DRAFT: #18 [Green] & #31 [Terry] & trade for #36 [Tyler Bey]

[Kammrath]

I think Terry and Smith have much higher ceilings.

I would rather have Quickley or Ty-Shon over Maxey. I hear all the hype around Terry, but I don't get how a poor's man Trae is what we want next to Luka.

[Mavs2019]

I think Terry and Smith have much higher ceilings.

I would rather have Quickley or Ty-Shon over Maxey. I hear all the hype around Terry, but I don't get how a poor's man Trae is what we want next to Luka.

What does that translate to? 14/6/3 as a rookie? I´d take that, cause it´s some serious trade capital.

Or do we wait for poor man´s sophomore Trae, which would be like 22 PPG and 7.5 APG. 

[Scott41theMavs]

I think Terry and Smith have much higher ceilings.

I would rather have Quickley or Ty-Shon over Maxey. I hear all the hype around Terry, but I don't get how a poor's man Trae is what we want next to Luka.

He's quite a bit larger than Trae Young. If he can parlay his growth spurt into better (e.g., almost-average defense on small guards, Luka guards the big guards) defense, then he checks all of the "Jrue Holiday" boxes next to Luka to some extent - can create his own shot, crafty finisher, can QB the team when Luka sits, ***arguably the best in the draft off-ball*** (when you take into account Nesmith's small sample size), big BBIQ. Not in favor of dismissive epithets to write off players who could help us quite well.

[cjeter24]

I do not agree with most of Adam Spinella's evals. He and I see basketball very differently. The one thing I appreciate him most though is that he is not afraid to go against the grain.

What I find interesting about it is that he's taking coaching experience into account. Like, you can be the 62nd best off-the-bounce scorer in the league, but if so, you're not likely to ever be given an opportunity to thrive in that role. So, you'd better A) be aware of what role you WILL have a chance to carve out and B) be willing to learn the skills involved with that role. This is why guys like Wiggins can't figure out how to have decent careers. This is why DSJ is flaming out. This is why WCS was available for a 2nd round pick, etc, etc. 

Another thing I've learned this year is that it's REALLY hard to predict who's going to make it at the next level, and what seems to matter most is where these guys end up, situationally. Like, if RJ Hampton gets a chance to run an NBA offense as the main ball handler, I'm reasonably confident that he'll turn into a solid pro, but that chance is far from a guarantee. If Dallas drafted him, would he learn to be a secondary guy who could contribute off-ball, or would he wilt like DSJ? There's almost no way to tell, imo, though maybe the teams have the means to make more educated guesses by interviewing these guys. 

His notes on Tyler Bey were very reminiscent of the conversation you and I had about him. We both like him, but we see his ideal role a little differently. Which one would HE prefer? Does he land on a team that agrees with him?

Coaching matters so much. True greatness always finds a way but often is hampered by coaching or situation. The best example of this in the NBA is Harden in OKC and Houston. 

I've used AG as the guy I think can really blossom outside of his situation. But ultimately it's on AG for not adapting or finding a way to be better in his situation. Some guys just don't have the right mindset or BBIQ to make it work. The trick is finding those guys and actually fixing them. For every Harden there are about 100x more Nerlens Noels of the NBA ha.

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Would anyone do #18/whatever makes it cap legal for #25/Schroeder?

If it includes Wright or Powell absolutely. I would punt on this draft to unload those contracts. If I get Schroeder? Bonus. 

I actually think both are good players and not bad contracts when healthy. Powell's is definitely awful now. 
However one doesn't fit and the other is just so easily replaceable even when healthy. I don't mind paying him that money whenever you have your team built. But right now, we need cap space next summer to add long term starters here. Forget Giannis. So many pieces to be had next summer.

[Reunion Mav Old]

tankathon has updated its mock draft.

18 Maxey
31 Woodard

Btw: has Nick Richards declared?

https://youtu.be/kKP22t1wXnY

Looks like a guy who is destined to catch lobs. Ive read smth about a 7‘5 wingspan but unconfirmed. Haven’t seen him in many mock drafts at this point.

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Love to hear the DX-guys on Hayes. If he slides to 10+ then Id try hard to move up. Unfortunately I doubt Haliburton is in reach for us, that dude looks like a dream fit here.

Still low on Hampton. I just don’t see the outside shot ever be enough. Hed have a difficult time in our PnR system.

I kinda expect us to end up with Green at 18. Would be a really good pick. Not sure Id package 18 and 31 for someone like S. Bey or Achiuwa. Taking two attempts in a draft like thus seems like a smart idea in general.

Also still in on Poku if he’s the guy at #18 That’s an exciting prospect. Super mobile and skilled for his size.

I don't know that we have the luxury of using 31 as a trade chip for anything other than dumping Wright for a guy expiring in '21. I hate the idea of using 18 to unload Wright for anyone short of perhaps Oladipo, but if the Mavs' goal is max space in '21, it looks like dumping Wright is a must. So, no trade-up, no second shot... I would consider Green a very meh get at 18, but (shrug).

I hate moves like that. Wouldn’t do it until I’d have to. Imo Carlisle and Delon just need to figure their stuff out. I’d give it another shot, after the season he has only one year left anyway. Should be cheaper to move him by then.

Does anyone remember the Ray Felton-resurgence? That came out of nowhere (& at a later stage of his career) too.

I do. There have been others. Sometimes greener pastures result in resurgence. We have experienced that to. Like everything else when it comes to players, the difficulty is figuring out which players are going to surge forward, or put another way, outplay their contract.

[Mavs2019]

tankathon has updated its mock draft.

18 Maxey
31 Woodard

Btw: has Nick Richards declared?

https://youtu.be/kKP22t1wXnY

Looks like a guy who is destined to catch lobs. Ive read smth about a 7‘5 wingspan but unconfirmed. Haven’t seen him in many mock drafts at this point.

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Love to hear the DX-guys on Hayes. If he slides to 10+ then Id try hard to move up. Unfortunately I doubt Haliburton is in reach for us, that dude looks like a dream fit here.

Still low on Hampton. I just don’t see the outside shot ever be enough. Hed have a difficult time in our PnR system.

I kinda expect us to end up with Green at 18. Would be a really good pick. Not sure Id package 18 and 31 for someone like S. Bey or Achiuwa. Taking two attempts in a draft like thus seems like a smart idea in general.

Also still in on Poku if he’s the guy at #18 That’s an exciting prospect. Super mobile and skilled for his size.

I don't know that we have the luxury of using 31 as a trade chip for anything other than dumping Wright for a guy expiring in '21. I hate the idea of using 18 to unload Wright for anyone short of perhaps Oladipo, but if the Mavs' goal is max space in '21, it looks like dumping Wright is a must. So, no trade-up, no second shot... I would consider Green a very meh get at 18, but (shrug).

I hate moves like that. Wouldn’t do it until I’d have to. Imo Carlisle and Delon just need to figure their stuff out. I’d give it another shot, after the season he has only one year left anyway. Should be cheaper to move him by then.

Does anyone remember the Ray Felton-resurgence? That came out of nowhere (& at a later stage of his career) too.

I do. There have been others. Sometimes greener pastures result in resurgence. We have experienced that to. Like everything else when it comes to players, the difficulty is figuring out which players are going to surge forward, or put another way, outplay their contract.

No I dont´t remember that. Unless you mean 

2013 Shitty Knicks level
2014 Drop 33% from already shitty Knicks level
2015 Resurgence to still shitty 2013 Knicks level

[cjeter24]

Not sure if this has been posted yet from yesterday. 
I definitely wouldn't hate taking Terry. Crazy impressive how much he's transformed his body the last 6 months. Lots of hard work. Got to love the work ethic. 

https://www.theringer.com/2020/11/9/2155...ft-lottery

[KillerLeft]

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/th...0497519699

Listen to this and tell me this kid doesn’t sound like a Maverick. 

My Mavs wishlist has updated:

1. Vassell
2. Hampton
3. SBey
4. Nesmith

[cjeter24]

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/th...0497519699

Listen to this and tell me this kid doesn’t sound like a Maverick. 

My Mavs wishlist has updated:

1. Vassell
2. Hampton
3. SBey
4. Nesmith

It just depends on the other moves we want to make the next year for my wishlist. If we are making moves to exhaust our guard depth and not make a trade for one of the big names... I'd love Terry, Kira Lewis, Hampton. 

If we aren't moving any guard names and we do make a trade for a guard or even plan on signing one next summer.... I'd have a hard time saying draft a guard. Carlisle is tough on rookies, lack of playing time, lack of future playing time.... Even if that player is a great talent, it will be tough for them ever to actually show much with having trouble getting on the court. 

In that case, go forward. Nesmith or Jalen Smith really intrigue me. 

Vassell shot worries me. And I don't get the hype on SBey. He seems very slow. Every highlight I've seen of him driving is him struggling to get by anyone. I think Wes had less trouble driving by people...

[KillerLeft]

Vassell’s shot was fine two months ago. One month ago, he started messing with it. Now, it’s jacked. I’m betting he can unlearn all of that. I have a feeling he’s not only going to be a good 3&D player, but actually a star.

I think Villanova makes good players. Smart players. I think Bey is one of the most complete and ready to step into an NBA role names on the list.

Would be thrilled to have either of them at #18.

[chaparral]

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/th...0497519699

Listen to this and tell me this kid doesn’t sound like a Maverick. 

My Mavs wishlist has updated:

1. Vassell
2. Hampton
3. SBey
4. Nesmith

Plan Powder says the Mavs will trade down.

[Scott41theMavs]

Vassell’s shot was fine two months ago. One month ago, he started messing with it. Now, it’s jacked. I’m betting he can unlearn all of that. I have a feeling he’s not only going to be a good 3&D player, but actually a star.

I think Villanova makes good players. Smart players. I think Bey is one of the most complete and ready to step into an NBA role names on the list.

Would be thrilled to have either of them at #18.

I'd be thrilled to have a Ferrari for $20,000, too. Those two cats aren't falling that far. Gotta trade up for 'em.

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https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/th...0497519699

Listen to this and tell me this kid doesn’t sound like a Maverick.

My Mavs wishlist has updated:

1. Vassell
2. Hampton
3. SBey
4. Nesmith

Plan Powder says the Mavs will trade down.

That makes sense if the goal is just to shed salary by making a team who wants to move up take on our unwanted (Wright) contracts. If it's just a matter of getting a cheaper rookie scale as a major piece of cap shaving, they should have learned from the Olynyk-Giannis-Howard trade back in '13. They would deserve medieval torture if they did that crap again.

[Kammrath]

And I don't get the hype on SBey. He seems very slow. Every highlight I've seen of him driving is him struggling to get by anyone.

His ceiling is quite low IMO. I am not taken with him, but I think his floor is quite high, so he is a safe kind of pick to me.

[KillerLeft]

I'd be thrilled to have a Ferrari for $20,000, too. Those two cats aren't falling that far. Gotta trade up for 'em.

Agreed, but I feel like there’s a decent chance that one of my four guys is there.

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And I don't get the hype on SBey. He seems very slow. Every highlight I've seen of him driving is him struggling to get by anyone.

His ceiling is quite low IMO. I am not taken with him, but I think his floor is quite high, so he is a safe kind of pick to me.

3&D ceiling, probably, but I think he’ll be more effective in that role than you do. Intelligence is important.

[Scott41theMavs]

I'd be thrilled to have a Ferrari for $20,000, too. Those two cats aren't falling that far. Gotta trade up for 'em.

Agreed, but I feel like there’s a decent chance that one of my four guys is there.

Well, that's an awfully magnanimous admission on your part - since it's a safe bet that either Nesmith or Hampton will be there. ;-p

[KillerLeft]

If Hampton is there, you have to take him. That’s better than trading up for ANYONE, imo.

EDIT: unless Vassell makes it to the very late lottery, somehow.

[Kammrath]

If Hampton is there, you have to take him. That’s better than trading up for ANYONE, imo.

I was there in my last Mavs draft board, Hampton was my top "take at #18" guy. I would be ok hopping to #14 for him I think.

He just couldn't make a bucket from deep OR at the rim....if that hasn't changed he could bust like DSJ. But if that isn't the real RJ then I have said he is easily one of the best players in this draft.

[KillerLeft]

He reminds me a little bit of Devin Harris, to be honest.

[Kammrath]

He reminds me a little bit of Devin Harris, to be honest.

I like that comparison quite a bit. Did Devin suck at the rim his freshman year in WIS?

[KillerLeft]

He reminds me a little bit of Devin Harris, to be honest.

I like that comparison quite a bit. Did Devin suck at the rim his freshman year in WIS?

I honestly can’t remember, but I do feel like RJ’s handles are better coming in. What makes me think of Harris is the speed. Hopefully, that translates to defense the way it did for Harris. Couldn’t hurt to have a secondary guy with PG skills and that type of speed in transition, either.