2020-2021 ROSTER TALK: Archived

[Mapka]

No free roster spots. According to the latest tweets the Mavs want to keep Melli.

I will believe this until proven otherwise. It´s just, he isn´t even the original throw-in. And LA and Kelly Olynyk (is he released yet?) are stumbling around.

[F Gump]

This are all valid points, but...

 - FA was done the moment GA signed the new contract. The two players I like best in the FA:
 THjr & Josh Richardson lol .. (not talking RFAs/Kawhi).
 
- Don´t care about the "value" of our Rookies, as I would love to keep all of them.

There will be one option to "improve" and that´s called full midlevel exception.

let´s go for the buyouts now

This ^ is spot on.

Once you include new deals for J-Rich and THJ, the Mavs have no cap room this summer and then they have the big MLE to spend (about 9.5M). Keeping those 2 players, at similar prices to what they are getting now, puts the Mavs right around the cap. That assumes they exercise their cheap option on WCS, which seems like a safe bet.

If either gets a wild offer, the Mavs have about the same cap room they would have spent to spend on some outside player in free agency. (But they end up with the cap room MLE instead.)

It's likely to be an MLE summer, where they look to land a well-valued bargain deal or two, lock them up for 2-3 years, and call it a day.

[jesusshuttlesworth82]

It will be interesting to see what players like Fournier and Dinwiddie yield, if they are traded. Gordon too.

I'm thinking the prices will prove to be much higher than we think (if they are traded) and that the supposed giveaways that are being wished for don't even exist.

For those reasons, I think the Mavs are not going to find anything that makes sense, and will sit this one out. Not for lack of trying, but for an unwillingness to pay something stupid on a deal that doesn't get them anywhere..

The prices were cheap but the Mavs couldnt even afford cheap.  Not much to trade if they weren't going to touch the core.

---

I think if Mavs limit is Johnson and a couple of second rounders, than our market are the likes of Bjelica, Gay, Dieng or overpaid players like Bledsoe.

good call

They actually did fairly well for having peanuts to trade.  Maybe Redick can get hot for a game in the playoffs.

[dirkfansince1998]

This ^ is spot on.

Once you include new deals for J-Rich and THJ, the Mavs have no cap room this summer and then they have the big MLE to spend (about 9.5M). Keeping those 2 players, at similar prices to what they are getting now, puts the Mavs right around the cap. That assumes they exercise their cheap option on WCS, which seems like a safe bet.

If either gets a wild offer, the Mavs have about the same cap room they would have spent to spend on some outside player in free agency. (But they end up with the cap room MLE instead.)

It's likely to be an MLE summer, where they look to land a well-valued bargain deal or two, lock them up for 2-3 years, and call it a day.

Thing is that they could have added a player for Johnson´s contract in a trade and still kept both JRich and THJ. Depending on the exact numbers even with the possibility to use the full MLE.
Makes no sense not to do in a no free agency scenario.

[cow]

I can see JRich and THJ finding deals elsewhere while we sit there waiting to see if ATL matches an offer sheet on Collins.

The good news is we own our FRP in 2022.  The bad/good news is Luka is pretty good at keeping almost anything around him competitive.

[Mapka]

Thing is that they could have added a player for Johnson´s contract in a trade and still kept both JRich and THJ. Depending on the exact numbers even with the possibility to use the full MLE.
Makes no sense not to do in a no free agency scenario.

I was hoping/waiting for exact this. And we kinda got this - just not a keeper.
I think this could be kind of a security police if one of THjr or JRich bolts, we at least have the capspace.

[KillerLeft]

I can see JRich and THJ finding deals elsewhere while we sit there waiting to see if ATL matches an offer sheet on Collins.

THere's a lot of room for error in the months ahead, but I really don't worry about this. 

I think that one thing the Mavs ARE consistently successful with is creating an environment wherein MOST players feel happy and valued. It's obvious that people have enjoyed playing here over the past 2-3 years (except for Wright and possibly KP). 

My guess is that IF the Mavs WANT those dudes here next year, they'll both be fully aware of the plan and know what kind of deal they can expect from Dallas right away, even if they have to wait and possibly risk not getting it. We saw this strategy work this past off-season with WCS. I realize that he likely had fewer options than either of them will, but it's also not like either of them is likely to be some huge priority for mystery team X.

[F Gump]

Thing is that they could have added a player a player for Johnson´s contract in a trade and still kept both JRich and THJ. Depending on the exact numbers even with the possibility to use the full MLE.

Makes no sense not to do in a no free agency scenario.

That's true, except (will circle back to this in a minute).

But I do wonder if they were involved on Fournier and just got outbid. Anyone else (worth keeping) where it looks like Johnson and 2nds might have been enough?

As for the circle back --
1 They can sign Redick if that is desirable. Melli too. So there's that.
2 I bet there's a side issue (that may actually be a big one for them) on the spending this summer that we don't see. That's the issue of the 2022 payroll, when Luka's massive raise will hit. They already know that's coming. It;s a huge hit. I think that they will be factoring that into the equation, and it might have made it impossible for them to re-sign J-Rich, THJ, and also Fournier (or someone else) at expected market prices on multi-year deals. So maybe in their estimation, Fournier could have only been a rental anyhow, because his price tag is going to be too high, which lessened his value considerably. 
3 Redick, fwiw, seems like he could be much more available to sign a one year deal in the summer, and for a much smaller number.

[dirkfansince1998]

That's true, except (will circle back to this in a minute).

But I do wonder if they were involved on Fournier and just got outbid. Anyone else (worth keeping) where it looks like Johnson and 2nds might have been enough?

As for the circle back --
1 They can sign Redick if that is desirable. Melli too. So there's that.
2 I bet there's a side issue (that may actually be a big one for them) on the spending this summer that we don't see. That's the issue of the 2022 payroll, when Luka's massive raise will hit. They already know that's coming. It;s a huge hit. I think that they will be factoring that into the equation, and it might have made it impossible for them to re-sign J-Rich, THJ, and also Fournier (or someone else) at expected market prices on multi-year deals. So maybe in their estimation, Fournier could have only been a rental anyhow, because his price tag is going to be too high, which lessened his value considerably. 
3 Redick, fwiw, seems like he could be much more available to sign a one year deal in the summer, and for a much smaller number.

That goes along with @"KillerLeft" prediction. If Cuban isn´t willing to pay luxury tax the Mavs are in trouble. Don´t think Redick is an option. Already mentioned that he looks done but he also wants to join the Nets. Not only to chase rings but also because he lives in the area.

[KillerLeft]

2 I bet there's a side issue (that may actually be a big one for them) on the spending this summer that we don't see. That's the issue of the 2022 payroll, when Luka's massive raise will hit. They already know that's coming. It;s a huge hit. I think that they will be factoring that into the equation, and it might have made it impossible for them to re-sign J-Rich, THJ, and also Fournier (or someone else) at expected market prices on multi-year deals. So maybe in their estimation, Fournier could have only been a rental anyhow, because his price tag is going to be too high, which lessened his value considerably. 

This! I tried to make this point like 4 times today, but you've articulated it here far better than I could.

[michaeltex]

Updated salary chart:

A - Can you pin this somewhere we can find it later for reference? Maybe somewhere on the main page?

B - If JRich opts out, does he become an RFA or UFA?

C - Can the Mavs unilaterally turn Brunson's deal into a guaranteed contract? If they do, does it give them Bird rights going into year 3?

[michaeltex]

I bet there's a side issue (that may actually be a big one for them) on the spending this summer that we don't see. That's the issue of the 2022 payroll, when Luka's massive raise will hit. They already know that's coming. It;s a huge hit. I think that they will be factoring that into the equation, and it might have made it impossible for them to re-sign J-Rich, THJ, and also Fournier (or someone else) at expected market prices on multi-year deals. So maybe in their estimation, Fournier could have only been a rental anyhow, because his price tag is going to be too high, which lessened his value considerably. 

Maybe the answer is more nuanced. Maybe he doesn't want to pay the LT, yet, because of the fact that a championship team will be expensive to keep with the escalation factors. And we all expect Luka (and others) to be around for a long time.


Dirk gave lots of hometown discounts. Basically taking whatever was left after MBT put the team together, which made cap management easier that Donnie and Mark deserved. I don't expect that from Luka, at least not for a while.

[Kammrath]

A - Can you pin this somewhere we can find it later for reference? Maybe somewhere on the main page?

B - If JRich opts out, does he become an RFA or UFA?

C - Can the Mavs unilaterally turn Brunson's deal into a guaranteed contract? If they do, does it give them Bird rights going into year 3?

First post of this thread contains this updated chart.

JR is UFA if he opts out.

The Mavs can guarantee his deal and I would assume they have bird rights but he would be UFA and could walk if he wants.

[dirkfansince1998]

Maybe the answer is more nuanced. Maybe he doesn't want to pay the LT, yet, because of the fact that a championship team will be expensive to keep with the escalation factors. And we all expect Luka (and others) to be around for a long time.


Dirk gave lots of hometown discounts. Basically taking whatever was left after MBT put the team together, which made cap management easier that Donnie and Mark deserved. I don't expect that from Luka, at least not for a while.

Mavs still rank 3rd in all time luxury tax. Cuban went all out to win his first championship. Immediately stopped after the Mavs won in 2011. 151m from 2002 to 2011. We cannot really complain about a cheap owner but compared to his early ownership years he isn´t as willing to pay. Cannot really fault him. I think Ballmer is in a similar situation right now. Trying everything to win but even money cannot buy an NBA ring (well it can when a broke player has to sell one).

[jesusshuttlesworth82]

I wonder how the Mavs will operate this summer.

Do they just lock up THJ and JRich and spend the MLE?

or do they explore some other options with the $37 million?

[KillerLeft]

I wonder how the Mavs will operate this summer.

Do they just lock up THJ and JRich and spend the MLE?

or do they explore some other options with the $37 million?

Good thing we don't know, or else we'd have nothing to argue about between now and then.

[F Gump]

B - If JRich opts out, does he become an RFA or UFA?

C - Can the Mavs unilaterally turn Brunson's deal into a guaranteed contract? If they do, does it give them Bird rights going into year 3?

J-Rich -- will be a 2021 UFA is he declines his option.

Brunson -- We should consider Brunson's deal as if the "non-guaranteed" setup didn't exist. It has become irrelevant, because they aren't going to waive him, and that's the only time it would be a consideration. (In case anyone s wondering, it will become fully guaranteed before free agency starts. Not that it really matters anymore.) He will become a UFA in the summer of 2022, and the Mavs will have full Bird rights (as he will have completed 4 years with them).

[jesusshuttlesworth82]

Tim McMahon was on The Fan earlier and said the Mavs arent convinced about Porzingis long term but they absolutely couldn't trade him now.  HIs value around the league is low.  At least there's hope with KP.  You wouldnt get a star in return for him.  No chemistry between KP and Luka either.  Every time KP has a good game, he mentions how the ball actually moved around tonight.

Hawks will "bite the bullet" and match any offer sheet for Collins instead of letting an asset walk for nothing.  

The show hosts didnt ask him a follow up about any sign and trade possibilities for Collins.  

Gotta think that's what the Mavs are hoping for with all the Collins chatter.  My head hurts trying to figure out how we'd sequence/structure that sign and trade to try and maximize the most talent.

I'm just trying to figure out if it's going to be a fairly simple summer.  Sign JRich and THJ into cap space.  Have full MLE to spend.  Or if it's going to be a ton of moving pieces.

[Jason Terry]

Tim McMahon was on The Fan earlier and said the Mavs arent convinced about Porzingis long term but they absolutely couldn't trade him now.  HIs value around the league is low.  At least there's hope with KP.  You wouldnt get a star in return for him.  No chemistry between KP and Luka either.  Every time KP has a good game, he mentions how the ball actually moved around tonight.

Hawks will "bite the bullet" and match any offer sheet for Collins instead of letting an asset walk for nothing.  

The show hosts didnt ask him a follow up about any sign and trade possibilities for Collins.  

Gotta think that's what the Mavs are hoping for with all the Collins chatter.  My head hurts trying to figure out how we'd sequence/structure that sign and trade to try and maximize the most talent.

KP isn’t written in pen in this teams future. Obvious issues with him and Luka. It never made any sense to invest any more in this team until all of that is officially cleared up. We’re stuck in a holding pattern. It’s just the facts of life. The signs have been there awhile now

[ClutchDirk]

First post of this thread contains this updated chart.

Thank you Kamm...