(06-18-2021, 03:23 PM)mavsluvr Wrote: [ -> ]I have thought about this quite a bit.
Gambling Bob prolly told him he couldn't use Boban in the regular season.
If Gambling Bob had that much control over the regular season rotations, I think Josh Green would have got a lot more minutes.
(06-18-2021, 03:16 PM)HanspardsShowerVoice Wrote: [ -> ]One thing that drove me crazy this year was Rick's refusal to even consider using Boban in the regular season. I'm not saying play Boban 20 minutes a night, but play him 5-10 minutes at least !!! He's a useful player with a unique skillset that is okay to use in a limited role. And someday he could provide a mismatch in a critical game that could come in handy. But he just made up his mind that he wasn't going to use Boban, and that was that. So many DNP-CDs night after night after night. Boban is basically reduced down to team mascot for whatever reason ... fine.
So here we get into the playoffs and ... wow, a shocking turn of events ... a team goes small against us. Who could have seen this coming, other than anyone who has paid attention to the direction of basketball for the last 5-10 years? Okay, so now suddenly it's time to dust off Boban and put him to use in a twin towers lineup with KP in a zone ... except the Mavs haven't practiced this lineup at all in the regular season and it looks just as haphazzard and discombobulated as you would expect. So I guess a baskeball dullard like me doesn't understand .. was there not any inkling that a team might go small against us? Why was this lineup, which wasnt worth playing 5 minutes against the Minnesota Timberwolves in February, suddenly became our staple lineup in the playoffs against the Clippers? So it's like Rick just throws up his hands and says "Don't look at me, I'm just working with what I have. Look at all the creativity and the the mechanizations I've had to invent !!" But regardless of the Xs and Os wizardry, he didn't put his players in the best position and it started back in the regular season.
What's ultimately frustrating about this to ME, is that we don't even know who decided not to play Boban during the regular season, or who decided he was the solution in the playoffs. I kind of disagree with your take on how Boban should've been used more, but I can't even get interested in arguing the point, really. The organization has been run with such chaos (coupled with intentional secrecy, which I USED to value in the Mavs) that the plan motivating all of this is completely unclear, imo.
(06-18-2021, 03:13 PM)mavsluvr Wrote: [ -> ]Maybe in an ideal world, it would work that way, but bosses berating their employees is not that uncommon in corporate life, and the corporate entity almost always sides with the person who is more important to the organization (usually, the boss). The berated employee eventually leaves, and life goes on.
I'm not saying this is a good thing, just not that unusual. Also, we don't know that RC berated Salah for 12 months because he was in a weak position to defend himself, on account of Rick's simply needing a punching bag for his anger management problems. I heard the McMahon interview, and he didn't say that. Just to keep things real.
Guess Doncic was the boss and curb-stomped the mid-level peasant Carlisle.
Luka comes from European basketball. Carlisle is a little lamb compared to their tempers, but what always bothered me with Carlisle is that he never seemed to treat everybody with the same level of dis/respect. He played favours and treated players differently. He´d snap at certain players for mistakes and ignore them with others (mostly played out at the rookie/veteran or contract value level). I´m sure it´s not isolated incidents, if a young player steps up to the headcoach for abrasive behaviour.
(06-18-2021, 03:27 PM)HanspardsShowerVoice Wrote: [ -> ]If Gambling Bob had that much control over the regular season rotations, I think Josh Green would have got a lot more minutes.
But what makes you think it was so binary?
I'm not even trying to push blame for anything away from Carlisle here, I'm just saying that to ME, there doesn't seem evidence of ANY stable, consistent approach, given what we've learned. I see evidence that the wind was nearly constantly changing directions, which is a stark contrast to the stability we've always thought the organization was built upon, to the frustration of some and the pride of others.
What we've learned this week, to me, is that we don't know anything about the Mavericks.
(06-18-2021, 03:24 PM)hakeemfaan Wrote: [ -> ]You can be a terrific coach and atilll not win a title because 3 friends decided to join and brought a coach along for the ride.
In Miami, NY or LA. Don´t think it will happen in a smaller market. Dallas is a big market but still all about football and not among the places to be for black athletes. If Luka ever joins a superteam it probably won´t be in Dallas.
(06-18-2021, 03:24 PM)hakeemfaan Wrote: [ -> ]You can be smart and still be a difficult person to deal with.
The championship gave him a lot of clout. The fact that almost everyone, including his detractors don’t question his Xs and Os also gave him a lot of clout. Cuban didn’t retain him all these years just out of loyalty.
However the new NBA is all about superteams and stars deciding who should be accorded the privilege to coach them. I don’t know how much Xs and Os matter anymore. You can be a terrific coach and atilll not win a title because 3 friends decided to join and brought a coach along for the ride.
Well, one thing's for sure. YOU'RE smart. This is a great post, and I don't disagree with any of it...except for that emboldened part.
Yeah, they matter. They'll always matter. Now, what you might have meant by that is probably a point about relativity to other attributes, and that might be accurate. But, I get the sense from some that an unqualified coach who happens to be a great manager of people is preferable to a great basketball mind who is not. I think that's ridiculous.
I can get behind the idea that exceptional people skills are one component of the qualification set for this job, combined with great understanding of strategic basketball, the ability to teach concepts efficiently, etc. I just worry that people's thinking has become so binary that we believe it's the ONLY thing that matters.
(06-18-2021, 03:31 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: [ -> ]Guess Doncic was the boss and curb-stomped the mid-level peasant Carlisle.
Could be, lol.
Luka comes from European basketball. Carlisle is a little lamb compared to their tempers, but what always bothered me with Carlisle is that he never seemed to treat everybody with the same level of dis/respect. He played favours and treated players differently. He´d snap at certain players for mistakes and ignore them with others (mostly played out at the rookie/veteran or contract value level). I´m sure it´s not isolated incidents, if a young player steps up to the headcoach for abrasive behaviour.
Yeah, treating different people differently can actually often be appropriate in business and in life, and unfortunately, favoritism is pretty common. I don't really see Carlisle as outside the realm of common experience, but I don't deny that he has had some problems and made some mistakes.
To me, Tim McMahon might have put his finger on it. He thinks that Rick is just not a natural people person. He often presents a gruff exterior, although somewhere inside, there is apparently a caring person. He says Rick has actually tried to be a better people guy, but it doesn't come naturally to him.
Maybe in the next coaching hire, you sacrifice some of his tactical genius and intense drive for someone who is a little better at relationships. That doesn't mean that Carlisle has to be branded as the incarnation of Satan in terms of how he treated people.
(06-18-2021, 03:33 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: [ -> ]In Miami, NY or LA. Don´t think it will happen in a smaller market. Dallas is a big market but still all about football and not among the places to be for black athletes. If Luka ever joins a superteam it probably won´t be in Dallas.
I didn’t say Dallas. I have long maintained that the Mavs should run their franchise like does Utah. Get a solid coach. Build a good defense and get good players. They might never win a title but I can root for that. The Mavs issue is that Cuban sees the Cowboys but the Mavs will never be the Cowboys even if they win 5 titles over the next decade, and the Cowboys are still floundering.
(06-18-2021, 03:39 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Well, one thing's for sure. YOU'RE smart. This is a great post, and I don't disagree with any of it...except for that emboldened part.
Yeah, they matter. They'll always matter. Now, what you might have meant by that is probably a point about relativity to other attributes, and that might be accurate. But, I get the sense from some that an unqualified coach who happens to be a great manager of people is preferable to a great basketball mind who is not. I think that's ridiculous.
I can get behind the idea that exceptional people skills are one component of the qualification set for this job, combined with great understanding of strategic basketball, the ability to teach concepts efficiently, etc. I just worry that people's thinking has become so binary that we believe it's the ONLY thing that matters.
I agree with you Check my later post about comparisons to the Jazz.
(06-18-2021, 01:46 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]Clearly, the analytics say KP should just space the floor.
I’ve been away for a bit … what analytics are u talkin bout?
(06-18-2021, 04:01 PM)hakeemfaan Wrote: [ -> ]I didn’t say Dallas. I have long maintained that the Mavs should run their franchise like does Utah. Get a solid coach. Build a good defense and get good players. They might never win a title but I can root for that. The Mavs issue is that Cuban sees the Cowboys but the Mavs will never be the Cowboys even if they win 5 titles over the next decade, and the Cowboys are still floundering.
I agree with you Check my later post about comparisons to the Jazz.
I'd do unholy things to have Snyder as our coach. Their front office too.
(06-17-2021, 08:52 PM)khaled1987 Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, not going to happen.
You can't do it while you announced his departure, what are we going to do if whatever team he is going to coach said no ? Keep him as coach against his own well? They will call your bluff.
Never mind we don't know if he is going to coach next season, might take a season off.
You require RC to sit out two seasons.
This is similar to Doc Rivers. Doc wasn't coming back and LAC wanted a championship winning coach. There aren't exactly a lot of those lying around. A late first isn't a big ask if a team thinks they are close and their window is limited. If the Bucks lose tomorrow and they think RC is the new voice they need, the 27th overall pick is chump change.
(06-18-2021, 02:20 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ](3 hours ago)Jommybone Wrote: Wrote:Whoa, there, really???!!! That is welcome news to me!
Which part?
The part where you said KP’s efficiency #s had improved in Dallas and suggested he should be used as a spacer. That’s welcome news because I had the impression his advanced stats were trash given the stats guys’ opinions of him here.
If he’s a valuable spacer with improving efficiency #s, there is a good role for him here, and he’ll be in demand via trade. (Will he accept the role that’s available to him? I don’t know. But what choice does he really have?)
(06-18-2021, 05:24 PM)Jommybone Wrote: [ -> ]If he’s a valuable spacer with improving efficiency #s, there is a good role for him here, and he’ll be in demand via trade.
Well, as @"dirkfansince1998" has been saying, this season was an improvement for him efficiency wise, and he believes (and I agree) that the numbers are due to limiting the kind of shots KP himself believes are "his game." Those shots weren't particular effective, efficiency wise, although they did play a part in flashing the potential we all used to salivate over.
So, in a way, the way he has been used here is an improvement, but in another way, it still sucks. He's not being PAID the way a player being used the way he's being used should be, really.
MY take is that until he's not consistently the 10th best defender on the floor EVERY time he's on the floor, whichever team employs him is gong to have some problems. I'd HAPPILY indulge whatever offensive development the people who still believe in him "just know" is still possible, if only he could play the type of defense a 7'3" guy should be able give the team.
KP is done here...it just depends on what level of return the new GM can get back. I don't think you can repair the damage between him and Luka/Cuban at this point. Plus, his brother/family are probably still very much in his ear and influencing him.
(06-18-2021, 05:24 PM)Jommybone Wrote: [ -> ]If he’s a valuable spacer with improving efficiency #s, there is a good role for him here, and he’ll be in demand via trade.
*SMALL SAMPLE SIZE ALERT*
In the playoffs (336 mins) KP was +18.7 on O and -8.8 on D....overall +9.9 on/off.
That is positive......BUT he spent 191 of his 233 mins on court with Luka (+35.3) and DFS (+42.7) who had video game numbers. So the reality is this:
![[Image: Screenshot-2021-06-18-5.37.36-PM.png]](http://stlukeskck.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/Screenshot-2021-06-18-5.37.36-PM.png)
GOOD NEWS: KP with Luka and DFS was part of a lineup that would have soundly beat the Clippers.
BAD NEWS: KP without those guys was part of some of the worst playoff basketball of the year.
So to the point: I think KP in that "non-star" role CAN be a plus....but if you take him away from the heavy lifters he will not fill in to carry a team.
NOTE: With a new coach this could ALL change potentially.
(06-18-2021, 05:31 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]… He's not being PAID the way a player being used the way he's being used should be, really.
Don’t care about his pay. Sunk cost. And I understand it to the penny. Care about his ability as a player—cause that determines the other half of his trade value and/or his role here if he isn’t traded immediately.
Yes, I assume they’ll trade him. But I hope they don’t have to fire sale him.
Highlights of new 77 Minutes in Heaven pod -- Cato and Du Four
Now that Rick is gone, Cato feels okay with saying that the relationship problems with Rick were not limited to Luka. A lot of people in the organization were "sick of" putting up with dealing with Rick, especially on his bad days.
Rick had lost his ability to manage the locker room. It's not that he "lost" them, exactly. More that the players perceived that he had lost authority. He was undermined by the Bob situation, intentionally or no.
As far as a replacement, Cato likes the Mosley option, for preservation of relationships reasons. But he understands the viewpoint that the coaching staff needs a new voice on both ends of the floor. Also, Mosley would be a first-time head coach, and that has its risks and disadvantages.
Wrt whether the team should hire a newbie or a big name, several factors come into play. Newbies are cheaper, although cost is not likely to be the deciding factor. Hiring a newbie doesn't make the big statement that a name coach would. People who have been head coaches are also much easier to vet -- they have a track record and a long list of people you can call. That information with respect to assistants either doesn't exist or is hard to ferret out.
What is the deal with Dirk's new role? Probably more for show than for real, given that is not a day-to-day position and the portfolio is undefined. Mainly a way to project stability and a calming influence -- Dirk is onboard, so things must be okay. To the extent he actually gives any advice, he is probably one of the only people on earth who could actually speak truth to Mark, but it is TBD whether Mark actually wants a critique from Dirk or really just wants his face on the effort. Dirk's involvement can't hurt, and he could add something good, you never know.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ri...0526051682
(06-18-2021, 05:56 PM)mavsluvr Wrote: [ -> ]Rick had lost his ability to manage the locker room. It's not that he "lost" them, exactly. More that the players perceived that he had lost authority. He was undermined by the Bob situation, intentionally or no.
Makes a ton of sense, thanks.