(06-22-2021, 10:58 AM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]I am not talking about you, probably mostly about those jumping on the statements of @"F Gump." He is speaking like he is some special insider. Well then out yourself, or you are just a JAG posturing on the internet like someone who knows stuff.
Well, I don't think Mr. Gump is exactly in the closet. But to your point, if he knows this stuff I want him to shout it from the roof tops! If Cato's article added a little pressure to the situation, let's add some more pressure!
(06-22-2021, 12:08 PM)fifteenth Wrote: [ -> ]Well, I don't think Mr. Gump is exactly in the closet. But to your point, if he knows this stuff I want him to shout it from the roof tops! If Cato's article added a little pressure to the situation, let's add some more pressure!
I very much agree with this. The more pressure put on him the more chance change happens.
(06-22-2021, 11:04 AM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]If those who think Cuban is helplessly dysfunctional are right, then seriously we should STOP being fans right now, no joke.
This is exactly why I've made multiple "I might be done if..." statements since Cato dropped his article. I'm actually not kidding.
While maybe not the exact same thing, there was definitely a recent thread where someone said that Donnie Nelson doesn't know anything about basketball and that it was obvious they knew more than he did. It happens all the time. Look at all the people who think they can beat Brian Scalabrine 1v1. The NBA is a completely different level. You don't work in the NBA for over 20 years unless you know what you are talking about.
(06-22-2021, 11:30 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: [ -> ]He coaches a brand of basketball that is great for the regular season, horrible for the playoffs and too many people think he’s great because of it. His best chance to win with his style was with Phoenix, but he couldn’t do it. Then people make excuses that if this or that did/didn’t happen he would have a championship. It’s similar to the LeBron excuses to me when people try to make the GoaT argument for him.
I think I agree largely with your overall main point that Mike Dantoni led teams typically underperform given their expectations in the playoffs, but I do also think calling his playstyle "horrible" for playoff basketball is a step too far.
With PHX it seemed like he didn't lean into his run'n'gun style enough, by running plodding centers and never truly embracing small ball. NYK never had a chance at any point and I found it remarkable he even led them to the playoffs anyways.
His brief stop in tinsel town found his only playoff appearance tainted by a Kobe season ending injury, dooming it from the start.
In HOU he was apart of the only team that truly gave the Warriors super team a run for their money and if it wasn't for a CP3 injury they could've won it all.
I know you're probably thinking that all I'm doing is making excuses, and to a point I am. But I'm also trying to provide context as well. In PHX he made it to the WCF but was bested by Dirk and Co. In HOU he also made it to the WCF and was bested (barely) by what was probably the best team of all time.
Hard to fault him for that. He's still been a superbly winning coach for a long time in the NBA. The Mavs could do a lot worse than him.
And another thing to think about, imagine what MDA could do with Luka offensively. Luka basically encompasses all the dream attributes MDA has wanted for 20 years, except has none of the draw backs of Nash and Harden (size and general ball hogging).
(06-22-2021, 11:04 AM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]I am not being the "feeling police" (please feel whatever you want!). I am just trying to bring some nuance to our processing of the narratives. I am really sorry that your favorite part of the Mavs is gone. I hope you continue to have the chance to mourn and grieve that.
But there is a very real possibility that your favorite part of the Mavs was a huge part of some terrible dysfunction and the Mavs are going to have a chance to get a lot better now that this has all happened. There is also a chance that RC wasn't part of the dysfunction and maybe Cuban is just toxic and this team is only going to get worse until he dies or sells the team.
My point: NONE OF US KNOWS and only TIME WILL TELL.
If those who think Cuban is helplessly dysfunctional are right, then seriously we should STOP being fans right now, no joke.
If those who think RC was a big part of the problem are right, then we have lots to look forward to and should be excited at the changes.
And there are lots of other nuanced possibilities here, I am just offering examples.
Man, I don’t disagree with a word of this. I guess my issue is when people blow the whistle on things that they do themselves when they don’t like the conclusions being offered by others.
You, me, everyone. We’re all right sometimes, wrong other times. There are opinions that drive all of us crazy.
When we agree with how the dots are connected by someone else, we say things like “yeah“ or “bingo.” When we disagree, we start talking about being “locked into narratives” and “psychology.”
Maybe I shouldn’t feel this way - maybe it is oversensitive of me. But, while I think it’s possible that Cuban might knock one out of the park for our Mavs this summer (man I sure hope so!) I don’t think it’s fair to accuse those who are skeptical about that (based on 20+ years of track record) of being unwillingly roped into some logic loop that they are powerless to escape. That, to me, is insulting on a deep level. We’re all thinking. We’re all using our brains with purpose. We should at least offer each other the minimum level of respect needed to assume that, no?
Oh my Gosh we need some news. My head hurts from trying to read this.
We are all Mavs fans I hope so thumbs up to all.
(06-22-2021, 02:35 PM)ReunionMav Wrote: [ -> ]Oh my Gosh we need some news.
The Mavs have a day and a half left before I start melting down over us not having a new GM yet. I'm going to go into a day count on Thursday if the new guy isn't hired yet. I understand that they have to get this right, but there's no time to waste.
(06-22-2021, 03:05 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: [ -> ]The Mavs have a day and a half left before I start melting down over us not having a new GM yet. I'm going to go into a day count on Thursday if the new guy isn't hired yet. I understand that they have to get this right, but there's no time to waste.
I'd rather them punt on the draft or whatever as long as they hire the right guy.
Free agency starts August. If they hire the GM mid july it gives them 3 weeks to scout for targets which should be enough time.
(06-22-2021, 03:21 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]I'd rather them punt on the draft or whatever as long as they hire the right guy.
It's a good point, tbh.
As much as we might hope there's a way the Mavs can use draft night to their advantage (which is possible), it's true that they don't have a pick, so it's not like just sitting that night out would be the absolute end of the world, especially when compared to the problems that will arise from hiring the wrong guy.
(06-22-2021, 01:44 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I don’t think it’s fair to accuse those who are skeptical about that (based on 20+ years of track record) of being unwillingly roped into some logic loop that they are powerless to escape.
Cuban's track record includes 13 years of your favorite part of the Mavericks. If you are going to say that Cuban has a 20 year track record of bad decisions, then RC should be front and center of that.
I am just suggesting that it is unfair to elevate RC without elevating Cuban....and it is unfair to denigrate RC without denigrating Cuban. They are deeply entangled for better or worse. If Cuban was SO dysfunctional for the last 20 years then RC was also HUGELY dysfunctional for staying. Their fates rise and fall together.
(06-22-2021, 05:24 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]I am just suggesting that it is unfair to elevate RC without elevating Cuban....and it is unfair to denigrate RC without denigrating Cuban. They are deeply entangled for better or worse. If Cuban was SO dysfunctional for the last 20 years then RC was also HUGELY dysfunctional for staying. Their fates rise and fall together.
This isn’t really the topic I was trying to discuss with you, but for the record, I think this is astute.
(06-22-2021, 05:29 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]This isn’t really the topic I was trying to discuss with you, but for the record, I think this is astute.
So what are you wanting to discuss with me? Happy to engage.
Because that was some of the heart of what I have been trying to discuss.
(06-22-2021, 07:25 AM)Branduil Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not going to comment on what RC did to Salah because I don't know, but if Luka even perceived it that way, it's certainly a problem. It's often a fine line between a "tough" coach and an abusive coach, and I think it's critical for players to believe that their coach is being hard on them in order to improve them and not just for their own gratification.
Didn’t RC apologize to Salah? How many coaches man up and apologize to a fringe player? I am not saying RC was a player’s coach, but you can’t be a total jerk and coach one team for so long. That is implying that players like Dirk and JJB turned a blind eye to a lot of abusive behavior to lesser players over the years, which I am not buying.
(06-22-2021, 01:39 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]I think I agree largely with your overall main point that Mike Dantoni led teams typically underperform given their expectations in the playoffs, but I do also think calling his playstyle "horrible" for playoff basketball is a step too far.
With PHX it seemed like he didn't lean into his run'n'gun style enough, by running plodding centers and never truly embracing small ball. NYK never had a chance at any point and I found it remarkable he even led them to the playoffs anyways.
His brief stop in tinsel town found his only playoff appearance tainted by a Kobe season ending injury, dooming it from the start.
In HOU he was apart of the only team that truly gave the Warriors super team a run for their money and if it wasn't for a CP3 injury they could've won it all.
I know you're probably thinking that all I'm doing is making excuses, and to a point I am. But I'm also trying to provide context as well. In PHX he made it to the WCF but was bested by Dirk and Co. In HOU he also made it to the WCF and was bested (barely) by what was probably the best team of all time.
Hard to fault him for that. He's still been a superbly winning coach for a long time in the NBA. The Mavs could do a lot worse than him.
And another thing to think about, imagine what MDA could do with Luka offensively. Luka basically encompasses all the dream attributes MDA has wanted for 20 years, except has none of the draw backs of Nash and Harden (size and general ball hogging).
And playing defence is a lost case in this league whatever you do. So his all-offence approach was never more up-to-date.
(06-22-2021, 01:39 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]I think I agree largely with your overall main point that Mike Dantoni led teams typically underperform given their expectations in the playoffs, but I do also think calling his playstyle "horrible" for playoff basketball is a step too far.
With PHX it seemed like he didn't lean into his run'n'gun style enough, by running plodding centers and never truly embracing small ball. NYK never had a chance at any point and I found it remarkable he even led them to the playoffs anyways.
His brief stop in tinsel town found his only playoff appearance tainted by a Kobe season ending injury, dooming it from the start.
In HOU he was apart of the only team that truly gave the Warriors super team a run for their money and if it wasn't for a CP3 injury they could've won it all.
I know you're probably thinking that all I'm doing is making excuses, and to a point I am. But I'm also trying to provide context as well. In PHX he made it to the WCF but was bested by Dirk and Co. In HOU he also made it to the WCF and was bested (barely) by what was probably the best team of all time.
Hard to fault him for that. He's still been a superbly winning coach for a long time in the NBA. The Mavs could do a lot worse than him.
And another thing to think about, imagine what MDA could do with Luka offensively. Luka basically encompasses all the dream attributes MDA has wanted for 20 years, except has none of the draw backs of Nash and Harden (size and general ball hogging).
Sure, why not. At least he's a respected name.
(06-22-2021, 03:21 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: [ -> ]I'd rather them punt on the draft or whatever as long as they hire the right guy.
Free agency starts August. If they hire the GM mid july it gives them 3 weeks to scout for targets which should be enough time.
Most trades happen draft day...
(06-23-2021, 02:36 AM)omahen Wrote: [ -> ]Most trades happen draft day...
Very true.
But I'd rather make the right choice (if I could see into a crystal ball and know) and take the extra time rather than rush in the hopes of participating on draft day.
Steins latest report does not have me optimistic.