2020-2021 ROSTER TALK: Archived

[Hypermav]

Warriors problem: Some of their current lineup combinations with Wiseman just don’t work
OK, this is where it gets tricky. If you say that Wiseman should remain in the starting lineup, which I am saying, then you also have to acknowledge that the team’s five-man unit with the second-worst net rating so far this season is … Wiseman in the starting lineup. That is, Wiseman with Curry, Green, Oubre and Wiggins, which has a staggering minus-15.6 net rating in 176 minutes together on the floor.
That is bad. It might get better over the course of the season. It might remain really bad. But I don’t think there’s a logical fix for this, because Wiseman has to play and work through his problems catching the ball, staying disciplined on defense, holding his position on the defensive glass and generally not fouling everybody in sight. He has to make as many strides as possible this season so he’s ready for next season, when Klay is back and the Warriors might have one or two other high-talent youngsters on the roster. (Or the Warriors have to see enough to decide whether they should think about trading him for a large return.) There just can’t be any more 11-minute nights for Wiseman like his quick stint in Portland on Wednesday. I think Kerr is now committed to making sure Wiseman gets a lot of time every night, and Kerr will grin and bear it through the mistakes.
Wiseman’s horrendous statistics with the starting unit, though, need to be explored and possibly explained. And maybe there is something …

What’s the best possible solution? It’s a small sample size, but if you just switch Bazemore for Wiggins and keep Wiseman with Curry, Draymond and Oubre, you get the Warriors’ best five-man lineup so far this season, with a plus-36.5 net rating, albeit in only 36 minutes together. That’s a pretty dramatic difference: Bazemore in that group brings the best number. Wiggins in that group brings the worst. Hmm.
Is it realistic to think that the main problem is Wiseman and Wiggins together? I can’t put a finger on why this would be, but the numbers are clear. Who makes up the Warriors’ worst two-man unit in plus-minus? It’s Wiggins and Wiseman, at -124 in 376 minutes. It’s absolutely a demolition to the Warriors’ chances in a game singularly in the minutes those two are on the floor together.
The Warriors’ worst three-man unit is Wiseman, Wiggins and Curry, which should never happen. No Curry unit should be the worst possible three-man group, and yet this one is -98 in 309 minutes together.
My proposed solution would be to keep the same starting lineup to begin both halves but make sure that Bazemore comes in pretty quick for Wiggins and then keep Wiseman away from Wiggins as much as possible after those two six-minute stints. That means in game-closing units, either Wiggins or (more likely) Wiseman probably should be sitting on the bench, at least for the last few minutes.

https://theathletic.com/2427522/2021/03/...dailyemail

[SkenfromLMF]

Well like we definitely aren't including a top 7 player so it would probably mean Mavs are parting with one of their rookies.

The problem is that rookies are like new cars...
Once they drive off the lot the value goes down - It is the reason there is a product called GAP Insurance. Right now the only rookies with value are Terry and Bey - and the road to trade Bey is muy complicated.

[Jason Terry]

Mavs: Gordon, Wiseman, Fournier 

Warriors: KP

Magic: Johnson, Oubre, Looney, J Green, Terry and MIN 1st 

Magic could then flip Oubre to a 4th team and keep whatever asset they could get

[chaparral]

I have hit on a few things over the years, but one for every 27,000 guesses doesn't seem like much of a batting average.  

I did nail the Gary Trent deal (I had one of the filler pieces wrong, but it was otherwise dead on).  I used LaFrentz and NVE as an example of something Cuban might do that fit the pattern established by the Howard deal (but I dismissed the idea as being too unbalanced).  Those were both at the LMF board.  I used to post something called "The Summer of Schwartz" every year where I made big sweeping changes that resulted in 5-6 new Exel players on the team each year.  A few of those came true over the years, but it was a schtick more than a prediction.  I also posted the exact concept that six months later became the much ballyhooed Damp Chip.  Dallas didn't use "the chip" in the way DL and I visualized, but that doesn't mean it wasn't an elegant concept.

I think it used to be much easier to predict things when Cuban was in his money-whipping stage.  It has been harder in the post championship years where we just kept churning the roster with moves that didn't seem to make obvious improvements.  Omahen got the Curry/JRich part right this summer.  Maybe we are back in serious talent acquisition mode (at least I hope so).

"The Summer of Schwartz" talk is what got me hooked on the fantasy trade concept - Thanks Dan...  

The KP to GS for Wiseman (Schwartz) is something I still hope happens, just not with Wiggins.  Maybe Wiggins to CLV and Love to Big D for that 3-way.  But for now - thank goodness Griffin (Schwartz) is out of the way.

[StepBackJay]

The problem is that rookies are like new cars...
Once they drive off the lot the value goes down - It is the reason there is a product called GAP Insurance. Right now the only rookies with value are Terry and Bey - and the road to trade Bey is muy complicated.

Ya no kidding that's why I don't think a Nance deal is likely.

[StepBackJay]

"The Summer of Schwartz" talk is what got me hooked on the fantasy trade concept - Thanks Dan...  

The KP to GS for Wiseman (Schwartz) is something I still hope happens, just not with Wiggins.  Maybe Wiggins to CLV and Love to Big D for that 3-way.  But for now - thank goodness Griffin (Schwartz) is out of the way.

https://tradenba.com/trades/VsL42ia24

This fails but would work with some filler. I hadn't thought ab a Love for Wiggins move. So KP goes to GS, Wiseman and Love go to Dallas and Wiggins goes to Cleveland. Not sure if Cleveland has any interest in Wiggins, they might rather just get cap savings that Powell + Johnson would give them. If GS gets KP and dumps Wiggins they are making out like bandits. They would need to give up some filler as well to make the math work. They would lose some talent in Wiggins but they might rather try to hold onto Oubre who is a cheaper SF.

I don't like a Love deal that doesn't include Powell's money getting dumped so that would be a requirement for me.

This trade would be successful and move Powell to GS - https://tradenba.com/trades/eoBFGtF8I.

[SleepingHero]

I am entirely convinced at this point that Dan has worked/works in the Mavs Front Office and has insider info.

[ClutchDirk]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2935...1-deadline

[SleepingHero]

You could do something like https://tradenba.com/trades/P8oV7m6HU which brings back Love and Larry Nance. The trade would be fairly uneven but might assume Drummond is already bought out which frees up one spot on the Cavs roster. They could find some other filler.

I don't think the Mavs would do both Love and Nance but just a thought.

I'll say it a million times, Boban's value as a chemistry guy is worth its weight in gold. We need a guy like that in a locker room. 

Would much rather add Burke than Boban.

[SamStetz]

https://twitter.com/TheSteinLine/status/...97188?s=20

[chaparral]

https://tradenba.com/trades/VsL42ia24

This fails but would work with some filler. I hadn't thought ab a Love for Wiggins move. So KP goes to GS, Wiseman and Love go to Dallas and Wiggins goes to Cleveland. Not sure if Cleveland has any interest in Wiggins, they might rather just get cap savings that Powell + Johnson would give them. If GS gets KP and dumps Wiggins they are making out like bandits. They would need to give up some filler as well to make the math work. They would lose some talent in Wiggins but they might rather try to hold onto Oubre who is a cheaper SF.

I don't like a Love deal that doesn't include Powell's money getting dumped so that would be a requirement for me.

This trade would be successful and move Powell to GS - https://tradenba.com/trades/eoBFGtF8I.

Maybe CLV gets the MIN pick for taking on Wiggins.

[SleepingHero]

I don't like a Love deal that doesn't include Powell's money getting dumped so that would be a requirement for me.

It's creative for sure to workout a 3-team deal between GSW/CLE/DAL where KP goes to GSW and the Mavs get Love/Wiseman/whatever else is necessary.

But my main hangup is the fact we're basically trading out a 25 year old version of a stretch big thats oft injured for a 32 year old version of a stretch big thats oft injured.

Sure we get Wiseman, which is a good get don't get me wrong, but he isn't going to help the Mavs win now at all. And there is a realistic chance that Wiseman never develops past what he is now. 

It's risky, and a lateral move imo.

[Kammrath]

I am entirely convinced at this point that Dan has worked/works in the Mavs Front Office and has insider info.

It wouldn't surprise me one lick if he has some sort of inside connections....

[chaparral]

I am entirely convinced at this point that Dan has worked/works in the Mavs Front Office and has insider info.

If so, Mark and Donnie should listen to him... We would have a better team.

[dirkfansince1998]

Talking about bigman. I am coming back to Lukas draft class.

Bamba: Not even the backup big in Orlando.
WCJ: Bulls not happy with his performance.
Bagley: Always injured and a net negative when he is on the floor. Locker room cancer?

All three have been mentioned in trade rumors. All three should be on the Mavs radar. Not to mention that all three are playing on teams that also have some interesting vets.


Fournier/Bamba
Young/WCJ
Bagley/Hield (Bjelica, Barnes)

[chaparral]

It wouldn't surprise me one lick if he has some sort of inside connections....

Kamm, if I owned the team you'd be in charge of the draft.

[Kammrath]

Kamm, if I owned the team you'd be in charge of the draft.

Ha! Well I would need to put a LOT more time involved to be any good at it, but I would sure enjoy the job!

[ClutchDirk]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2935...ed-for-now

[dirkfansince1998]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2935...ed-for-now

Makes sense. Looking at both sides of the floor he has been the Pels best (or at least 2nd best) player. They would probably prefer to move Redick and Bledsoe.

[cow]

I am entirely convinced at this point that Dan has worked/works in the Mavs Front Office and has insider info.

He works with @"mavsluvr" on the broadcast team.  He also doesn't seem drunk.