GAME 5 NBA FINALS: DALLAS MAVERICKS (1-4) vs BOSTON CELTICS (4-1)

[MarkAguirreWrathofGod]

Why do we still have starters out there?

[Scott41theMavs]

Two things:
1) You will never convince me that, if you could scientifically and accurately quantify the talent level of every player on the Mavs and Celtics, that the Mavs wouldn't come out on top. Call me stupid and/or a homer. I'll die on that hill. The Mavs choked.
2) SH is just wrong to nitpick the bench as the cause of death in this series. It was Kai, especially in Boston, and then Luka. Look at their freaking shooting numbers in this series. Boston's defense isn't that good. Love these two guys and the ride to the Finals they gave us, but they both flat quit like Mark Aguirre in the Finals, period.

[ThisIStheYear]

Lets not pretend that Tatum had any significant role in this series. Luka outplayed him literally every game. Brown, Holiday, Porzingis, Horford, and White all were WAY more integral and won Boston the games. Tatum was whatever. 

Put Luka around that level of talent and that team has an argument of going 74-8 or better.

Tatum dominated Luka tonight.  That’s what will be remembered going into next season. Luka has some work to do. I hope he gets there. I believe in him. But you’re not a great player until you win a title.

[MarkAguirreWrathofGod]

I’m Tatum desperately trying to pad his stats.

[SleepingHero]

Tatum dominated Luka tonight.  That’s what will be remembered going into next season. Luka has some work to do. I hope he gets there. I believe in him. But you’re not a great player until you win a title.

That is such a bullshit argument.

John Stockton, Steve Nash, Barkley, Malone, and all the greats that didn't win a ring weren't great players? By your definition, Dirk wasn't a great player until 2011! That's loony.

Luka is already at that level of great. He WILL win. And I think it's going to happen (as always with Luka) sooner than we think.

[SleepingHero]

Did y'all see that OMax defense right there???

I'm so excited for that dude next season.

[Chicagojk]

Big summer for OmAx. Need to make it where team can’t keep him out of the rotation. Don’t think it happens to start the season. He can make an early impression this summer though

[dirkfansince1998]

Two things:
1) You will never convince me that, if you could scientifically and accurately quantify the talent level of every player on the Mavs and Celtics, that the Mavs wouldn't come out on top. Call me stupid and/or a homer. I'll die on that hill. The Mavs choked.
2) SH is just wrong to nitpick the bench as the cause of death in this series. It was Kai, especially in Boston, and then Luka. Look at their freaking shooting numbers in this series. Boston's defense isn't that good. Love these two guys and the ride to the Finals they gave us, but they both flat quit like Mark Aguirre in the Finals, period.

1) You are a stupid homer
2) The problem isn't the bench. It is about starting spots 3-5. Celtics have 4-5 allstar caliber guys. Mavs have solid rotation players with limitations. Lacking two-way impact.

[Mavs2021]

Keep cherry picking the only 2 stats that Luka is underperforming in. 

Ignore the PPG/RPG/APG/SPG/ +/-  On/Off

Such a weird battle to choose.

Oh and Tatum is shooting 37% from the field and 29% from 3. How is that any better than Luka?

You said he was literally better in every game, which is simply a lie. Tatum was better in games 3 and 5. He has more assists, less turnovers, more blocks and they are virtually even in rebounding for the series. There is no discussion about who the better player is, but Luka has still been awful the whole series, especially defensively.

[BolsDamols]

Tatum had 2 good games, Games 3 and this one.

He's had his moments but he was in no way dominant in this series. Celtics had a much better team, with everyone contributing. Heck even KP won Game 1 for them. 

Holiday and White were the perfect tandem. Al Horford and Sam Hauser had their moments too.

Such a shame that Kyrie, who we thought could have been 2nd or at worst 3rd best player in this series, shit the bed in Boston.

Luka had his bad moments in defense, and has played well below his standards in some games (this one included) but I think he still clearly showed that he is the best player in this series overall, fwiw.

[Chicagojk]

It would be huge if PJ could go from a 32/33 three point shooter to a 37/38 three point shooter in our offense. If so, there wouldn’t be many better non star two way players. He is streaky though. If he can decamp that than we just need that one more really good wing.

[SwisherPrice]

Hopefully this sets up a Nuggets/Celtics matchup in 2025. Mavs (Kyrie) can't beat the Celtics so no point in making it back that far next year when they still won't have a good enough roster to compete. Anyone else in the West except Denver will be a mismatch vs. Boston

See you in 2026!

[SleepingHero]

Two things:
1) You will never convince me that, if you could scientifically and accurately quantify the talent level of every player on the Mavs and Celtics, that the Mavs wouldn't come out on top. Call me stupid and/or a homer. I'll die on that hill. The Mavs choked.
2) SH is just wrong to nitpick the bench as the cause of death in this series. It was Kai, especially in Boston, and then Luka. Look at their freaking shooting numbers in this series. Boston's defense isn't that good. Love these two guys and the ride to the Finals they gave us, but they both flat quit like Mark Aguirre in the Finals, period.

To point 2)

I primarily said the Mavs were missing one 2-way starter level wing away from being favored. On top of that the bench was a huge letdown. 

Kyrie had a bad series. Luka had a below average series. But if literally anyone else stepped up the Mavs could've overcame that imo. Game 2 especially.

Also wasn't trying to nitpick. More so trying to figure out the best next move to get the Mavs over the hump next season.

[Berknip]

Brown with MVP. Not Tatum.

[SleepingHero]

Brown with MVP. Not Tatum.

And well deserved.

Jrue a close 2nd. White practically tied with Jrue. Then KP. Then maybe Tatum or Horford.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

I am out.  Really fun season.

Sucks to get this close and not win it.  Plus you lose to the most entitled, obnoxious fans in the league.  That sucks.

Nico has his work cut out for him still.  May not happen this summer.  Keep the internal development going.  They need that final move.  The tricky part is 7 teams in the west think they are a move a way

That is the truth. The West is brutal. Plenty of other young teams on the comeup. And they all could be a move or two away from being in the same position as Dallas was.

[BolsDamols]

Still, a great season.

I was just happy with getting past LAC and getting that monkey off our backs. Given that Mavs had a major midseason trade and did not really have a proper training camp, I was expecting modest success in the playoffs.

Lots of teams in the West will improve next season, but so will the Mavs. A proper training camp will do wonders for guys like PJ and Gafford. Lively will improve even further in year 2, and guys like Hardy, Exum and Green would have had tremendous experience from these playoffs which hopefully will carry over next season.

Getting rid of THJ to be able to resign DJJ will be top priority in the offseason. Hardy I think will be ready to step into THJ role.

I hope this Finals loss lights a fire under Luka - in fairness to him he did come in great shape to start the season. But we need him to be in amazing shape from beginning to end (not gain weight during the season). Giving up alcohol and drinking during the season imo is a must.

[SleepingHero]

Don't get me wrong I'm depressed as hell. But this team is young. Kyrie showed he could be a reliable 2nd option up until the finals. Luka is the guy. We're basically 1 DJJ upgrade away and a guy who can score on the bench to being a really really really scary team.

And also if Lively can come back next season with a 3pt ball we're fucking terrifying

[Scott41theMavs]

I hope this Finals loss lights a fire under Luka - in fairness to him he did come in great shape to start the season. But we need him to be in amazing shape from beginning to end (not gain weight during the season). Giving up alcohol and drinking during the season imo is a must.

I think there's zero chance that happens without 12 steps, and zero chance he gets to 12 steps unless someone he cares about convinces him 100% that his life has become unmanageable.

[Scott41theMavs]

Brown with MVP. Not Tatum.

Kyrie was robbed.