DAL OFFSEASON: Trade & FA | Mavs "mostly done...but you never know."

[Scott41theMavs]

@"Kammrath" Your gif game is even better than your stats game. I need to get on your level.

I LOL'ed at the dog gif.

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I'm currently listening to Duncan and Hollinger drool over the prospect of Derrick Jones Jr in Dallas.

Thoughts?

That would be great, but how do they propose it happen? Miami isn't going to want to lose him.

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Your gif game is even better than your stats game. I need to get on your level.

Ha, thanks.


But back to THJ. When I was expressing my angst about him earlier, I forgot to mention the playoffs. Note, it is DANGEROUS to draw many conclusions from a 6 game sample (and that is what the playoffs were for the Mavs), but THJ's shooting dropped 4% from three to 35% and his on/off just plummeted. It is the same thing that happened in 18-19 in his first stint with the Mavs. It feels like THJ has to shoot like 40% from three to break even as a player. It terrifies me to bet on that.

Send this to the MBT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Kamm, I'm glad to have you with me on the "get rid of THJ" wagon. Glad I'm not crazy. Hope we don't both (as KL says) have to prepare for disappointment.

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Derrick Jones Jr in Dallas

I like him as a project but he better be CHEAP. He is getting played off the floor in the playoffs and was the worst DRating on MIA this season of the regulars. He was -3.5 defensively. AND he cannot shoot the three.

I think he has potential, but he does not fix anything in the short term. I would rather have Frank.

Whoa.

https://tenor.com/YDqV.gif

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I guess i just don’t think KP will be asked to do much creating last 5 min. I want the ball in Luka’s hands the whole time.

Yeah, I want that, too, but as we've seen, a good team can figure out how to get the ball out of Luka's hands when they have to. Doesn't matter how good Luka and Harden are, if nobody else on the team is competent to drive the boat when they need to.

This whole conversation is based on my feeling that multiple playmakers down the stretch against a great defense is becoming necessary. All of the remaining playoff teams have that.

It's ok if you disagree, but please understand that it's not coming from a place of me being unhappy with what they're doing that is already successful. I am not dogging KP, for example.

Co-sign.

[KillerLeft]

Ha, thanks.


But back to THJ. When I was expressing my angst about him earlier, I forgot to mention the playoffs. Note, it is DANGEROUS to draw many conclusions from a 6 game sample (and that is what the playoffs were for the Mavs), but THJ's shooting dropped 4% from three to 35% and his on/off just plummeted. It is the same thing that happened in 18-19 in his first stint with the Mavs. It feels like THJ has to shoot like 40% from three to break even as a player. It terrifies me to bet on that.

That's an interesting perspective. 

I'm just operating under the assumption that he's on his way towards spending the rest of his life flourishing as a Korver/Reddick/Robinson type, but yeah, if the shooting is temporary, then he doesn't do much for you.

[Scott41theMavs]

Just a random note:

This thread started 23 days ago and has 1000 comments (51 pages worth). Holy cow.

KL's return is a huge part of that. He was missed, and we're glad and lucky to have him back.

[KillerLeft]

Just a random note:

This thread started 23 days ago and has 1000 comments (51 pages worth). Holy cow.

I can handle the analytics in my basketball talk, Kamm, but for the love of God, keep them out of my message board talk. 

THE EYE TEST IS ALL I NEED TO KNOW THIS IS A GOOD THREAD MY DUDE

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Just a random note:

This thread started 23 days ago and has 1000 comments (51 pages worth). Holy cow.

KL's return is a huge part of that. He was missed, and we're glad and lucky to have him back.

Soon, Kamm will post the adjusted +/-, and that will show that the forum was 32% smarter before I found it. But thanks for your eye test assessment, pal. Appreciated.

[Kammrath]

I will say this positive thing, the same thing I said right after THJ came in the trade from NYK:

He is better than Barnes. I would much rather have THJ than HB on my team. 

IF THJ can keep shooting ~40% from three and IF the Mavs can implement a defensive scheme that is more friendly to him and minimizes his negative impact, THEN I welcome him with open arms. 

Those IFs just feel big to me and counting on them feels dangerous.

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THE EYE TEST IS ALL I NEED TO KNOW THIS IS A GOOD THREAD MY DUDE

[Scott41theMavs]

I will say this positive thing, the same thing I said right after THJ came in the trade from NYK:

He is better than Barnes. I would much rather have THJ than HB on my team.

IF THJ can keep shooting ~40% from three and IF the Mavs can implement a defensive scheme that is more friendly to him and minimizes his negative impact, THEN I welcome him with open arms.

Those IFs just feel big to me and counting on them feels dangerous.

I will grudgingly trust the MBT on THJ if they must have him on roster for 20/21, but if they Powell him (sign him to an extension starting at more than $11 mil per)...
https://media.giphy.com/media/ZeP3leqiAGHK/giphy.gif

[KillerLeft]

I don't they'll do that, Scott. I think he either gets traded or is back on the final year of this deal. 

But, if they extend him, I'll help you beat up your couch.

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[Jason Terry]

Ha, thanks.


But back to THJ. When I was expressing my angst about him earlier, I forgot to mention the playoffs. Note, it is DANGEROUS to draw many conclusions from a 6 game sample (and that is what the playoffs were for the Mavs), but THJ's shooting dropped 4% from three to 35% and his on/off just plummeted. It is the same thing that happened in 18-19 in his first stint with the Mavs. It feels like THJ has to shoot like 40% from three to break even as a player. It terrifies me to bet on that.

That's an interesting perspective. 

I'm just operating under the assumption that he's on his way towards spending the rest of his life flourishing as a Korver/Reddick/Robinson type, but yeah, if the shooting is temporary, then he doesn't do much for you.

Right? If all Hardaway and Curry amount to is Robinson and a lesser Herro, well we have a better version of Dragic. All of these players are winning players in the 3 point era. I believe Spoelstra said recently he sees a 6 man rotation late in games. Dragic, Herro, Robinson, Butler, Crowder, Bam. Seems like some would say Dragic Herro Robinson Crowder Bam on the floor would be too small. But it works so it’s not stupid. They’re playing team defense. We have similar personal to do what they do. Nothing wrong with Rick running 3 guards.

[Scott41theMavs]

Ha, thanks.


But back to THJ. When I was expressing my angst about him earlier, I forgot to mention the playoffs. Note, it is DANGEROUS to draw many conclusions from a 6 game sample (and that is what the playoffs were for the Mavs), but THJ's shooting dropped 4% from three to 35% and his on/off just plummeted. It is the same thing that happened in 18-19 in his first stint with the Mavs. It feels like THJ has to shoot like 40% from three to break even as a player. It terrifies me to bet on that.

That's an interesting perspective.

I'm just operating under the assumption that he's on his way towards spending the rest of his life flourishing as a Korver/Reddick/Robinson type, but yeah, if the shooting is temporary, then he doesn't do much for you.

Right? If all Hardaway and Curry amount to is Robinson and a lesser Herro, well we have a better version of Dragic. All of these players are winning players in the 3 point era. I believe Spoelstra said recently he sees a 6 man rotation late in games. Dragic, Herro, Robinson, Butler, Crowder, Bam. Seems like some would say Dragic Herro Robinson Crowder Bam on the floor would be too small. But it works so it’s not stupid. They’re playing team defense. We have similar personal to do what they do. Nothing wrong with Rick running 3 guards.

...if THJ learns and follows the defensive schemes. It was noted with examples that he did that extremely poorly against the Clippers. Not acceptable in the starting lineup.

[Jason Terry]

Ha, thanks.


But back to THJ. When I was expressing my angst about him earlier, I forgot to mention the playoffs. Note, it is DANGEROUS to draw many conclusions from a 6 game sample (and that is what the playoffs were for the Mavs), but THJ's shooting dropped 4% from three to 35% and his on/off just plummeted. It is the same thing that happened in 18-19 in his first stint with the Mavs. It feels like THJ has to shoot like 40% from three to break even as a player. It terrifies me to bet on that.

That's an interesting perspective.

I'm just operating under the assumption that he's on his way towards spending the rest of his life flourishing as a Korver/Reddick/Robinson type, but yeah, if the shooting is temporary, then he doesn't do much for you.

Right? If all Hardaway and Curry amount to is Robinson and a lesser Herro, well we have a better version of Dragic. All of these players are winning players in the 3 point era. I believe Spoelstra said recently he sees a 6 man rotation late in games. Dragic, Herro, Robinson, Butler, Crowder, Bam. Seems like some would say Dragic Herro Robinson Crowder Bam on the floor would be too small. But it works so it’s not stupid. They’re playing team defense. We have similar personal to do what they do. Nothing wrong with Rick running 3 guards.

...if THJ learns and follows the defensive schemes. It was noted with examples that he did that extremely poorly against the Clippers. Not acceptable in the starting lineup.

I don’t think he cares if he starts. Whatever seems best for the team we will do. He could be the backup 3 if we got someone like Derrick White. I think the point with him is he has bought in to what we’re doing and that’s 90% of team defense. We have several guys bought into our plan just need a few additions

[Scott41theMavs]

Ha, thanks.


But back to THJ. When I was expressing my angst about him earlier, I forgot to mention the playoffs. Note, it is DANGEROUS to draw many conclusions from a 6 game sample (and that is what the playoffs were for the Mavs), but THJ's shooting dropped 4% from three to 35% and his on/off just plummeted. It is the same thing that happened in 18-19 in his first stint with the Mavs. It feels like THJ has to shoot like 40% from three to break even as a player. It terrifies me to bet on that.

That's an interesting perspective.

I'm just operating under the assumption that he's on his way towards spending the rest of his life flourishing as a Korver/Reddick/Robinson type, but yeah, if the shooting is temporary, then he doesn't do much for you.

Right? If all Hardaway and Curry amount to is Robinson and a lesser Herro, well we have a better version of Dragic. All of these players are winning players in the 3 point era. I believe Spoelstra said recently he sees a 6 man rotation late in games. Dragic, Herro, Robinson, Butler, Crowder, Bam. Seems like some would say Dragic Herro Robinson Crowder Bam on the floor would be too small. But it works so it’s not stupid. They’re playing team defense. We have similar personal to do what they do. Nothing wrong with Rick running 3 guards.

...if THJ learns and follows the defensive schemes. It was noted with examples that he did that extremely poorly against the Clippers. Not acceptable in the starting lineup.

I don’t think he cares if he starts. Whatever seems best for the team we will do. He could be the backup 3 if we got someone like Derrick White. I think the point with him is he has bought in to what we’re doing and that’s 90% of team defense. We have several guys bought into our plan just need a few additions

My point was that he evidently hasn't bought in on the defensive end, or just can't do it. If he stays this year and comes off the bench, I will be fairly pleased with that.

[Jason Terry]

We have the same mojo miami has. Y’all will be happy with who we add. We will be viewed as one of only a handful of teams with a legit title shot. We learned how to screw it up and win it all under dirk. Bright days ahead. We will be greedy and add great players. This will be a deep young squad

[Hypermav]

https://theathletic.com/2084736/2020/09/...it-survey/

VOTE!

Man, filling some pages up today. Interesting.

[Jason Terry]

That's an interesting perspective.

I'm just operating under the assumption that he's on his way towards spending the rest of his life flourishing as a Korver/Reddick/Robinson type, but yeah, if the shooting is temporary, then he doesn't do much for you.

Right? If all Hardaway and Curry amount to is Robinson and a lesser Herro, well we have a better version of Dragic. All of these players are winning players in the 3 point era. I believe Spoelstra said recently he sees a 6 man rotation late in games. Dragic, Herro, Robinson, Butler, Crowder, Bam. Seems like some would say Dragic Herro Robinson Crowder Bam on the floor would be too small. But it works so it’s not stupid. They’re playing team defense. We have similar personal to do what they do. Nothing wrong with Rick running 3 guards.

...if THJ learns and follows the defensive schemes. It was noted with examples that he did that extremely poorly against the Clippers. Not acceptable in the starting lineup.

I don’t think he cares if he starts. Whatever seems best for the team we will do. He could be the backup 3 if we got someone like Derrick White. I think the point with him is he has bought in to what we’re doing and that’s 90% of team defense. We have several guys bought into our plan just need a few additions

My point was that he evidently hasn't bought in on the defensive end, or just can't do it. If he stays this year and comes off the bench, I will be fairly pleased with that.

Luckily if you are right and he just can’t give us what we want then we can let him walk. We are in a strong position and very flexible

[KillerLeft]

https://theathletic.com/2084736/2020/09/...it-survey/

VOTE!

Man, filling some pages up today. Interesting.

What's the point? Everyone knows that the Athletic's electoral college makes our votes utterly inconsequential.

[Hypermav]

https://theathletic.com/2084736/2020/09/...it-survey/

VOTE!

Man, filling some pages up today. Interesting.

What's the point? Everyone knows that the Athletic's electoral college makes our votes utterly inconsequential.

No politics, you hurt my feelings.

[Kammrath]

No politics

To both TRUMP and BIDEN....

[Jason Terry]

Suns get: CP3
Mavs get: Oubre
OKC gets: Rubio, Wright, Jackson, 18, Suns future first and second so Phoenix keeps their pick this year

[StepBackJay]

Suns get: CP3
Mavs get: Oubre
OKC gets: Rubio, Wright, Jackson, 18, Suns future first and second so Phoenix keeps their pick this year

Don't think the Suns want to do that. I am interested in Wright + 18 for Oubre though. I could see the Suns going for that.

[Hypermav]

What do you think of Bazemore