Trade & FA 2023-24: 76ers Believe They Have A Shot at PG13

[mvossman]

Let's agree to disagree. Timmy over Norm Powell, on a team that has Luka + Kyrie? You're having a laugh. If you actually believe this, I don't really know how to respond to that, and so I will pass. Heck, I would also De'Anthony Melton, over THJ, (for Melton's ability to play tenacious defense on the opposing team's best guard).

Yes, we will agree to disagree.  I don't think Norman is considered a wildly better player than Timmy in general, and certainly not by the advanced stats.  If Timmy was gone, I would have no interest in trying to acquire Norman.

I'm not sure why you are bringing up Melton?  I would greatly prefer him over either of the other two.  A high level point of attack defender than can shoot and has a decent all around offensive game is basically what I hope Green turns into (it will be interesting to see what he gets in free agency next year).

[RGP1981]

Yes, we will agree to disagree.  I don't think Norman is considered a wildly better player than Timmy in general, and certainly not by the advanced stats.  If Timmy was gone, I would have no interest in trying to acquire Norman.

I'm not sure why you are bringing up Melton?  I would greatly prefer him over either of the other two.  A high level point of attack defender than can shoot and has a decent all around offensive game is basically what I hope Green turns into (it will be interesting to see what he gets in free agency next year).

Powell is closer to Melton than Timmy is. I'm not saying he is a "wildly better" player than THJ but he is a better fit at SG for what this roster needs. He is a better defender, better play-maker, better at driving to and finishing at the rim, better at fast breaks... all while shooting just as well from three (if not better). Both Powell and Melton are basically what you hope Josh Green will become.

Also, the way you have worded this bit, i.e.,... "I would have no interest in trying to acquire Norman."

You're saying that as if the Mavs already have better on the roster at SG, or have their pick and choice of the best of the best in the league, lol.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Powell is closer to Melton than Timmy is. I'm not saying he is a "wildly better" player than THJ but he is a better fit at SG for what this roster needs. He is a better defender, better play-maker, better at driving to and finishing at the rim, better at fast breaks... all while shooting just as well from three (if not better). Both Powell and Melton are basically what you hope Josh Green will become.

Also, the way you have worded this bit, i.e.,... "I would have no interest in trying to acquire Norman."

You're saying that as if the Mavs already have better on the roster at SG, or have their pick and choice of the best of the best in the league, lol.

Ya, not quite sure why there is an argument about THJ vs Norm.  This board GREATLY overvalues THJ.

[mvossman]

Powell is closer to Melton than Timmy is. I'm not saying he is a "wildly better" player than THJ but he is a better fit at SG for what this roster needs. He is a better defender, better play-maker, better at driving to and finishing at the rim, better at fast breaks... all while shooting just as well from three (if not better). Both Powell and Melton are basically what you hope Josh Green will become.

Also, the way you have worded this bit, i.e.,... "I would have no interest in trying to acquire Norman."

You're saying that as if the Mavs already have better on the roster at SG, or have their pick and choice of the best of the best in the league, lol.

I'm saying that from the standpoint I don't think it makes sense for the Mavs to spend 20 mil a year on another offense only guard.  I think where we really differ is on Norman's defense.  I can't find anything that suggests he is a plus defender.  He is nowhere near a Melton.  If he were, I would on board with where you are going.  He is a better all around offensive player than Timmy (although there is no evidence of him being a playmaker) but not enough in my mind to make him somebody I would want to acquire at 20 mil a year for the next 3 years.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

I'm saying that from the standpoint I don't think it makes sense for the Mavs to spend 20 mil a year on another offense only guard.  I think where we really differ is on Norman's defense.  I can't find anything that suggests he is a plus defender.  He is nowhere near a Melton.  If he were, I would on board with where you are going.  He is a better all around offensive player than Timmy (although there is no evidence of him being a playmaker) but not enough in my mind to make him somebody I would want to acquire at 20 mil a year for the next 3 years.

Ya, a better THJ should NOT be a priority with Green, Hardy, Curry, and Exum on the roster.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

My irrational exuberance of Lively and OMax starting yesterday dissipated. I love what I see in what they *can be, but they are both RAW. Lively won't average double-digit minutes due to foul trouble alone. OMax has to have some sort of offensive game. Again, I love what I see, but I don't think we can rely on their playing big minutes this year.

That said, I'd love to look for a starting caliber OMax (flex PF/SF who can guard SG-PF) and a starting caliber Lively (ideally a F-C who can play either). Both in 2 years would either need to have non-depreciating value, expiring, or flexible enough to backup 2 positions.

Some Ideas:
OMax -- Eason, D.Hunter, T.Harris, B.Simmons, G.Hayward
Lively -- J.Allen, Zubac, RW3, Z.Collins, M.Wagner, Hartenstein

[ThisIStheYear]

With the Dame trade Giannis has indicated he’ll extend with Milwaukee. I wonder if the loss of that pipe dream changes how Nico proceeds?

[Jym]

With the Dame trade Giannis has indicated he’ll extend with Milwaukee. I wonder if the loss of that pipe dream changes how Nico proceeds?

Embiid always seemed like the more likely option anyway

[MFFL]

Is it worth our 2027 first round pick to get Zubac? The Clippers are still trying to land Harden and they need first round picks to appease the 76ers. I think they would go for the downgrade from Zubac to Holmes if we gave them a first rounder to flip to the 76ers.

Would that be a trade we are interested in?

[omahen]

Is it worth our 2027 first round pick to get Zubac? The Clippers are still trying to land Harden and they need first round picks to appease the 76ers. I think they would go for the downgrade from Zubac to Holmes if we gave them a first rounder to flip to the 76ers.

Would that be a trade we are interested in?

Zubac is a good player but not worth an unprotected FRP. In any case, the word is, Clippers are trying to exchange pick swaps for FRP.

[DanSchwartzgan]

Is it worth our 2027 first round pick to get Zubac? The Clippers are still trying to land Harden and they need first round picks to appease the 76ers. I think they would go for the downgrade from Zubac to Holmes if we gave them a first rounder to flip to the 76ers.

Would that be a trade we are interested in?

It all depends on the protection.  I believe part of why Dallas got that 2028 second is so that the 2027 can convert to a nearby second if it isn’t conveyed.  I don’t believe Holmes for Zubac meets the 110% trade rule for the Clippers, so it would need to be part of a bigger trade where they do meet that rule.

I’ll point out again that Dallas is under the LT by enough (barely) to work a THJ for Capela deal and still be under the tax.  I’m not a fan of the team carrying four centers, but if we need one, I suspect thats still the one they go and get.  They have not been afraid to do a TDL transaction under this regime.

[ItsGoTime]

So, the team doesn’t need to carry 4 centers. I doubt that with Bogdan on the Hawks they would want THJ. In that case, salaries work very well where they bring in THJ, Holmes and Maxi (they would want a good backup C with Capela gone anyway) with outgoing Capela and Bogdan. Issue there is we’re trying to also open up time for the other players that can play the G position, so we don’t want Bog. Send Bog to a third team looking for vet help to straighten out their young guys. That or to a playoff bound team needing that extra push.

Salaries work out very well in a Bog for KPJ and Eason swap. I imagine they want a bit more for their guys, so add a couple seconds. They were wanting vet guys to help wrangle in the young bucks, they also really want off of KPJ and Eason finds himself squeezed out from higher draft picks.

Hawks in: THJ, Kleber and Holmes
Rockets in: Bogdan and 2 SRPs (from Mavs)
Mavs in: Capela, KPJ and Eason

Luka/Kyrie/Green/GWill/Capela
Curry/Hardy/OMax/Eason/Lively
Exum/KPJ/DJJ/Morris/Powell

Balances out the roster quite well other than being far overloaded with so many players whose best position is at PF. That can be figured out in the offseason though.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Is it worth our 2027 first round pick to get Zubac? The Clippers are still trying to land Harden and they need first round picks to appease the 76ers. I think they would go for the downgrade from Zubac to Holmes if we gave them a first rounder to flip to the 76ers.

Would that be a trade we are interested in?

Absolutely.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

It all depends on the protection.  I believe part of why Dallas got that 2028 second is so that the 2027 can convert to a nearby second if it isn’t conveyed.  I don’t believe Holmes for Zubac meets the 110% trade rule for the Clippers, so it would need to be part of a bigger trade where they do meet that rule.

I’ll point out again that Dallas is under the LT by enough (barely) to work a THJ for Capela deal and still be under the tax.  I’m not a fan of the team carrying four centers, but if we need one, I suspect thats still the one they go and get.  They have not been afraid to do a TDL transaction under this regime.

I'm not a Capela fan, but you do that deal if it's only THJ.  I just don't know why ATL would want THJ part deux, especially buried behind Murray, Bogdon, Bey, Hunter, Bufkin, Griffin, and Johnson for minutes at SG/SF.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

So, the team doesn’t need to carry 4 centers. I doubt that with Bogdan on the Hawks they would want THJ. In that case, salaries work very well where they bring in THJ, Holmes and Maxi (they would want a good backup C with Capela gone anyway) with outgoing Capela and Bogdan. Issue there is we’re trying to also open up time for the other players that can play the G position, so we don’t want Bog. Send Bog to a third team looking for vet help to straighten out their young guys. That or to a playoff bound team needing that extra push.

Salaries work out very well in a Bog for KPJ and Eason swap. I imagine they want a bit more for their guys, so add a couple seconds. They were wanting vet guys to help wrangle in the young bucks, they also really want off of KPJ and Eason finds himself squeezed out from higher draft picks.

Hawks in: THJ, Kleber and Holmes
Rockets in: Bogdan and 2 SRPs (from Mavs)
Mavs in: Capela, KPJ and Eason

Luka/Kyrie/Green/GWill/Capela
Curry/Hardy/OMax/Eason/Lively
Exum/KPJ/DJJ/Morris/Powell

Balances out the roster quite well other than being far overloaded with so many players whose best position is at PF. That can be figured out in the offseason though.

I do that deal everyday and twice on Sunday.  You keep KPJ away from the team indefinitely until/if he can be palatable.

I love Maxi, but he's in the final throes of his career.

[ItsGoTime]

I really hope there is a Kyrie trade this season. I hope he plays up to his standards and outperforms that contract. Then I want a bidding war between all the usual suspects. LAL, LAC, Mia, Tor?, Phil?. Would love for Lauri to tell Ainge that he won’t be resigning with Utah and we grt a 3 team deal in there.

To Mia: Kyrie and THJ
To Uta: Herro and Mia 27 FRP, a future pick swap from Mia and Mia’s only remaining 2nd
To Dal: Lowry, Lauri, Fontecchio (needed salary) and Mia 29 FRP

We go into the offseason with roughly $48M minus whatever Green signs (unless we let him go). We let the young guys play mega minutes to see if they will be who we hope them to be. Retain our top 10 pick and let JKidd slip his mouth about tanking again just to twist the knife in NYK. I can fully get behind something like that.

[RGP1981]

I really hope there is a Kyrie trade this season. I hope he plays up to his standards and outperforms that contract. Then I want a bidding war between all the usual suspects. LAL, LAC, Mia, Tor?, Phil?. Would love for Lauri to tell Ainge that he won’t be resigning with Utah and we grt a 3 team deal in there.

To Mia: Kyrie and THJ
To Uta: Herro and Mia 27 FRP, a future pick swap from Mia and Mia’s only remaining 2nd
To Dal: Lowry, Lauri, Fontecchio (needed salary) and Mia 29 FRP

We go into the offseason with roughly $48M minus whatever Green signs (unless we let him go). We let the young guys play mega minutes to see if they will be who we hope them to be. Retain our top 10 pick and let JKidd slip his mouth about tanking again just to twist the knife in NYK. I can fully get behind something like that.

I think LAL have more players who will fit better with Luka and his timeline...

LAL get: Kyrie Irving, Markieff Morris
DAL get: Gabe Vincent, Rui Hachimura, Jared Vanderbilt and Max Christie

Rob Pelinka is a smart GM with an eye for roster building (unlike most Mavs GMs, sans 2010-11), so he would not do this willingly. The hope should be that Lebron forces a move for a 3rd star again.

Then send THJ + Holmes to MIA for Lowry.

Then send Vanderbilt + Seth + protected portion of the 2024 1st rounder (like if the pick is #4-10) to CLE for Jarrett Allen. That 2024 pick should be going to the Knicks after these trades anyway. CLE might be tempted by the thought of pairing a versatile defender like Vando with Mobley to cover for Mitchell and Garland.

01-05: Gabe, Green, Luka, Hachimura, Allen
06-10: Lowry, Christie, G-Will, Kleber, Lively
11-15: Exum, Hardy, DJJ, O-Max, Powell

I think this roster looks real good. Although with THJ and Seth gone, it could use a shooter with good off-ball movement. Perhaps, one of Christie or Hardy can become that.

[Mavs2021]

I think LAL have more players who will fit better with Luka and his timeline...

LAL get: Kyrie Irving, Markieff Morris
DAL get: Gabe Vincent, Rui Hachimura, Jared Vanderbilt and Max Christie

Rob Pelinka is a smart GM with an eye for roster building (unlike most Mavs GMs, sans 2010-11), so he would not do this willingly. The hope should be that Lebron forces a move for a 3rd star again.

Then send THJ + Holmes to MIA for Lowry.

Then send Vanderbilt + Seth + protected portion of the 2024 1st rounder (like if the pick is #4-10) to CLE for Jarrett Allen. That 2024 pick should be going to the Knicks after these trades anyway. CLE might be tempted by the thought of pairing a versatile defender like Vando with Mobley to cover for Mitchell and Garland.

01-05: Gabe, Green, Luka, Hachimura, Allen
06-10: Lowry, Christie, G-Will, Kleber, Lively
11-15: Exum, Hardy, DJJ, O-Max, Powell

I think this roster looks real good. Although with THJ and Seth gone, it could use a shooter with good off-ball movement. Perhaps, one of Christie or Hardy can become that.

Irving for Herro/Jovic/two first round picks is another deal that makes a lot of sense. Miami with Kyrie/Lowry/Butler/Love/Adebayo is a contender. 

Herro is 23 years old. Jovic is 20 years old. You tank another year. Get Luka healthy. Get a top pick.

Obviously if that was the direction the franchise was taking THJ/Holmes for Ayton would have been even more of a no-brainer.

Luka/Herro/Green/Williams/Ayton with a bench of Exum/Hardy/Jovic/Omax/Lively is not a bad starting place at all.

Unfortunately I have to tell you that Mark Cuban thinks he has build a championship contender here around Doncic/Kyrie.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/3867...aiving-him




Thunder trade Oladipo and Robinson-Earl for KP Jr

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Under no circumstances will Kyrie be moved any time soon. The Mavs are ride or die with Luka/Kyrie. IMO, the only trades that make sense would be for a Eason type SF and a C who is young enough to still have a lot of trade value in 2 years.