Ideal roles for the current roster

[KillerLeft]

Last season, I was harping on about how Luka needed a long, mobile rim-runner at Center. The dumbasses on here and on other Mavs' sites kept saying 5-out, Dwight, or nada. Enter Dereck Lively as a rookie. Now none of those dumbasses acknowledge how wrong they were. And yet even Lively isn't fully ideal because he can't play defense on perimeter players. Still, he's leagues better than Dwight. And there's a lot of young kids out there who would fit better on this team than Dwight too. Analytics isn't everything, it's very important... but not if you are short sighted, and most importantly, if you can't see the bigger picture of how different pieces fit together.

See...right here ^^^

In addition to this being very incorrect (we have ALL agreed Luka needs a pick and roll big, that's the foundation for most of Powell's support around here, what little there is), why on Earth do you care? You just said "I'm not a Mavs fan." You typed that. What are you getting out of pretending to win fake internet arguments with people who ARE Mavs fans? 

Did someone hurt you? What is wrong?

[mvossman]

I don't want to debate this. I think the Mavs can do much better and have needs for much better. You don't. Good for you.

So the Mavs have supposedly not been negative in his court-time. Wow, fantastic, superb. Seems like a wonderful achievement.  :SMH:

But what have you won and what have you improved on? Are you closer to winning a title after making WCF or closer to being a lottery team?

The Mavs fans like you remind me of Brian Scalabrine. Despite having the most talented offensive player in the league... You're no closer to Scalabrine than the Mavericks are to winning a title. :\

TBH, I now think that the only way Luka ever wins a title is if he ditches Texas for LA. I'm hoping your numbnuts of an FO will at least trade him to Utah instead of gifting the Lakers another star and more titles... cause he ain't winning diddly-squat here in Dallas.

Going full troll I see.

[KillerLeft]

As Markus was to Dirk, RGP is to Luka. Got it.

I always thought Omahen was going to be this era's Markus. Obviously, Omahen won't be around after Luka leaves, retires, whatever, but I've found his contributions quite insightful and enriching. We are a better board because of him, for sure. 

And actually, I've noticed that we do still have some of our German posters around, including some I never realized (back then) were Germans. Makes me wonder how many of our current community are from Slovenia, and if any of them will eventually stick with the Mavs.

[RGP1981]

See...right here ^^^

In addition to this being very incorrect (we have ALL agreed Luka needs a pick and roll big, that's the foundation for most of Powell's support around here, what little there is), why on Earth do you care? You just said "I'm not a Mavs fan." You typed that. What are you getting out of pretending to win fake internet arguments with people who ARE Mavs fans? 

Did someone hurt you? What is wrong?

Nobody has hurt me. But I am not a fan of the "supporting Mavericks" experience so far over 6 years. You have a lovely arena and awesome home fans. But your Front Office leaves a whole lot to be desired. One of the worst Front Office in the NBA, in my humble but casual opinion. This is going to be 6 years of Luka that have been completely wasted.

[KillerLeft]

Nobody has hurt me. But I am not a fan of the "supporting Mavericks" experience so far over 6 years. You have a lovely arena and awesome home fans. But your Front Office leaves a whole lot to be desired. One of the worst Front Office in the NBA, in my humble but casual opinion. This is going to be 6 years of Luka that have been completely wasted.

Ok, but who cares? You're not a fan of the team. What am I missing?

[RGP1981]

Ok, but who cares? You're not a fan of the team. What am I missing?

My guy is playing for your team. So you're stuck with me until you trade him.

I hope that the thought of being stuck with me is incentive enough to trade him, TBH.

[KillerLeft]

My guy is playing for your team. So you're stuck with me until you trade him.

I don't think even Luka-only fans hang out here, though. You might be the only one. 

I think most of us are here because we've been friends for over a decade (2-3 decades, in some cases). 

I guess I'm just not going to understand what people get out of spending their energy sucking the positivity out of something that others enjoy. Debate and even arguments are fun as hell, sometimes. Spending time on a message board just hoping to find an opportunity to call other people "dumbasses" just seems small and sad to me. 

But, it doesn't matter what I think. As long as you're not needlessly offending anyone, carry on as you wish!

[RGP1981]

I don't think even Luka-only fans hang out here, though. You might be the only one. 

I think most of us are here because we've been friends for over a decade (2-3 decades, in some cases). 

I guess I'm just not going to understand what people get out of spending their energy sucking the positivity out of something that others enjoy. Debate and even arguments are fun as hell, sometimes. Spending time on a message board just hoping to find an opportunity to call other people "dumbasses" just seems small and sad to me. 

But, it doesn't matter what I think. As long as you're not needlessly offending anyone, carry on as you wish!

Just so you know, I am not here to offend anyone or suck the positivity out of this space. Your team's owner and FO is doing a great job of the latter, not me. I think you're a cool and nice guy. I also like the way others post on here. I only want the Mavericks to be better (better than they have been at least). So I post about the things I hope to see them do, like changes in front office or the trades they can make. Then we all win.

[Jason Terry]

I think this thread is way off. We can’t look at it as “bring in a number 3 and number 4” . We already did that with guys who never fit. It doesn’t matter how talented a player is if he can’t play with Luka. Luka is a unique and extremely difficult player to fit with. Other players like Lebron and Harden have had these same problems.

If you look at this years Boston team or the Nuggets they have several guys who could be the 3-4-5-6 best player on a given night. They have quality depth that fits their team. We just need higher quality options with certain skills

Luka
Kyrie
Lively

^this is our core

Exum
Green
GWill
Jones Jr
Omax

^ These are the guys who have some of the skills to potentially fit on a good roster

We just need to get the right players with the right skills. We have much better options than we did a year ago

[ThisIStheYear]

Coach. That’s the most important position to upgrade. Bring in a strong willed coach with a bona fide winning resume and upgrade Williams to bring in a 4th core player and this team will roll. You only play five at a time in basketball, so it doesn’t take much to change a team’s outlook if they already have their star. Most any competent GM could turn this team into a contender. I hope Nico is up to it.

[mvossman]

I think this thread is way off. We can’t look at it as “bring in a number 3 and number 4” . We already did that with guys who never fit. It doesn’t matter how talented a player is if he can’t play with Luka. Luka is a unique and extremely difficult player to fit with. Other players like Lebron and Harden have had these same problems.

If you look at this years Boston team or the Nuggets they have several guys who could be the 3-4-5-6 best player on a given night. They have quality depth that fits their team. We just need higher quality options with certain skills

Luka
Kyrie
Lively

^this is our core

Exum
Green
GWill
Jones Jr
Omax

^ These are the guys who have some of the skills to potentially fit on a good roster

We just need to get the right players with the right skills. We have much better options than we did a year ago

What guys that are number 3 or 4 did we bring in?  KP was supposed to be a number 2 and busted (which I blame mostly on him).

I think you are overselling the depth on those two teams.  The difference between those teams and the Mavs is literally the 3 and 4 spot.

At the 1/2 the Luka/Kyrie combo is as good or better than Jokic/Murray or Tatum/Brown.  

At the 3-5 Boston has Jrue/White/KP.  All high level starters.  They probably have the best 5th man in the league (whoever you name).

At the 3-4 Denver has Gordon/Porter, two high level starters, and at 5 has Pope, a quality 3&D guy.

After that, both teams fall off in depth, at least as much as the Mavs do.  Boston has Horford and Pritchard as rotational guys.  After that it gets ugly quick.  Denver has an aging Reggie Jackson and a defensive specialist in Watson.  

The Mavs have Lively/Exum at the 3-4.  Lively already looks like he belongs in the 3-4 spot.  Exum looks like he could stick in the 5 spot similar to Pope.  What we need to get in the same league with those rosters is a player like Jrue/White/Gordon/Porter to be in our 3-4 spot with Lively.  That will push DJJ, GWill, Green and others into rotation spots where they belong.

You say that its really hard to find players that fit next to Luka, but most of the guys in Boston and Denver starting lineups would be perfect fits with Luka.  A bunch of guys that play high level defense, can create some on offense, and don't need the ball constantly.

[youzigizag]

Im not a big fan of plan powder...

Seems like the past 4 years we have had depleted draft asset and player assets to make trades...

If we really have 3 FRP's, some 2nd round picks, plus we have some decent players that arent as flawed as years past this coming offseason...

I say stay put at TDL unless something extremely nice falls in our lap.

Go get a PLAYER with the assets we will have this summer. Not some bargain isle semi-player you think you scored a deal on that MIGHT have potential. GO GET BBALL PLAYERS. ALL-STAR or fringe ALL-STAR caliber player.

This FO is wasting Luka years. Its put up or shut up or Luka is going to ask for a trade. Get a BBALL PLAYER or two in here. Not bottom shelf players with weird flaws.

[chaparral]

Coach. That’s the most important position to upgrade. Bring in a strong willed coach with a bona fide winning resume and upgrade Williams to bring in a 4th core player and this team will roll. You only play five at a time in basketball, so it doesn’t take much to change a team’s outlook if they already have their star. Most any competent GM could turn this team into a contender. I hope Nico is up to it.

Cuban will not hire a competent GM.

[mvossman]

Cuban will not hire a competent GM.

Actually he did, he is just not the GM.

[loki]

Current (Ceiling)

Luka 1 (1)
Kyrie 2 (2)
Lively 5 (3) - I'm not sure his offensive game will ever develop to be a 3rd option, but he could still be the 3rd best player overall.
Exum 8 (6) - He was incredible in December. I don't think he can sustain that kind of shooting though. He's probably best taking all the PG/SG minutes off the bench.
Green 8 (5) - Legit starter if he ever finds some consistency.
THJ 7 (6) - Dropping him to 7 because of fit with Luka/Kyrie. He would look a lot better on a team with a good defensive backcourt.
DJJ 9 (8) - Giving him a 9 only because I feel like defenses would ignore him in the postseason.
GWill 10 (8)
Maxi 10 (8)

[Scott41theMavs]

Exum 8 (6) - He was incredible in December. I don't think he can sustain that kind of shooting though. He's probably best taking all the PG/SG minutes off the bench.

Remember DFS? Couldn't shoot worth a damn when he entered the league as a rookie. Improved his shot year after year and ultimately became a legit threat from three. My point is, just because Exum couldn't hit the broad side of the barn when he came into the league doesn't mean that's the case years later, and moreover, his track record in his years overseas indicates that he quite simply learned how to shoot over there. People need to knock the hell off judging him by his prior work in the league. The man's a different player. And a freaking steal.

[loki]

Remember DFS? Couldn't shoot worth a damn when he entered the league as a rookie. Improved his shot year after year and ultimately became a legit threat from three. My point is, just because Exum couldn't hit the broad side of the barn when he came into the league doesn't mean that's the case years later, and moreover, his track record in his years overseas indicates that he quite simply learned how to shoot over there. People need to knock the hell off judging him by his prior work in the league. The man's a different player. And a freaking steal.

I'm not implying he's still a bad shooter, only that he'll come back to earth. Just looked it up and he hit 53% of his 3's in December. That may have raised our expectations a little too high given the small sample size.

[ThisIStheYear]

Cuban will not hire a competent GM.

I’m not calling Nico incompetent.. He’s even shown flashes of being good. The jury’s still out. But the coach is a different story.

[RGP1981]

I’m not calling Nico incompetent.. He’s even shown flashes of being good. The jury’s still out.

When you say, "He's even shown flashes of being good".... it makes me think of that old phrase, "Even a broken clock is right twice in the day".

[meistermatze]

I always thought Omahen was going to be this era's Markus. Obviously, Omahen won't be around after Luka leaves, retires, whatever, but I've found his contributions quite insightful and enriching. We are a better board because of him, for sure. 

And actually, I've noticed that we do still have some of our German posters around, including some I never realized (back then) were Germans. Makes me wonder how many of our current community are from Slovenia, and if any of them will eventually stick with the Mavs.

I am still sticking around as a german. I remember swearing to myself, I would not leave after TMOGE prophesized me leaving after Dirk retires, back in the day. Boy, was he wrong on oh so many things.