NBA TRADE TALK: TDL over

[aguiar95]

I actually disagree with this.  Gobert is probably the most impactful defender in the NBA.  He is also elite (top 5) rebounder and P&R player.  His on court impact is insane.  In my mind swapping KP for Gobert actually makes us a legit contender.  A Gobert/DFS/Bullock/Luka/Brunson starting lineup would be top 3 defensively and likely top 10 offensively.  I would be more than happy to send KP + first for Gobert.  Probably more if I had to.

Right now we have this same lineup except with a better offensive player in KP instead of Gobert. It's 18th-20th in the league offensively.

[mvossman]

Right now we have this same lineup except with a better offensive player in KP instead of Gobert. It's 18th-20th in the league offensively.

That is not really true.  Our most common 5 man lineup does not even have KP in it.  Powell has been starting most of the season (and he is not even close to Gobert offensive impact), Brunson was not a starter for our first 20 games and Bullock has only started 14.

I would also argue that this team is due for some regression on both offense and defense.  Luka was terrible to start the season and the entire team was in a shooting slump.  They are probably closer to top 10 offense, and this defense is probably closer to top 10 than top 5.

I'm not sure the difference between KP and Gobert offensively is that big when you factor in how well Gobert would fit with Luka.  Add in the fact that KP misses 40% of his games and Gobert probably has a better overall season impact on offense than KP does.

[aguiar95]

I would also argue that this team is due for some regression on both offense and defense.  Luka was terrible to start the season and the entire team was in a shooting slump.  They are probably closer to top 10 offense, and this defense is probably closer to top 10 than top 5.

I'm not sure the difference between KP and Gobert offensively is that big when you factor in how well Gobert would fit with Luka.  Add in the fact that KP misses 40% of his games and Gobert probably has a better overall season impact on offense than KP does.

I'll agree to disagree. Everytime I watch this team I'm positive we won't go pass 105-110 points no matter who's playing.

[Kammrath]

https://twitter.com/TheSteinLine/status/...3499939844

[F Gump]

Isn't there a reality that swapping a more expensive player for a cheaper one should mean you also expect to end up with somewhat lesser talent? 

Both UT and POR are over the tax line right now. How about if UT and POR end up with a bit less talent (on paper) as the consequence of reducing their payroll obligations?

The following works as one deal, with no other players needed. Simple deal. It offers significant salary savings for both UT and POR, both now and later, and drops POR below the tax line. 

KP to UT
THJ to POR
Gobert, McCollum to Dallas

[F Gump]

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...9024795657

Every time Morey drops another round of PR-laced "rumors" to try to pump up the value and demand for BS, I wonder "who does he think he's fooling?" Is any team buying this stuff, that BS is this star that's worth an arm and a leg? It's as if the very real issues don't exist, that a team would have to choke down if they traded for him.

The idea that BS could land Harden? Doesn't make sense to me. Seems like total wishful thinking, being peddled by Morey as a hot possibility, but not something that ever had any real substance.

Maybe I'm just missing BS's wonderful desirability, that any team would be lucky to get. (~sarcasm alert~) But I really don't get it -- with his contract, I wouldn't have any interest in assuming the risk (that's killing Philly) while also being forced into giving up much in value for him.

[Kammrath]

Isn't there a reality that swapping a more expensive player for a cheaper one should mean you also expect to end up with somewhat lesser talent? 

Both UT and POR are over the tax line right now. How about if UT and POR end up with a bit less talent (on paper) as the consequence of reducing their payroll obligations?

The following works as one deal, with no other players needed. Simple deal. It offers significant salary savings for both UT and POR, both now and later, and drops POR below the tax line. 

KP to UT
THJ to POR
Gobert, McCollum to Dallas

Man that would be fantastic. But I personally would be willing to throw a sweetener to UTA...not to POR. THJ for CJM feels fair straight up.

[Jommybone]

Man that would be fantastic. But I personally would be willing to throw a sweetener to UTA...not to POR. THJ for CJM feels fair straight up.

Can’t imagine a mere “sweetener” would come close to doing it. This is as reasonable as Simmons for Harden straight up.

[Kammrath]

Can’t imagine a mere “sweetener” would come close to doing it.

By "sweetener" I am referring to a pick or young/good player. So a significant asset.

However...

1) RG turns 30 in June. KP turns 27 in August. 

2) RG has $38,172,414 / $41,000,000 / $43,827,587 / $46,655,173 left over the next 4 seasons. KP has $33,833,400 / $36,016,200 left over the next 2 seasons. 

So yes, RG is better than KP, no question. BUT KP is 3 years younger AND is owed ~$100,000,000 less in salary and comes off the books 2 years sooner. As @"F Gump" pointed out, that is significant, especially in a world where big men getting paid like that is becoming more and more rare. 

So for me, RG for KP+1st as an example feels in the ballpark of fair.

[cow]

By "sweetener" I am referring to a pick or young/good player. So a significant asset.

However...

1) RG turns 30 in June. KP turns 27 in August. 

2) RG has $38,172,414 / $41,000,000 / $43,827,587 / $46,655,173 left over the next 4 seasons. KP has $33,833,400 / $36,016,200 left over the next 2 seasons. 

So yes, RG is better than KP, no question. BUT KP is 3 years younger AND is owed ~$100,000,000 less in salary and comes off the books 2 years sooner. As @"F Gump" pointed out, that is significant, especially in a world where big men getting paid like that is becoming more and more rare. 

So for me, RG for KP+1st as an example feels in the ballpark of fair.

The goal for Utah should be to keep Mitchell.  Yes, Gobert and Mitchell clash so there is some benefit for moving on from Gobert but KP downgrades the potential of the team.   I think you'd need to do more than one pick.  Maybe Max for Jingles and something else.

[RedFlag41]

I heard and read that Toronto needs a Center. Almost everyone is down with KP. Luka loves Goran Dragic. The Mavs need more perimeter defenders and scoring. How about this trade with Toronto:

KP, Moses Brown for Goran Dragic and Gary Trent Jr.

Toronto seems to be good with their current line up of VanVleet, Barnes, OG, Siakam. They only need an upgrade at Center. What about we trade them two centers in KP and Moses.

I think KP will fit with them. very nicely with all, of the great defenders they have. KP can protect the rim for them and will not be heavily relied on defending the perimeter.

For the Mavs, we finally get Goran Dragic and Gary Trent Jr. who can play either wing positions.

With Goran in the line up, maybe the Mavs can explore a trade for Jerami Grant for Brunson and THJ; or a trade for Myles Turner perhaps?

[cow]

I heard and read that Toronto needs a Center. Almost everyone is down with KP. Luka loves Goran Dragic. The Mavs need more perimeter defenders and scoring. How about this trade with Toronto:

KP, Moses Brown for Goran Dragic and Gary Trent Jr.

Toronto seems to be good with their current line up of VanVleet, Barnes, OG, Siakam. They only need an upgrade at Center. What about we trade them two centers in KP and Moses.

I think KP will fit with them. very nicely with all, of the great defenders they have. KP can protect the rim for them and will not be heavily relied on defending the perimeter.

For the Mavs, we finally get Goran Dragic and Gary Trent Jr. who can play either wing positions.

With Goran in the line up, maybe the Mavs can explore a trade for Jerami Grant for Brunson and THJ; or a trade for Myles Turner perhaps?

Trent Jr. is having a career year.  You'd probably need to attach draft capital.

[SleepingHero]

Isn't there a reality that swapping a more expensive player for a cheaper one should mean you also expect to end up with somewhat lesser talent? 

Both UT and POR are over the tax line right now. How about if UT and POR end up with a bit less talent (on paper) as the consequence of reducing their payroll obligations?

The following works as one deal, with no other players needed. Simple deal. It offers significant salary savings for both UT and POR, both now and later, and drops POR below the tax line. 

KP to UT
THJ to POR
Gobert, McCollum to Dallas

I too want to live in a perfect world where other teams just give us their good players for our medium players.

[mvossman]

Trent Jr. is having a career year.  You'd probably need to attach draft capital.

My god did Toronto call that one right with the Powell trade to Portland.  Portland already dumped Powell and Trent is having a career year on a smaller contract.  I have no interest in trading with Toronto.  Fairly sure they will come out ahead.

[Kammrath]

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...8602558467

[Jommybone]

My god did Toronto call that one right with the Powell trade to Portland.  Portland already dumped Powell and Trent is having a career year on a smaller contract.  I have no interest in trading with Toronto.  Fairly sure they will come out ahead.

Makes me even more suspicious that Riley has naked pictures of Masai. How else could he get Kyle Lowry for Dragic’s arthritic bones and leave-me-open Achiuwa (42.5% FG, 30.8% 3P, 54.5% FT).

[soog]

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...8602558467

I was very happy not to see Dallas on that list

[F Gump]

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...8602558467

The most interesting parts of that note of who has looked at BS ....

1 The list includes teams with "some level of interest" -- which is a VERY broad set of parameters.
2 Yet there are only 11 on it. Meanwhile, Morey keeps telling everyone that BS is the most desirable player around.
3 Even as broad as that qualifier is, see that there is no inclusion of the Nets at all, despite the leaked and much-ballyhooed "potential trade looming" that supposedly would pull Harden to Philly.

Morey is continuing to try to negotiate through the media, it seems, hoping to create the illusion of interest. While going nowhere. It's a market that simply doesn't exist, at the price he keeps proclaiming is what he's going to get. Will he? We'll see.

[Jommybone]

Would be interesting to see a list of teams that have never signed a Rich Paul client.

[dirkfansince1998]

Would be interesting to see a list of teams that have never signed a Rich Paul client.

Maybe not never. Make it once and never again.