2020-2021 ROSTER TALK: Archived

[Kammrath]

But just because he shopped him doesn't mean he's actually motivated at all to trade him.

Sure, it doesn't mean anything is imminent, but it is incredibly newsworthy because I would have said in the bubble that KP was essentially untouchable for the MBT. But now he is not only touchable, THEY are the ones making calls to gauge interest. 

You can make light of this if you want, but I think this is BIG news and affirmation of what many of us assumed must be going on behind closed doors.

[cow]

Sure, it doesn't mean anything is imminent, but it is incredibly newsworthy because I would have said in the bubble that KP was essentially untouchable for the MBT. But now he is not only touchable, THEY are the ones making calls to gauge interest. 

You can make light of this if you want, but I think this is BIG news and affirmation of what many of us assumed must be going on behind closed doors.

Wherever the truth lies, the fact that this is a discussion point is troubling.

[ClutchDirk]

KP out due to back injury that was never mentioned before...trade rumors ensue...

DSJ situation once again...

Beal Lavine Collins would be nice choices of players who may be available now or pretty soon...

[SamStetz]

DSJ situation once again...

First thing I thought of too... I understand the calls to trade him, but I’d rather not lose KP

[ItsGoTime]

I still would love to trade with Chi. WCJ and Lavine for KP, a first, a pick swap and whoever else they want to add in on their side or ours to make the deal happen.

[Omega_Supreme]

Sure, it doesn't mean anything is imminent, but it is incredibly newsworthy because I would have said in the bubble that KP was essentially untouchable for the MBT. But now he is not only touchable, THEY are the ones making calls to gauge interest. 

You can make light of this if you want, but I think this is BIG news and affirmation of what many of us assumed must be going on behind closed doors.

I am with Kammrath on this one...Anytime you hear a superstar rumored to be traded it almost always means there is there, there.....

This is very interesting in deed

[cow]

I still would love to trade with Chi. WCJ and Lavine for KP, a first, a pick swap and whoever else they want to add in on their side or ours to make the deal happen.

That's basically three FRPs for Lavine.  

[ItsGoTime]

First, a pick swap isn’t necessarily a sure thing. In all honesty, I have no idea why they have much value to GMs, but it is a new trend to add value. Second, WCJ has value too. My trade machine trade turned out to be:

KP/JB/JJ/2027 first/2022 swap for OPJ/Lavine/WCJ

Their starting 5: JB/White/Williams/Markannen/KP

Looks pretty good on paper. I would be interested in watching that team.

Ours: Luka/Lavine/JRich/Kleber/WCJ

With lots to choose from off the bench in THJ/DFS/OPJ/Powell/WCS

Keep 1 of Lavine and Luka on the floor all game. Try to keep 2 of Luka, Lavine and JRich on the floor most of the time. Look for a good low minute backup floor general (Rubio?) as soon as possible.

[cow]

I wish Memphis had something interesting to offer.  Not that we could afford to lose him but that seems like a good landing spot for THJ.

[khaled1987]

Isn't the motto for the Mavs Front Office is "If you heard about it in the press it's 100% not true/Didn't come from the Mavs?"

That is what MBT they want us to believe,  and I honestly think it is total bs.Mavs don't exist in vaccum, there is other teams they discuss with, agents, players etc whom all can leak stuff.
Same thing was said when we had workouts with Halliburton,  people said it means 100% there is another target, then other teams leaks that we had tried to get him aggressively after the draft, he was our target all along.
The only way for them to not leak news, is to stop talking to anyone.


That said, bleacher report is unreliable source tbh

[Kammrath]

bleacher report is unreliable source

Jake Fischer (who wrote this) is legit though. Even Marc Stein follows him on Twitter.

[Mavs2021]

That's basically three FRPs for Lavine.  

Pretty sure the Bulls would say no.

[Hypermav]

Mavs first choice is to pair a big with him per the article.   So if you believe the article, then Drummond is the target.

"For now, Dallas appears first interested in adding a center to help supplement Porzingis, sources said. The Mavericks have circled Andre Drummond as the Cleveland Cavaliers look to move in a different frontcourt direction of their own, but Dallas has expressed no interest in parting with Porzingis in those particular talks. "They want a big to pair with him," one league source said. "Obviously with physicality, rebounding, toughness."

If the writer knows that the Mavs have circled Drummond, might the source be from the Cavs?

[Hypermav]

Rick Carlisle said he doesn't see a big man/rebounder as a pressing trade-deadline pursuit, but "You know Mark and Donnie. These guys are gunslingers. They're riverboat gamblers, and they're ready to talk about anything that would get the team better."

So Carlisle was the source.

 Luka is now available...

Knicks and Hawks fans gleefully throwing "we won the trade parties".

[ClutchDirk]

https://twitter.com/BleacherReport/statu...3362176000

[DanSchwartzgan]

Mavs first choice is to pair a big with him per the article.   So if you believe the article, then Drummond is the target.

"For now, Dallas appears first interested in adding a center to help supplement Porzingis, sources said. The Mavericks have circled Andre Drummond as the Cleveland Cavaliers look to move in a different frontcourt direction of their own, but Dallas has expressed no interest in parting with Porzingis in those particular talks. "They want a big to pair with him," one league source said. "Obviously with physicality, rebounding, toughness."

If the writer knows that the Mavs have circled Drummond, might the source be from the Cavs?

I think the key right now (ASSUMING there is some smoke around trading KP at some point) is figuring out the best possible timing.

1.  It could be that a trade right now is a total panic "sell low" scenario.
2.  It could be they fear things get worse and sell-later means selling even lower.

If they trade to get someone like Drummond in the lineup, it MIGHT be #1 above and they are kicking the can down the road on KP.  It will be easier to trade him this summer (especially if he shows better health between now and then).  In fact, the KP whispers might be gauging what the summer market might be like.

I think the trade market for KP right now would be disappointing.  You won't get LaVine out of Chicago.  I can't see the Bulls wanting to pair KP and Markkanen, so you probably won't get WCJ either.  You might get Markkanen with Porter for filler and maybe a top X protected pick this summer?   The article mentions Charlotte.  Yuck.  The prize there would be Rozier? along with expiring Zeller?  What else?  Maybe Toronto based around Lowry?  Atlanta is throwing money around aggressively.  Maybe Collins and Bogdonovic and Snell for KP and some additional salary.

[HanspardShowerVoice]

I keep thinking a Vucevic for KP straight up swap makes sense for both franchises.    Mavs get off KP's contract without sacrificing much firepower at the position.  Vuc slots in easily into KPs role, without having to shakeup the entire existing roster makeup.   Orlando is still in perpetual rebuild mode, probably need to go into full tank the rest of the year.  A 25 year old KP makes more sense for their window than a 30 year old Vuc, and they've apparently given up on Mo Bamba as their big of the future.   And they could always use marquee name players to attract fans to the arena while they are (still) rebuilding.   They take a flier on KP the way they did with Fultz, and big contracts aren't really a deterrent for them because they're not going to attract free agents there in the next few years anyway.

[omahen]

I think the key right now (ASSUMING there is some smoke around trading KP at some point) is figuring out the best possible timing.

1.  It could be that a trade right now is a total panic "sell low" scenario.
2.  It could be they fear things get worse and sell-later means selling even lower.

If they trade to get someone like Drummond in the lineup, it MIGHT be #1 above and they are kicking the can down the road on KP.  It will be easier to trade him this summer (especially if he shows better health between now and then).  In fact, the KP whispers might be gauging what the summer market might be like.

I think the trade market for KP right now would be disappointing.  You won't get LaVine out of Chicago.  I can't see the Bulls wanting to pair KP and Markkanen, so you probably won't get WCJ either.  You might get Markkanen with Porter for filler and maybe a top X protected pick this summer?   The article mentions Charlotte.  Yuck.  The prize there would be Rozier? along with expiring Zeller?  What else?  Maybe Toronto based around Lowry?  Atlanta is throwing money around aggressively.  Maybe Collins and Bogdonovic and Snell for KP and some additional salary.

I don't understand why you stated only those two options. Assuming the news is correct, it is very likely just what the news said - that Mavs are not so quietly anymore gauging his market. We are only assuming they weren't doing this even before. In any case, I think it is their job to gauge the market and they do it all the time. It doesn't mean they will really make a move.

KP of course gives a ton of options. I don't think his value is that low. It is not so long ago he was posting up 30 ppg while playing good defense. ASSUMING, his value is not that low, I would not look for lateral move. KP for Collins is lateral move imho, even if you add Bogi. Even KP for LaVine is a lateral move. Just trading one flawed borderline star for another. It doesn't really make Mavs better. As KP, Collins is also sort of a unicorn. Undersized center who is elite in PnR and can also hit a three with a decent percentage, but is a liability on defense as he is neither a good rim protector or good perimeter defender. I am really having trouble to determine what kind of player would look best as Collins partner in the frontcourt. 

If I am trading KP, I would be looking for a three team trade that would really improve Mavs. I think our guard/wing rotation is good, actually. There also aren't enough minutes to add a piece without taking someone away. That's why only an elite wing would convince me to break Brunson/JRich/THJ/DFS rotation. What I would be looking to improve would be C and PF. Mavs are able to eat some bad salary, Mavs are able to add some picks and young players. I actually think KP would be great for Atlanta, but as I said, Collins is not enough for me, so I am looking at three team trades. I think these are possible candidates if center is a target: Chicago, Cleveland, Sacramento. For example:

Dal: Collins, WCJ (I am not really sure about the fit), Snell
Atl: KP
Chi: Reddish or Huerter (or draft compensation), Green (or draft assets), Rondo

Dal: Collins, Drummond (yikes, I really don't like him, but what the hell)
Atl: KP
Cle: Snell, Rondo, draft compensation from Atlanta

Dal: Collins, Holmes, Snell, Rondo (huh, we would need to cut/trade 3 more guys)
Atl: KP
Sacramento: Bobi, Iwundu (or Burke), draft compensation from Atlanta

Or lets go for a guard version:

Dal: Collins, Lowry, Rondo (didn't check with trade machine but I would think salaries work)
Atl: KP
Tor: Snell, Johnson (or THJ?), draft compensation from Atl and Dal

Many more possibilities for a bunch of different three team options or even expanded to more. Any case, I think KP trade should be complicated to make us better

[Jason Terry]

KP-Vucevic is about the only thing that makes sense for both sides. Markkanen and OPj also could make sense for both sides

My take is that either we get something like that NOW, or he’s likely moved this summer. You let it all become very public(maybe even tell KP “we’re sitting you because trade talks”). You do this so if it doesn’t happen it creates a major chip on his shoulder. Then we see what he’s made of. The rest of the season we get full effort from him. If everything goes perfect we could still keep him. More likely is we get decent effort and it’s still not good enough. Maybe he improves his trade value some. Move on this summer blaming it on fit. Assuming he isn’t moved now, Johnson’s contract needs to bring in a center. That way if KP pulls a Rondo and quits on the team we can still be competitive in a playoff series

[ItsGoTime]

You won't get LaVine out of Chicago.

Maybe Collins and Bogdonovic and Snell for KP and some additional salary.

In my mind, Collins and Lavine are on the same level value-wise. WCJ has been rumored to be being shopped by Chi too. They need a floor general like JB to start for them and KP is 25, young enough to still be worthy of building around. Maybe it takes more than JB and KP to make them bite, I thought the OPJ for JJ swap and adding a pick and pick swap made up the difference. 


Another thought I had was figuring out a NY trade that lifts the 23 pick protection. Something like Ntilikina so a 3 team trade with Felicio to NY, Ntilikina to Dal and Dal lifting the protection. That way the Mavs can trade the 25 instead of the 27 first. The full trade would be:

KP/JB/25 first/22 swap to Chi
Lavine/WCJ/Ntilikina to Dal
Felicio/23 first unprotected to NY

Luka/Ntilikina/Burke
JRich/THJ/Green
Lavine/DFS/Iwundu
Kleber/Powell/JJ
WCJ/WCS/Boban

We could then figure out a trade to get something for JJ.