding team.
In the meantime, I think trying to turn Lee into Iggy is the smartest move and wouldn't cost any of the above assets,
Beal would be perfect, but as someone else said, even with all of that we probably don't have enough. However, Jrue might be available for this load.
Imagine also, we turn Lee and TE into another first and a second. Perhaps than we can build a package even for Beal. I would definitely not waste assets for anything that doesn't make us better in the long run. Iggy doesn't.
Beal is great but do we really need more offense enough to use all of our assets?
(12-16-2019, 10:18 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ] (12-16-2019, 08:06 PM)DanSchwartzman Wrote: [ -> ] (12-16-2019, 07:33 PM)Mavs2019 Wrote: [ -> ]Knicks 2020 2nd
Hawks 2020 2nd
Smith
O´Quinn
for
Curry.
That would virtually guarantee you three free shots between 31-36 on draft night. Combined with our own pick (18-22) it would also allow you to move up into the lottery range, maybe picks 12-15, or cash in your four picks for a top player.
I know the Mavs probably don´t think that way, because they value the veteran player over the asset game, but this sounds really interesting to me.
Woj/Lowe mentioned Philly's need for a shooter. They talked in terms of Zhaire Smith and Mike Scott being the outgoing for such a player. Philly has a full roster, so it either needs to be a 2 for 2 deal or Philly has to dump a current player.
I like O'Quinn, but there are several reasons why it probably needs to be Scott from their perspective. Philly needs O'Quinn more than they need Scott as injury insurance for Embiid. Scott makes more and if this ends up being Curry + Anyone (Roby or Broekhoff for instance), then the salary with Q'Quinn instead of Scott doesn't match. Philly is under the LT, but won't be if they take back too much salary in a deal like this.
I think Curry for Zhaire (Scott is essentially a useful throw in) is exceedingly fair. It is a bet that Zhaire will be the better player with time. We have time. Philly is more of a title contender than we are in 2020. IF the scouts believe in the Zhaire's upside, I'd be all in. I'm not sure we are getting any seconds in a deal like this. Smith is the prize here.
The last few games are a bad time to propose trading Curry.
Also priority A-Z is keeping our young stars happy. Zhaire Smith is a great athlete who came out raw as hamburger meat and missed all of his rookie year. Modern wings now develop slower than other positiions. It could be another 3 years before Zhaire develops his 3 point shot and learns all the nuances of high level switchable perimeter defense, which is a lot more complicated than "stay in front of your man". I see no reason why Zhaire is any further along to providing 3-D answers than Roby or Reaves. I dont think Luka and KP are here to play for a developmental team.
(12-16-2019, 11:31 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly, at this point I think the Mavs should wait till the offseason and package their first, GSW 2nd, UTA 2nd, and the Miami 2nd along with THJ Brunson and maybe Jackson and go ALL in trying to get Beal.
Imagine this team with Beal, instead of THJ?? Beal is a true SG, and can hit it from anywhere. He's one of the most lethal spot up shooters in the league and doesn't make boneheaded mistakes.
It'd have to wait until the offseason, during the draft. But THJ (who'll be an expiring deal), Brunson, Jackson, a first, and 3 2nds is a really strong deal for a rebuilding team.
In the meantime, I think trying to turn Lee into Iggy is the smartest move and wouldn't cost any of the above assets,
Mavs aren't getting Beal. If Wiz ever trade Beal it's going to be for a monster package. Lee into Iggy is a great idea. I think Mavs can be opportunistic. Our contracts are looking great right now. Curry's deal, DFS, Wright, Justin Jackson, Jalen Brunson, Maxi Kleber - these are all very good players that don't cost much. I think Curry has a lot of value. I would not be opposed to selling him at the TDL for the right price when his value could be at an all-time high. On this team I think Curry is a great 6th man. He should be the first guy off the bench every night. I am not sure what I would trade him for at this point that would really move the needle. I think a package that lands Aaron Gordon would be one. Robert Convington would be another just because he fits more of a position of need but not sure Wolves would prefer Curry over RoCo.
A follow-up on Curry and fake trades - who says no to this?
Curry + DFS for Robert Covington.
Robert Covington is an elite 3D player but the issue is that the Wolves might still be a couple years away from being good. DFS is younger and fits more in their window. Curry is an elite shooter and might start for them. They don't have a lot of playmaking guards.
Mavs would have a Luka, KP and Covington as their core going forward. They still have picks and things to make other moves. In 2021 Mavs still have those 3 and a max slot to chase a big fish like a Giannis (the holy grail of FAs). Mavs will have the most compelling case for a max FA than they have ever had. 2 young stars in their prime, a 3D specialist and likely multiple playoff appearances. Giannis has been a pipedream but imagine what a team looks like with a Giannis/KP front-court and Luka. By then the LeBron is old, the Clippers are older, the Warriors are older. The Mavs would be the favorite to win multiple titles.
I don't think Giannis will leave because I think he wants to do it on his own, not join a super-team but you never know. The Bucks will be older with aging, highly paid Middleton, Bledsoe, Lopez on the books.
Mavs would still be a good spot for other FA's and may not need a star with the core they have.
I agree on Giannis. He will be like Dirk and play his entire career in Milwaukee. He's a alpha. He's not going to team up for a super team.
(12-17-2019, 02:45 AM)khaled1987 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-16-2019, 11:31 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly, at this point I think the Mavs should wait till the offseason and package their first, GSW 2nd, UTA 2nd, and the Miami 2nd along with THJ Brunson and maybe Jackson and go ALL in trying to get Beal.
Imagine this team with Beal, instead of THJ?? Beal is a true SG, and can hit it from anywhere. He's one of the most lethal spot up shooters in the league and doesn't make boneheaded mistakes.
It'd have to wait until the offseason, during the draft. But THJ (who'll be an expiring deal), Brunson, Jackson, a first, and 3 2nds is a really strong deal for a rebuilding team.
In the meantime, I think trying to turn Lee into Iggy is the smartest move and wouldn't cost any of the above assets,
Wizards can get much better deal than this IMO.
Thats fair. Miami comes to mind as a team that would be willing to fork out multiple picks for Beal, but the fit would be incredibly awkward with Butler. Knicks maybe?
(12-17-2019, 11:21 AM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]A follow-up on Curry and fake trades - who says no to this?
Curry + DFS for Robert Covington.
Robert Covington is an elite 3D player but the issue is that the Wolves might still be a couple years away from being good. DFS is younger and fits more in their window. Curry is an elite shooter and might start for them. They don't have a lot of playmaking guards.
Mavs would have a Luka, KP and Covington as their core going forward. They still have picks and things to make other moves. In 2021 Mavs still have those 3 and a max slot to chase a big fish like a Giannis (the holy grail of FAs). Mavs will have the most compelling case for a max FA than they have ever had. 2 young stars in their prime, a 3D specialist and likely multiple playoff appearances. Giannis has been a pipedream but imagine what a team looks like with a Giannis/KP front-court and Luka. By then the LeBron is old, the Clippers are older, the Warriors are older. The Mavs would be the favorite to win multiple titles.
I don't think Giannis will leave because I think he wants to do it on his own, not join a super-team but you never know. The Bucks will be older with aging, highly paid Middleton, Bledsoe, Lopez on the books.
Mavs would still be a good spot for other FA's and may not need a star with the core they have.
I think the Mavs take 1 step forward, and 2 steps back with that trade. RoCo would be fantastic here, but giving up our best 3 point shooter, and best defender to get him doesn't make sense to me. Even if RoCo is a good 3pt shooter and defender, the whole idea is to add that to this team, so if anything it'd be a net neutral trade, but we get rid of some serious scoring punch from our bench and move it to the starting lineup.
(12-17-2019, 11:57 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]I think the Mavs take 1 step forward, and 2 steps back with that trade. RoCo would be fantastic here, but giving up our best 3 point shooter, and best defender to get him doesn't make sense to me. Even if RoCo is a good 3pt shooter and defender, the whole idea is to add that to this team, so if anything it'd be a net neutral trade, but we get rid of some serious scoring punch from our bench and move it to the starting lineup.
You might be right. My thought process though is that RoCo is a significant upgrade in both 3 & D over DFS. We have hopes that DFS will continue to improve his shooting and we have seen it tick up. I thought RoCo's percentage was higher honestly but I think think he is a more reliable shooter overall. At some point we need a handful of guys that can do multiple things at an elite level vs 10 guys who do some things very well.