MAVS NEWS:

[Chicagojk]

Just imagine Luka coming back to the Mavs.  I know it is very, very, very unlikely.   With the exception of MJ returning from baseball, Lebron retuning from Clevelend, Luka may be the most anticipated return ever.   Maybe Magic returning?

That first game would be a circus atmosphere.   Heck, wouldn't it be a hoot to break out the "fire Nico" chants when the other team was shooting free throws?

hmmm that is interesting...look at AD and Kyrie contract end....hmmm

[F Gump]

Actually, I'll push back even more, because while you're interpreting this as an extension of my negative feelings about Kidd (you're right, to an extent) there's another side of the point I was making, and one that I'd think you agree with, given past conversations:

Don't you think the GM should be in charge of the coach, and not the other way around? That's kind of the danger I was alluding to in the post you quoted. If we're going to put an expert in charge of building the team, someone who can/will ultimately be judged on the merits of how he does it and if needed, be held accountable (something you and I have agreed on for years), then shouldn't that guy be able to have some say in whether or not the coach understands how that team is meant to be played? I mean, it's all a collaboration, obviously, but on the accountability scale, I believe the coach should not be more powerful than the GM. That's what I'm saying. You disagree?

The coach is lower in the pecking order than the GM. GMs hire and fire coaches. Isn't that in the very same alignment as what I was saying?

[FireNicoHarrison]

The coach is lower in the pecking order than the GM. GMs hire and fire coaches. Isn't that in the very same alignment as what I was saying?

Agree, GMs are waaaaay more important than coaches... So i hope Dumont will hire Lindsey or someone else very good.

[F Gump]

Hard disagree on this one.  

Given the reports that he was "in alignment" with the Luka trade, that is already reason to let him go.

I dont buy that at all. 

Nico never said he consulted Kidd or asked his opinion. In fact, he said the opposite. 

Kidd afaik has NEVER said one public word to evaluate the trade either way. 

He was forced to answer questions in the hastily drawn PC right after the trade, in which Nico made a short statement and then ran, leaving it to Kidd. Hot potato. Run and hide by Nico, which was his style all the way through.  

Nico explicitly said he did NOT consult Kidd, but he was sure it would fit or aligns with what Kidd likes. 

In the PC Kidd did not say anything to support the trade, but said its his job to coach the players. My distinct impression was that Kidd had been told right at the last minute, with no ability to weigh in or object and was basically blindsided by the trade. I think he was put in a bad position, and it was his JOB to support the company actions rather than throw them under the bus. 

I think there are lots of media assumptions that a GM would NEVER make such a big decision and negotiate it all on his own. So they write about how it must have happened with lots of others involved. But I think we have plenty of evidence that Nico did exactly that, basically on his own with his own agenda, except for him letting his boss know of (and sign off on) his bold plan to alter and 'save' the team from Luka.

[FireNicoHarrison]

I don't think that a coach like Kidd, with his presence and influence, would have continued his job if he had not agreed to trade Doncic.

He wanted AD because Lakers days, just like McGee years ago.

[mvossman]

I dont buy that at all. 

Nico never said he consulted Kidd or asked his opinion. In fact, he said the opposite. 

Kidd afaik has NEVER said one public word to evaluate the trade either way. 

He was forced to answer questions in the hastily drawn PC right after the trade, in which Nico made a short statement and then ran, leaving it to Kidd. Hot potato. Run and hide by Nico, which was his style all the way through.  

Nico said he did NOTtconsult Kidd, but he was sure it would fit what Kidd likes. 

In the PC Kidd did not say anything to support the trade, but said its his job to coach the players. My distinct impression was that Kidd had been told right at the last minute, with no ability to weigh in or object and was basically blindsided by the trade. I think he was put in a bad position, and it was his JOB to support the company actions rather than throw them under the bus. 

I think there are lots of assumptions that a GM would NEVER make such a big decision and negotiate it all on his own. But I think we have plenty of evidence that Nico did exactly that, except for him letting his boss know of (and sign iff on) his bold plan to alter and 'save' the team from Luka.

No offense, but I am not taking anything Nico said as gospel.  And Kidd has been smart enough to distance himself as much as possible.  I don't know how good Shams sources are (it could be disgruntled employees that don't really know Kidd's involvement) but in my mind anybody high up in that organization (including Kidd) is suspect.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

I don't follow any NBA talking heads/personalities but I watched this video and found myself agreeing with pretty much everything this guy said. It's Slightly Biased.

What I would do if I were Mavs GM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSoGAplAm6g

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

Sorry it's annoying you. I don't feel like it's anywhere remotely close to impacting every post I make, but I'll keep an eye on that.

Dude you don't need to apologize to anyone.

There are two prominent posters on this forum (FGump and DanS) who were convinced this was a contending team, this team didn't need any guards, yadda yadda yadda.  Now they are being salty because they had no idea what they were talking about.  Notice they are the only two floating the idea this is an intentional tank.  Hilarious.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

You can tell from Luka's reaction to Kidd when he made his return whether Kidd was involved or not. It's not that difficult to figure out.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

[Run It Back] John Wall reveals that he’s heard Anthony Davis wants to go to his hometown— Chicago: “You been hearing he wants to go back to Chicago and see what's going on.”

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1o...hes_heard/

[FireNicoHarrison]

Dude you don't need to apologize to anyone.

There are two prominent posters on this forum (FGump and DanS) who were convinced this was a contending team, this team didn't need any guards, yadda yadda yadda.  Now they are being salty because they had no idea what they were talking about.  Notice they are the only two floating the idea this is an intentional tank.  Hilarious.  

You have been 1/10th as annoying as FGump was all summer telling us how stupid we were.  I get you are trying to keep the peace but he doesn't deserve an apology.

True... But we are the pessimistic and toxic users. Funny.

[FireNicoHarrison]

[Run It Back] John Wall reveals that he’s heard Anthony Davis wants to go to his hometown— Chicago: “You been hearing he wants to go back to Chicago and see what's going on.”

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1o...hes_heard/

White, Buzelis and 3 FRPs.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

I'd take White and 2 firsts.

They have both their own and Portland's 1st in next years loaded draft.

[F Gump]

Dude you don't need to apologize to anyone. 

There are two prominent posters on this forum (FGump and DanS) who were convinced this was a contending team, this team didn't need any guards, yadda yadda yadda.  Now they are being salty because they had no idea what they were talking about.  Notice they are the only two floating the idea this is an intentional tank.  Hilarious.

Yes I thought the Mavs could get past the early-season until Kyrie made it back. However...

1 I never said the Mavs didnt need guards. Good grief. In the early summer, both Exum and BWill were in that guard mix we were looking at. And DAR. And Kyrie to be added at some point. And maybe CF gets minutes to create offense. 

2 But when the season began, the ONLY possible guys to run the offense were DAR and CF. That's a huge downgrade layered on top of the loss of Kyrie. 

3 We didn't know those guys would be out of the mix -- but the Mavs did! Right? And they chose that course anyhow? Why? 

4 When considering all that, I am certainly less optimistic about the season. Duh. If you think I should have known they would have 2 more guards unavailable and factored that into my thinking, well, maybe you should be talking to Nostradamus. 

5 But it also makes me wonder what the Mavs were thinking -- why did they construct a talent-filled roster with no one to run the offense? 

6 As for where we are NOW ... My idea of tanking isn't at all how you choose to portray it. My oft-stated thought is that MAYBE they have decided to tank already -- and if so, there are lots of points at which they may have done so. 

Or maybe they are still in a wait and see stage. 

The best tank is one where no one knows. Lots of bad luck (unfortunate injuries, close losses) piled on top of each other. 

But imo they NEED to tank from here, regardless of how they got here.

[KillerLeft]

The coach is lower in the pecking order than the GM. GMs hire and fire coaches. Isn't that in the very same alignment as what I was saying?

Yes. 

Here's the quote from the NY TIMES that I was talking about:

"Last summer, Kidd contemplated leaving the Mavericks to go coach the New York Knicks. There was mutual interest between the two sides, league sources said, but the Mavericks refused to let Kidd leave and rewarded him with an extension. That gave Kidd power in any disagreement with his front office. He had more years on his contract than any of them."

Do you not see my point? I do not think any GM should be beholden to any coach. Maybe your point is that he wouldn't be, regardless of the current power dynamic, and hopefully you're right. Hopefully, the new guy has an even longer contract, makes even more money and the position comes with the requisite amount of leeway and respect needed for the guy to have a chance. But, having followed the Dallas Mavericks for decades, it sure doesn't seem like they've ever had things set up that way. My point (in the post you really hated, for some reason) was just that I hope these toxic political shenanigans aren't inherited by the new guy, and I'm sorry, but the possibility that they will be seems real enough for me to comment. 

Do I ALSO just generally not think Kidd is a good coach? Hell yes, but that wasn't the point of the one you raked me over the coals about. Again, I apologize - not here to offend anyone. I actually thought it was a talking point worth offering. 

[Dirknows]

I don't follow any NBA talking heads/personalities but I watched this video and found myself agreeing with pretty much everything this guy said.  It's Slightly Biased.

What I would do if I were Mavs GM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSoGAplAm6g

Not watching that video can I get a TLDR on it?

[michaeltex]

Does it make sense to fire sale anyone not named Flagg with value? I seem to remember OKC taking that approach and netting the massive pile of picks they are still working through.

[mvossman]

Not watching that video can I get a TLDR on it?

It was quite good.  Brief synopsis:

He was pretending he was new GM and what he would do:

Have a conversation with Kyrie about what he wants to do and act accordingly.  If he wants to stay, then keep him.

Have similar conversation with AD letting him know we are not doing an extension (or at least not max extension).

Trade Klay ASAP.

Prefer to hold onto guys like Max, PJ and Lively but move them if blown away by offer.

Talk to Charlotte about getting our 27 back (or at least improving protections) especially if sending Kyrie and AD out.  Maybe Naji?

It has some quality humor mixed in as well.

[KillerLeft]

You can tell from Luka's reaction to Kidd when he made his return whether Kidd was involved or not.  It's not that difficult to figure out.

People are free to believe what they want, but I've always assumed Kidd was involved in the decision, at least on a "I'm so sick of this guy's act" peripheral level (which, as I've said 1,000 times, I can understand, especially at the time). Most of the things that have come out over the past 48 hours have further cemented my opinion on that, honestly. 

I heard a guy talk recently about a conversation he had with someone in the Mavs organization (not Harrison) that referenced how Kobe reacted to losing one finals as well as how Lebron reacted to losing to the Mavs in 2011. One example given was how Kobe used the song that played when the confetti dropped for the other team every day for a year as his workout music - he wanted to do anything he could to remember that feeling and be motivated by it. In contrast, the source told this guy that Luka showed up the year after losing to BOS in the same shape he always did, arguably worse, and "that's when WE started to feel like maybe this wasn't going to work with this guy."

Now, to be clear, Luka is a psychotically competitive individual, so I think that was a premature judgement (though kind of defendable at the time), but my point is that it sure doesn't seem to me like Nico Harrison (or even just Harrison and Dumont) went completely rogue on this one. It seems like a fair amount of the Mavs Brain Trust (which I'd bet any amount of money included Kidd) was kind of questioning Luka's future here.

This is all covered ground at this point and the last thing I want to do is hash it all out again, but...idk, if we think everyone who was in favor of that trade is gone, I'm pretty sure they're not, and they're probably not gonna be for a while. Harrison being fired this early is more closure than I expected, frankly, and more than enough for me. The organization is already admitting that the trade was a total fiasco and mistake, in more ways than one. 

None of that has anything to do with my desire to see Kidd go. I just want a coach who can design an offense, a defense and maybe draw up some creative ATO's every now and again. I don't think that's too much to ask.

[KillerLeft]

Does it make sense to fire sale anyone not named Flagg with value? I seem to remember OKC taking that approach and netting the massive pile of picks they are still working through.

Probably not, because no matter how many picks you get back for each sold player, the most important picks in any scenario like that are your own, and the Mavs don't control those.