Game 12: Washington Wizards (2-9) vs. Dallas Mavericks (9-3) | 117-130 WIN!!!!!!!

[Razzmatazz_Hopskidillydoo]

Deni's going to be very good.

[Razzmatazz_Hopskidillydoo]

Lively has been so so good.  Even when he doesn’t get stats, he provides positive play.

I think Luka had only one lob to Lively before the third quarter, Grant Williams was the one feeding Lively before that.
Luka joined the part in the third.

Luka needs to involve Lively more, he seems to forget he has an athletic 7 footer with him from time to time.

[MrGoat]

Good to hear Timmeh's injury isn't too serious. He's getting my Dirkie vote tonight, Washington's defense was so bad Lively needed the double double to get my vote, Jones also found a lot of easy dunks against that terrible defense. Hardaway also had an assist to Dwight Powell in the first quarter at 37-22 which may have been the best pass I've ever seen him make to go with 30+ off the bench. When's the last time the Mavs had a game with so many dunks?

[dirkfansince1998]

Watching the Wizards reminded me of the dark days when the Mavs go to options on offense was Harrison Barnes. Poole and Kuzma are THJ-level scorers. 3rd/4th option on a good team, most likely in a 6th man role. And to make things worse for them they don't have a top tier young guy on the roster. Again. A little bit like the Mavs six years ago. Who is the most talented guy on their roster? Coulibaly?

[Mavs2021]

Hardy has been playing a level below both Exum and Curry so far this season. Kidd has done a good job finding minutes for him but it seems like he’s on his way out of the rotation. Hard to find arguments against either of Exum/Curry right now, they’ve both been very good the last few games.

Until last night Curry was shooting 25/17/83. He was the worst player besides Kleber to start the season. In fairness Curry used the non-existent defense of the Wizards to get himself going and gain some confidence. Could have given Hardy some of Green´s minutes, who apparently had no use for his 37 minutes. Not only did he go scoreless. He never drove to the rim once against a team that allowed Lively like seven uncontested dunks in like a 3-4 minute span. Eight guys played 19+ minutes last night. Each of them took at least four 2pt shots, because the Wizards offered no defensive resistance, but the fastest guy on our team didn´t drive once. So literally what was he doing in his 37 minutes.  He was also 5th in rebounding, 8th in assists, with one steal and no blocks. Not even like he set up the others.

[Chicagojk]

Wizards don't need to worry about bottoming out. They stink. I liked my first viewing of Bilal but he is going to need time. May not be a great idea for him to learn from their current best players either. Besides that, who else on their team is a future core player?

Kispart and Deni A seem to be solid depth guys but not either are starters on contending level teams. I would be looking to move Kuzma who still has fans. Tyus Jones has fans too but you aren't going to get much for him. I don't know what you do with Poole. I saw a quote from him last week saying how he liked having his "own" team now. What? He looks like a bench scorer to me. I don't like him calling this his team. Yuck.

I would just continue to demolish everything and rebuild. This years draft appears weak up top, but the following is suppose to be strong.

[ItsGoTime]

I wouldn’t mind a Deni/Gafford trade. Neither seem like they are FRP value. Pick swap and a couple seconds value maybe, for the 2?

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

I wouldn’t mind a Deni/Gafford trade. Neither seem like they are FRP value. Pick swap and a couple seconds value maybe, for the 2?

Deni would be pretty good here but I think Gafford would be a pretty expensive backup center.  Lively kind of owned him last night.

[ItsGoTime]

Deni would be pretty good here but I think Gafford would be a pretty expensive backup center.  Lively kind of owned him last night.

Feels like that might be a small sample size.

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

Feels like that might be a small sample size.

So would you trade for Gafford with the intention of playing him over Lively through his contract which would bring us to 2026?

[ItsGoTime]

So would you trade for Gafford with the intention of playing him over Lively through his contract which would bring us to 2026?

I would. I don’t think his contract is out of line for his production at all. As far as starting or not, whoever wins the role. I don’t feel this overwhelming need to start Lively like a lot of the vocal posters around here are so stuck on. I want the team to win now and in the playoffs and build towards a dynasty. 

I’ve known for a long time that if we get good C play on this team, the results would look like they do. 

Many people have made the point of combining the starter and bench salaries for positions. Combined, Lively and Gafford make $17M, hardly a reason to bring up salary issues if both continue to play like they do (or get better, Gafford playing with Luka and Kyrie as opposed to Poole and Kuzma). Gafford’s contract also comes up before Lively’s, if his production becomes less than now, it’s an easy time to fix that with Lively still on the rookie scale.

[KillerLeft]

So would you trade for Gafford with the intention of playing him over Lively through his contract which would bring us to 2026?

I wouldn't. I spent that entire game thinking "wow, Lively is already WAY better than this Gafford dude I heard about all summer."

[BolsDamols]

Always remember Gafford being one of those guys who always kill the Mavs, even in his Chicago days.
Lively's presence made him largely ineffective, that is what having a real big man in the line up can do.

[Winter]

I think we are at a point now that Lively is the starter. The starting lineup looks doesn't look like a problem. The rotation that comes in after the starters seems to be more of the issue. Guys like Green, Hardy, Curry, Powell, Maxi is where the struggles are.

I don't think you yank Lively backwards unless his play diminishes. His on-court relationship to Donic and Kyrie is something that needs to continue I think. I'm not sure it's wise to send a message to Lively that he's currently flawed as a starter. He seems like a great fit to me.

[KillerLeft]

I think we are at a point now that Lively is the starter. The starting lineup looks doesn't look like a problem. The rotation that comes in after the starters seems to be more of the issue. Guys like Green, Hardy, Curry, Powell, Maxi is where the struggles are.

I don't think you yank Lively backwards unless his play diminishes. His on-court relationship to Donic and Kyrie is something that needs to continue I think. I'm not sure it's wise to send a message to Lively that he's currently flawed as a starter. He seems like a great fit to me.

I am so aligned with this. 

Not only is it not broken and therefore not in need of fixing, but not trying to fix it will very likely result in it becoming less and less broken over the coming months/years. 

If you're looking for a center at all, you're looking for a backup.

[Mavs2021]

I wouldn't. I spent that entire game thinking "wow, Lively is already WAY better than this Gafford dude I heard about all summer."

If you read into how these guys perform for the Wizards, then you don´t want any of these players, but it´s not always that simple: circumstances matter.

Last season every young Houston player was a loser. Gigantic upgrade at coach, two veteran defensive upgrades in FVV/Brooks, a PG to steady the ship in FVV, a lucky break of Lopez not blocking Sengun´s starting position and suddenly they all winners.

Players are not dumb. All the Wizards know they are supposed to lose and will lose for the next 2-3 years. Now their best players are Kuzma/Poole, who are 3rd/4th best players on a play-off team and aren´t natural leaders that cannot tolerate losing. They are thinking, does it really matter, if we reach our ceiling of 26 instead of 16 wins. The team certainly won´t care. Might be more upset, if we jeopardize the ping-pong balls. Why kill myself for that. I just got paid. I´ll try again, when I´m in a better place or my next contract is due.

[KillerLeft]

If you read into how these guys perform for the Wizards, then you don´t want any of these players, but it´s not always that simple: circumstances matter.

Last season every young Houston player was a loser. Gigantic upgrade at coach, two veteran defensive upgrades in FVV/Brooks, a PG to steady the ship in FVV, a lucky break of Lopez not blocking Sengun´s starting position and suddenly they all winners.

Players are not dumb. All the Wizards know they are supposed to lose and will lose for the next 2-3 years. Now their best players are Kuzma/Poole, who are 3rd/4th best players on a play-off team and aren´t natural leaders that cannot tolerate losing. They are thinking, does it really matter, if we reach our ceiling of 26 instead of 16 wins. The team certainly won´t care. Might be more upset, if we jeopardize the ping-pong balls. Why kill myself for that. I just got paid. I´ll try again, when I´m in a better place or my next contract is due.

Yeah, I don't disagree with your general point here. I didn't mean it to be an anti-Gafford post (I see how it came across that way), I meant it to be a "why would I want to replace Lively right now" post.

[BigDirk41]

I don't see any point in sending Lively to the bench. I think that is counter productive and confidence matters. You don't want to mess with a young player's head that is exceeding expectations. Lively appears to be legit and it should be his job as long as he's a Mav unless his plays drops, as others have mentioned. If they bring a new center in, he needs to be the backup imo.

[Mavs2021]

Yeah, I don't disagree with your general point here. I didn't mean it to be an anti-Gafford post (I see how it came across that way), I meant it to be a "why would I want to replace Lively right now" post.

I would not either. Lively is the starter. Every center I acquire needs to understand this, especially veterans.

[Razzmatazz_Hopskidillydoo]

I would not either. Lively is the starter. Every center I acquire needs to understand this, especially veterans.

Olynyk would.
I hope nobody in this board tells me DP or Holmes is better than him.