2019-2020 Mavs Trade Discussion + Salary Chart

[SportPsychMav]

His contract is way better than CP3's...lol. At least he's 24. I agree that Minnesota probably won't make any moves right now unless their season falls apart.

RoCo for Lee would be fleecing at its finest. Sadly will never happen. RoCo is one of my favorite non Mavs though.

[omahen]

I wouldn't pursue either of those options, and I think their are others. The salaries of our deep stable of role players are structured such that some of those guys could be very trade-able. I definitely don't want to trade just to trade. I'm content with seeing what this team can do. But, if something we like pops up, it's possible that some of our modestly priced but productive role players could be packaged.

In case of number 1 we are basically trading Lee+THJ plus perhaps a minor asset. We keep all our bench.

In case of number 2 it is basically Lee. 

I don't agree about our salaries. Despite playing nicely together, none has shown he is more of a role player. And they are paid accordingly. No contender will trade starter level guy for one or two of our role players (unless something is wrong with that starter level guy or we add additional assets). What our role players could perhaps net would be a promising youngster from a contender looking for additional proven veterans.

[fifteenth]

In case of number 1 we are basically trading Lee+THJ plus perhaps a minor asset. We keep all our bench.

In case of number 2 it is basically Lee. 

I don't agree about our salaries. Despite playing nicely together, none has shown he is more of a role player. And they are paid accordingly. No contender will trade starter level guy for one or two of our role players (unless something is wrong with that starter level guy or we add additional assets). What our role players could perhaps net would be a promising youngster from a contender looking for additional proven veterans.

We've taken bad salaries back in the past in lieu of other assets. If our team plays well then we will have assets. I hope we're done taking back bad salaries. 

You're critique of my thoughts was of a scenario that I did not propose. But, I might rather have a promising youngster over a proven vet, as long as the promising youngster is an obvious talent and upside upgrade over what we're sending away.

[omahen]

We've taken bad salaries back in the past in lieu of other assets.

Lee is a bad salary, he is not an asset and will not become an asset. If someone is willing to give asset (plus bad salary) for him it is great. We will not have cap space next summer so we don't care at all if we get 2 years of bad salary. Or do you think it is better to just let him expire? THJ is also bad salary - if we can get more productive player with bad salary for him, I am considering it. We will certainly not get a productive player on good salary.

You're critique of my thoughts

I didn't critisize what you said. I said I have a different opinion.

[fifteenth]

Lee is a bad salary, he is not an asset and will not become an asset. If someone is willing to give asset (plus bad salary) for him it is great. We will not have cap space next summer so we don't care at all if we get 2 years of bad salary. Or do you think it is better to just let him expire? THJ is also bad salary - if we can get more productive player with bad salary for him, I am considering it. We will certainly not get a productive player on good salary.

The Mavs might agree with you, but I think there are other possibilities. I'm not a cap/trade expert by any means, but I'd rather use their expiring deals to help make the money work in a deal where we help a team come off longer term salary. But longer term salary that another team wants to come off of doesn't have to be bad salary. It just might be that the player doesn't fit their timeline. If you start asking me for examples I'll have to bow out, though. I'm already starting to feel a bit over my head here. 

I didn't critisize what you said. I said I have a different opinion.

"Critique" doesn't really have the same base connotation as the word "criticize" currently has. I could have used "evaluation" instead. 

cri·tique
/kriˈtēk/

noun


a detailed analysis and assessment of something, especially a literary, philosophical, or political theory.


verb

evaluate (a theory or practice) in a detailed and analytical way.
"the authors critique the methods and practices used in the research"

[omahen]

But longer term salary that another team wants to come off of doesn't have to be bad salary.

No one will just give away a good player because he doesn't fit their timeline. If he is good on a decent salary according to his production, they will want assets back. Love would be a perfect example of a good player that doesn't fit his team timeline. No way Cleveland trades him without getting a good young player and at least one first round pick.  Personally, I am not interested in one year rental vets (Gasol, Ibaka and similar). They would certainly cost assets and it is a long shot they would take us all the way. When the season is over we just lose their value.

Brooklyn or Milwaukee might be win now desperate and willing to trade their prospects for a proven player on a reasonable salary (there might be others, but I either don't see any valuable youngsters or they are too good to be traded). Brooklyn has Musa and Kurucs. Milwaukee has DiVincenzo and Wilson. Brooklyn could use a defensive PF/C. Question is, are we willing to part with Maxi for Musa and/or Kurucs? Milwaukee could use a shooter. Question is, would we be willing to part with Curry for DiVinzenzo and/or Wilson?

[StepBackJay]

https://twitter.com/townbrad/status/1191531656664010753

Give me Jae Crowder or someone similar (Aminu if he becomes available) who can add more depth for the role occupied by Maxi & DFS. Right now if one of those guys gets hurt we have some issues. By the TDL the Grizz will be in full tank mode and might rather play some kids. Mavs could give a 2 + the TE for Crowder at any time (don't have to wait for TDL I believe).

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What about Roco/Wiggins for THJ/Lee/fillers. It would be a all in move and while Wiggins is overpaid, he is really athletic and has had a good start to the season. He's long at 6'7". Roco is the 2 way guy we need. Wiggins is so young that he still has potential to get better. I'm not saying this is for sure the answer. Just a thought because I know this was thrown around during the summer by some on here.

Not going to happen. Mavs will do a blockbuster trade if it makes the team clearly better or a small move. They aren't going to do a high risk, see what happens move with this roster.

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It's still early, but to me the biggest need is far and away a legitimate two-way wing. We have Luka, we have guard depth with Brunson, Wright, and Curry, we have KP, we have big depth in Maxi, Dwight, and Boban. But for wings all we have are DFS and JJackson, two guys who are kind of one-dimensional in opposite ways. Getting a legit 15 ppg guy who can shoot and defend the other teams' best wing would go a long way towards making the Mavs true contenders.

You are right but those guys are hard to find. Mavs tried to get Danny Green who is sort of that guy but not 15 ppg, that's even harder to find than a solid 3D 10 ppg. I think DFS is still our best option for now, I like his growing confidence. I would like another big wing if possible, I just don't think Mavs will be able to score someone like you describe.

[aguiar95]

To me we are not in a position to get new players this season:

1) If we trade for a soon-to-be Free Agent (like Bogdanovic) we have no money to throw at him, and we have to accont in our books Doncic's future max extension.

2) Most teams in the league have better trade assets. To me the ones we could try to trade is Lee, 2nd rounders and THJ (even though I would like him  re-signing here on a fair deal like 8-10M/year). Maybe Jackson if we had to throw a young guy.

3) Our need right now is another defensive minded wing/forward who can score at least 10 points. It is very hard to find those. Covington, Draymond and Holiday are out of reach. Ibaka and Ingles don't fit our timeline. Players like Smart (BOS) and O'Neale (UTA) are too short to guard the opponent's wing. I would rather have our guys improve with chemistry than trading for Aminu/Crowder/Porter.

4) This final piece is so hard to find that most of our rivals in the western conference also doesn't have that 3&D wing.

Our next big move should be on 2021, when the THJ + Lee money could land us our final piece of the puzzle. We already have locked a great young core: Luka/KP/Powell/Kleber/Wright/Curry/DFS/Brunson

Intresting pieces to keep an eye for 2021 (Forget the big names): Anunoby (TOR), Isaac (ORL), Richardson (MIA), Oubre (PHO), Porter (CHI).

[Mavsfan12]

To me we are not in a position to get new players this season:

1) If we trade for a soon-to-be Free Agent (like Bogdanovic) we have no money to throw at him, and we have to accont in our books Doncic's future max extension.

2) Most teams in the league have better trade assets. To me the ones we could try to trade is Lee, 2nd rounders and THJ (even though I would like him  re-signing here on a fair deal like 8-10M/year). Maybe Jackson if we had to throw a young guy.

3) Our need right now is another defensive minded wing/forward who can score at least 10 points. It is very hard to find those. Covington, Draymond and Holiday are out of reach. Ibaka and Ingles don't fit our timeline. Players like Smart (BOS) and O'Neale (UTA) are too short to guard the opponent's wing. I would rather have our guys improve with chemistry than trading for Aminu/Crowder/Porter.

4) This final piece is so hard to find that most of our rivals in the western conference also doesn't have that 3&D wing.

Our next big move should be on 2021, when the THJ + Lee money could land us our final piece of the puzzle. We already have locked a great young core: Luka/KP/Powell/Kleber/Wright/Curry/DFS/Brunson

Intresting pieces to keep an eye for 2021 (Forget the big names): Anunoby (TOR), Isaac (ORL), Richardson (MIA), Oubre (PHO), Porter (CHI).

Richardson was traded to Philly for Butler.  Finding his place, but is a really good defender.  Overmatched last season as a first option.

Porter would be awesome here.  I stand by him.  Would love to see him as a Mav.  Put him next to Brogdon as my dreams on the last couple of season wish lists... 

Oubre - I am still trying to figure out wth WAS was doing trading their young up and coming player for washed up Ariza last season...  one of the strangest trades I can remember.  He is part of the PHX core - not available.

Isaac - I don't trust his shot.  He is a very interesting player who would be an upgrade on DFS as a defensive 3/4.  

Anunoby - pipe dream.  No chance he is available for what we have to offer.  He is the poster child for why trading non lottery picks is still a bad idea.  Guys like that at the end of the first round that turn into exactly the type of player that you can't afford to trade for...

[omahen]

If we trade for a soon-to-be Free Agent (like Bogdanovic)

Bogdanovic will be restricted. I guess we would also have his bird rights.

[aguiar95]

Richardson was traded to Philly for Butler.  Finding his place, but is a really good defender.  Overmatched last season as a first option.

Porter would be awesome here.  I stand by him.  Would love to see him as a Mav.  Put him next to Brogdon as my dreams on the last couple of season wish lists... 

Oubre - I am still trying to figure out wth WAS was doing trading their young up and coming player for washed up Ariza last season...  one of the strangest trades I can remember.  He is part of the PHX core - not available.

Isaac - I don't trust his shot.  He is a very interesting player who would be an upgrade on DFS as a defensive 3/4.  

Anunoby - pipe dream.  No chance he is available for what we have to offer.  He is the poster child for why trading non lottery picks is still a bad idea.  Guys like that at the end of the first round that turn into exactly the type of player that you can't afford to trade for...

I was thinking Free Agency, not trades. In 2021 all of them are available to throw our money. 

Richardson: PO 11M, probably will reject and become UFA.
Anunoby: RFA. Very difficult. Pray for TOR to mess up their cap situation somehow. Maybe our first rounder this year (12-24) could be this kind of guy.
Isaac: RFA. ORL will have to pay him and Fultz (already have 70M commited in 2021).
Oubre: UFA.
Porter: Probably takes his PO next year and becomes UFA. Maybe a trade candidate if CHI tanks?  (Lee+ THJ + Jackson + 2nd rounders for OPJ + Felicio)

[omahen]

Porter: Probably takes his PO next year and becomes UFA. Maybe a trade candidate if CHI tanks?  (Lee+ THJ + Jackson + 2nd rounders for OPJ + Felicio)

Based on how Porter is playing at the moment and what salary he has, I don't think it is worth any more than Lee+THJ for Porter+Felicio. We would basically do them a favour :-)

Chicago has nice team on paper but just doesn't work on field. At least not so far. Markannen is totally lost and getting worse game by game. Porter is also mostly bad.

[DanSchwartzgan]

To me we are not in a position to get new players this season:

 
Our next big move should be on 2021, when the THJ + Lee money could land us our final piece of the puzzle. We already have locked a great young core: Luka/KP/Powell/Kleber/Wright/Curry/DFS/Brunson

Waiting for 2021 doesn't prevent us from taking on money for the rest of this year and next.  Our next big move should occur whenever a good opportunity presents itself.

Something that has been missing from this conversation is the possibility BRI will go down next year (China).  The league hasn't provided guidance yet.  If the Cap and LT numbers shrink (even a little) instead of going up, it changes everyone's plans.  Things that don't seem likely or seem too expensive today might be more possible or less expensive if the numbers change.  The Mav's having Lee's expiring (and a TPE) this summer and THJ's expiring next summer might put them in a stronger position that we anticipate if BRI were to decline.

[ItsGoTime]

No one will just give away a good player because he doesn't fit their timeline. If he is good on a decent salary according to his production, they will want assets back. Love would be a perfect example of a good player that doesn't fit his team timeline. No way Cleveland trades him without getting a good young player and at least one first round pick.

Not during the season, but there have been plenty of examples in the offseason in the last few years of teams dumping salary from players to sign their target (players that don't fit their salary timeline). Utah did it with Favors, Baynes from Boston, we got Barnes and Bogut similarly, etc...

[omahen]

Not during the season, but there have been plenty of examples in the offseason in the last few years of teams dumping salary from players to sign their target (players that don't fit their salary timeline). Utah did it with Favors, Baynes from Boston, we got Barnes and Bogut similarly, etc...

True. But you have to have cap space to do that. Mavs will not have it next year.

[ItsGoTime]

Not during the season, but there have been plenty of examples in the offseason in the last few years of teams dumping salary from players to sign their target (players that don't fit their salary timeline). Utah did it with Favors, Baynes from Boston, we got Barnes and Bogut similarly, etc...

True. But you have to have cap space to do that. Mavs will not have it next year.

That's true until it isn't.

[dirkfansince1998]

A two-way wing is the obvious answer for most of our remaining problems. Looking at possible trade targets and free agent options from last season it seems like the Mavs missed their opportunity and will have to wait for 2021.

Over the last few month we discussed...

RoCo and Wiggins. Nothing really changed about them but the Timberwolves clearly improved. Towns looked like a legit MVP candidat in the first few games. Don´t think the Timberwolves are willing to engage in trade talks right now.

Hayward. Back to his former self or maybe even better. 20/7/4 on 65% TS. Any team that wanted to buy low on him missed the opportunity. With Browns pay day incoming the Celtics will need to make some tough decisions. He might be a trade candidate but the Mavs don´t have the assets.

Marvin Williams. Not really a starter at this point of his career but he still offers solid defense and 3-point shooting. Contract expires. Wouldn´t move the needle.

Aminu. Not really a fit on the current Magic roster. They have Gordon and Isaac providing a similar skill set. Both being younger and more talented. I always like the idea of former player returning. Not really sure what the Magic would want in return.

Bogdanovic. RFA that will probably get payed next summer. Not sure if the Mavs want to be the team to pay him. Kings gone be Kings but I am not sure if they are letting the Mavs get away with another rip off.

Crowder. Asked to do way to much on a bad team. 28/23/77 shooting splits. Probably lowers his price. Would add some missing physicality, experience and toughness. Overall DFS seems to be a younger and better version of him.


To sum it up. The trade market is dry right now. Will probably heat up a little bit closer to the deadline when tanking teams try to collect assets and contending teams try to add the missing piece. Market for wing sized players looks even worse. We would need another KP-sized miracle to add a quality rotation piece without any 1st round picks to use and Lee + THJ contracts on the payroll.

[embellisher]

A two-way wing is the obvious answer for most of our remaining problems. Looking at possible trade targets and free agent options from last season it seems like the Mavs missed their opportunity and will have to wait for 2021.
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Crowder. Asked to do way to much on a bad team. 28/23/77 shooting splits. Probably lowers his price. Would add some missing physicality, experience and toughness. Overall DFS seems to be a younger and better version of him.


Market for wing sized players looks even worse. We would need another KP-sized miracle to add a quality rotation piece without any 1st round picks to use and Lee + THJ contracts on the payroll.

A two way wing is on most teams wish list. There simply aren't that many of this type that are truly two way, most of the better defenders are not good shooters and vice versa. These guys come at a premium price, and we're short on assets and cap space. 

Crowder is an interesting idea. One poster mentioned him as an "in addition to" 3&D wing instead of a replacement for DFS. If DFS gets hurt, it would be nice to have an inexpensive player of a similar type. This team has plenty of scorers. We're a little short on defenders with size, and while Jae isn't huge, he plays bigger than he is, just like DFS.

[ItsGoTime]

Crowder is an interesting idea. One poster mentioned him as an "in addition to" 3&D wing instead of a replacement for DFS. If DFS gets hurt, it would be nice to have an inexpensive player of a similar type. This team has plenty of scorers. We're a little short on defenders with size, and while Jae isn't huge, he plays bigger than he is, just like DFS.

Hmmm, Crowder would be toward the top of the group that we currently have, but I think he's proven to be a bench guy just like the rest of the guys we have. If we can get him for one or some of our lesser guys, I'm all for it, just not for one of our top 10. At that point we would just be making our bench unit stronger whether he started or not.

Edit: To piggy back on this thought. What about AI and Crowder for JJ, THJ and 2 seconds?

[Mavs2019]

Crowder hates Carlisle. This is not happening as long as he is the headcoach.