2020-2021 ROSTER TALK: Archived

[vfromlmf]

Hmm...Since the Mavs are leading betting odds for both Collins and Drummond ...

KP --> Bulls

OPJ --> Cavs

Markannen + Bulls 1st --> Hawks

Collins + Drummond --> Mavs

[ItsGoTime]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2937...-war-chest

Mavs ranked 26th out of 30...

No surprise whatsoever after the last few years of acquiring talent/assets.

[bodhisattva]

If we would have a team of

Dončič
Richardson
DFS
Collins
Drummond

THJ
Kleber
Brunson
WCS

and maybe Fournier on top

I would cry happy
I dont really like Drummond, would prefer Holmes or Wall, but this team would tear playoffs apart.

Sounds too god to be true, but I like this rumors. If you are going for Collins you should just trade Kp. I want Kleber, Thj, DFS, JR, and Brunson to stay.The rest I dont care. Lets gooooo.

[vfromlmf]

If you prefer Horford over Drummond ...

KP --> Thunder

2 OKC 1st --> Hawks

Horford + Collins --> Mavs

[Tyler]

Hawks insulted by Mavs’ offer for John Collins

One team that reportedly proposed a deal is the Dallas Mavericks, which was focused on center Maxi Kleber. While the other players and assets included in the deal remain unclear, what is certain is that the Hawks weren’t impressed and turned down the offer.

Man, I really hate clickbait headline writers who fabricate incendiary statements found nowhere in the body of the article.

[BigDirk41]

I personally think anyone not named Luka should be available if it makes the Mavs a better team. Sometimes trades have to get really creative. I don't think we can get hung up on keeping Maxi or JB or even KP if the right trade comes along. We don't have a lot of assets and typically you have to give up something good to get something good in return.

[ItsGoTime]

If we would have a team of

Dončič
Richardson
DFS
Collins
Drummond

THJ
Kleber
Brunson
WCS

and maybe Fournier on top

I would cry happy
I dont really like Drummond, would prefer Holmes or Wall, but this team would tear playoffs apart.

Sounds too god to be true, but I like this rumors. If you are going for Collins you should just trade Kp. I want Kleber, Thj, DFS, JR, and Brunson to stay.The rest I dont care. Lets gooooo.

In all honesty, I think the Mavs interest in Drummond has to do with a KP for Collins possibility.

[Kammrath]

In all honesty, I think the Mavs interest in Drummond has to do with a KP for Collins possibility.

To me this is the only thing that makes much sense.

[BigDirk41]

To me this is the only thing that makes much sense.

I really don't think I want to do a KP for Collins trade unless Bog is included. The Mavs know more about KP than us though. He may just not he the right fit with Luka.

[Omega_Supreme]

John Collins is a 23 years stud, highly suspicious why Atlanta wants to move him. 

I love Aaron Gordon though and would rather have Gordon, way more versatile

[Jason Terry]

Lowry(MIA, PHI) and Fournier are the markets im watching. 

Mavs getting any of Fournier, Dragic or Danny Green would be excellent 

Assuming the outgoing pieces are Johnson, Terry and two 2nds

[StepBackJay]

We need a Powell for Powell trade just because..

[Hypermav]

John Collins is a 23 years stud, highly suspicious why Atlanta wants to move him. 

I love Aaron Gordon though and would rather have Gordon, way more versatile

“First I want to apologize to my teammates, the Hawks organization, our fans, partners and community as a whole for this situation," Collins said in a statement. "I understand the impact this matter has on what we are trying to achieve together this season, and I am incredibly frustrated and disappointed in myself for putting all of us in this position. I have always been incredibly careful about what I put in my body, but I took a supplement which, unbeknownst to me, had been contaminated with an illegal component." 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nb...164349002/

I am still pro-Collins but maybe this soured his standing with the organization for a max slot.  They liked him enough for 90 million.  He needs to learn to hide his HGH like LeBron...

[StepBackJay]

I could see Mavs getting Danny Green which isn't the worst thing but he is redundant with other guys. Helps with depth at least.

[vfromlmf]

Re: KP for Collins 

There are workable deals with Cleveland, OKC, Chicago probably others that would get the Hawks what they're looking for.

Offensively I think Collins in a big upgrade over KP based both on scoring efficiency and playing style in the Mavs system. We've all seen enough of Doncic to know Collins would average 25 PPG in a Mavs uniform. He's the best player in the league at getting open off screens and that combo would be a terror. KP has struggled in this area. He plays better with the ball in his hands and just doesn't show elite off ball movement or consistency in pick & roll.

But KP isn't the unicorn because of his offense alone. He's the unicorn because he can score efficiently as a center and has historically provided elite rim protection. And that's not Collins' jam.

To me, the decision on trading KP is 100% about his defense. Unfortunately, as we've all seen, KP's defensive effort may be tied to his offensive productivity. So it comes down to this: if KP won't play defense without getting his iso touches, he won't be a unicorn in Dallas and so he should be moved to a team that will build around him as the offensive focal point. 

As a side note, we've seen similar things with a guy Randle. He's an all-star if you run an offense through him but he's a ball-stopping liability if you don't. If you put KP in Cleveland and build a team of shooters around him he'll average 25-10 or more and start a decade long run of All-Star appearances.

Of course the best thing for all sides is for the Mavs to develop KP into a consistent pick & roll player who rebounds & defends the rim. That's unicorn stuff and a big upgrade over a guy like Collins.

[StepBackJay]

I don't think Mavs are looking at all at Collins for KP. As we saw they were offering Kleber plus other stuff.

[bodhisattva]

In all honesty, I think the Mavs interest in Drummond has to do with a KP for Collins possibility.

To me this is the only thing that makes much sense.

I dont think Drummond is coming here. I think he is LA bound and thats ok. What i wanted to say is, short and long term, our biggest problem is our Frontcourt. We have KP at center, who cant play center on defense and Maxi. WCS  and Bobi are 10 minutes/specific matchups guys.

Now my long 2K career experience tells me you need 3 man rotation in frontcourt. If you are trading KP for Collins that would be a huge step in this direction, as i would keep Maxi as off the bench big. Collins and KP are basically the same player. Great offense bad defense. Collins is better and I have more faith in him, going forward on the defensive end, than KP. It has been all written in posts above.

But, Collins is smaller and classic PF, who cant fill KPs role on D. It should come as no surprise then, that Mavs SHOULD be in the marker for 2 bigs, especially if KP or (god please no) Maxi are outgoing. We have been lacking 1 rotational big for 2 years now. Its where our biggest problems come from. Bad defense, bad rebounding, hustle. I was hoping WCS and Johnson could fix it a bit, but it has been worse than in the bubble.

I mean, Lowry, Fournier, Powell, Smart, etc would be nice, but i think Brunson is good enogh on play for now. I thing THJ is not that much worse than Fournier, and I think JRs defense is good enough. Meanwhile, Bobi, WCS, and as it stands now...KP...are not. As weird as that sounds.

In short, barring Maxi, our frountcourt has to go, and if you bring Collins next to Maxi you need another guy at center. WCS and Bobi can step in but not in long term. I said it 10 times, but i need Wall, Holmes, etc. I need hustle, i need ally oops ,offensive rebounds, defence and 10 reb/game. He doesnt need to shoot threes.

From this point you start to think about upgreads, maybe a superstar in a year or two and a championship.
Thats my opinion on trading and current state. At this current timeline backcourt is ok. Any change will be minor like JR-Curry trade. Gain some ˙(defense), loose some (shooting). Its frontcourt where it is at. We need two new guys there, with Maxi coming off the bench.

Sorry for ramble. Trade deadline stress i guess.

[DanSchwartzgan]

“First I want to apologize to my teammates, the Hawks organization, our fans, partners and community as a whole for this situation," Collins said in a statement. "I understand the impact this matter has on what we are trying to achieve together this season, and I am incredibly frustrated and disappointed in myself for putting all of us in this position. I have always been incredibly careful about what I put in my body, but I took a supplement which, unbeknownst to me, had been contaminated with an illegal component." 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nb...164349002/

I am still pro-Collins but maybe this soured his standing with the organization for a max slot.  They liked him enough for 90 million.  He needs to learn to hide his HGH like LeBron...

Well, what are we going to argue about now?

[SleepingHero]

Well, what are we going to argue about now?

Whats wrong with KP not taking steroids? At least Collins cares enough to take HGH to get stronger.

[Chicagojk]

Any chance Orlando interest in moving Fournier to us would also ask us to take on salary?  For instance, Fournier and Aminu for Johnson, WCS and Burke?

I believe you can waive WCS next season and Burke is a cheap fill in for another year.  It would allow Orlando to get off Aminu who has another year on his contract.   Or maybe because Burke has two years left, maybe it is Boban instead?   Then Dallas would need to find another backup big.