Trade & FA 2024-25:

[KillerLeft]

We just have a kick ass group of people here that consistently produce some of the highest quality bball discussion on the web bar none.

Couldn't agree more. I love this place.

[HoosierDaddyKidd]

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_...ft-outlook



NBA Free Agency, priorities and needs for all 30 teams.

[Scott41theMavs]

Mavs Film Room (@MavsFilmRoom)
While all reporting suggests that Klay is on his way out of Golden State, I think we should be prepared for a scenario in which Steph Curry intervenes & both sides come to their senses.

I believe the Mavs are the favorites, but too much history in Golden State to feel certain.

Please please please, Steph. Do us this solid. Save us from ourselves.

[Scott41theMavs]

No roster is perfect but DJJ and Grimes are great PoA defenders. There’s no perfect player available. Your point about Kleber is valid. Some are higher than others on Omax and one could argue that Lively shooting 2 threes a game is just as good as Maxi. But I think we both agree that Maxi at the 4 is not ideal and that’s his role here. I agree though, he’s important and would be a hole that must be filled by others.

What other player rumored available that Green+Maxi can return would you rather have?

Jerami Grant
Cam Johnson
Deandre Hunter
Bruce Brown
Andrew Wiggins
Kyle Kuzma
Tobias Harris
Pat Williams
KCP

Some will cost picks, others probably not. I don’t see a single player that fits PoA defender, elite shooter, 36 mpg playoff starter.

KCP, easy.

[HoosierDaddyKidd]

Dirk’s available. Also one of the best shooters of all time.

I'm pretty sure he can still go stand in a corner.

[Scott41theMavs]

The issue isn't that the Mavs wouldn't have POA attack defenders. But where do you find minutes for them if Kyrie, Luka and Klay are starting/playing 30+ minutes.
Kleber is not only the 5-out big. He is also their switch all big. A skillset that Lively and Gafford don't offer. Mavs would lose a lot of their lineup versatility without him.

There is no perfect solution. Mavs don't have the assets to get the kind of player that can fix all of their issues. Doesn't mean that they should settle for a player that creates as much issues as he fixes. Mavs don't have to make a trade just for the sake of it. They don't have to trade Green+Kleber this summer. And if they make a trade they don't have to chase the biggest available name.

You are David against Goliath here, and just know that I am your biggest cheerleader.

[Jason Terry]

Lots of assumptions being made on both sides of this, our first post-"The Day of Agreement" debate. 

Here's where I am, in the most basic of senses:

I love the trade to turn THJ into 50% air, 50% Grimes, freeing up the MLE for DJJ, and not giving up a first. I think that's genius. Given that there were likely other options, does anyone have even a slight difficulty acknowledging that Harrison probably correctly identified the best one to choose? Even without knowing details of the others, can't we reasonably assume this was the one to jump on?

I am 99.9% sure Derrick Jones, Jr will be re-signed. MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. Harrison said he'd do it, and I think he's going to do it. If so, we should all be content with the off-season, because re-signing Jones and adding a smaller piece (Grimes) is all we thought reasonably possible going into the off-season, and some among us didn't think that much was possible. 

Personally, I am not super, super thrilled if Jones gets the ENTIRE $12.9 million MLE. I think he has earned as much as he can get, but I think he's more likely to look like a mistake signing at that number in a year than he would in the $8-10 million range. It's a small quibble, I know, so I won't get into a twist about this, but it's something I'm monitoring. 

As long as the Mavs accomplish everything above, which I believe constitutes some nifty roster management to secure the services and bird rights of probably the TWO best POA defenders available this off-season, it's going to be pretty difficult for me to sour on anything they do afterwards, provided the rest is extra - in addition to - also - cherry on top.

Now, here are some things I believe, and please bear with me if this is a little on the ramble side - I want to thoroughly build this house:

1) Though they tinkered with the lineup all season, the Mavs ultimately decided to bet on DJJ in a big role down the stretch and through the playoffs. This was the right choice, and paid off. But, there's a reason they didn't give him the job on opening night, and there's a reason he's not getting more than the MLE. 

2) They stopped playing Hardaway almost completely as the season neared the end, despite the knowledge that doing so would end any chances of getting him out of his slump and that not having the best version of him in the playoffs might hold them back at some point. It was a judgement call, and whether anyone wants to admit it, one that came with some risk. 

3) Green was also sort of passed over for a bigger role down the stretch and in the playoffs, though they did play him plenty, as he emerged about halfway through the playoffs as the least of all evil choices when it came to bench wing. Still, he was anything but consistent, and now his name is out there in trade rumors. 

4) DJJ, while integral to the stretch run and first three rounds, was not effective in the finals. Not only was he part of the problem on offense, but with how Boston approaches their attack, he was honestly a non-factor on defense, too. This isn't an indictment on him, it's just Boston has the horses and the system to ensure they're attacking whomever they want, and can do so no matter what cross-matches you're throwing at them. In those specific circumstances, DJJ is borderline unplayable. 

5) Despite point #4, the Mavs' offense, not their defense, is what cost them the championship. I'm not interested in nuance with this point (yet), just stating a fact. They had a 101 rating in the Finals, and that's ABYSMAL. Their defense actually held Boston under their regular season norm for the series. 

6) Harrison stated prior to the off-season that retaining DJJ was "priorities 1A and 1B." We know they had to do some gymnastics to make this possible, so we know that what DJJ brought to the table is appreciated and seen as the most important thing to secure this summer. 

7) The Mavs are very likely to see other teams attempt to defend them exactly how Boston did. Teams like Minnesota can't, but teams like LAC and OKC might be able to get there. Those are just examples, using the teams Dallas faced in the playoffs. This should be very concerning for us. It must be accounted for in Harrison's plans, moving forward. "Overreacting" is a valid thing to be concerned about, but changing nothing is simply not an option if they're serious about winning a championship soon.

8) IF the Mavs want to continue with their offensive system, they've got to add variety to the sources of scoring within it. The offense has to be less predictable. These changes can't come from additional perimeter-based ball-handling, because the team is already built around two of that type of player. A third would add depth, but not fundamentally change what's possible in a playoff series. That might help them win the battle of the benches, but even that, I think, is faulty thinking, because Luka and Kyrie just failed to get the offense going against a switch-all defense and there is almost no chance they'll find a 3rd even close to their level (because why on Earth would that player want to come here?). Even if you think I'm wrong about this (I'm not, but judging by the ideas for adding players, many of you think I am) then that 3rd ball-handler would need to play WITH Luka and Kyrie, simultaneously, to make a difference with this problem. That brings us back to benching Jones during stretches that matter. 

9) Given #8, it seems obvious to me the offensive changes must come from positions (offensive positions, to be clear) 3-5. Unless you think Dereck Lively is about to be some feared threat from the post (I don't) or some Draymond Green/Vlade Divac level dribble-handoff hub of offense (I don't), then we can eliminate the 5 as a possibility for this evolution. That leaves the two forward spots, which are the exact spots Jason Timpf identified as the offensive weak links as Dallas tried to make this style of offense work against Boston's style of defense.

10) I believe that Jerami Grant would be a solution to all of this. Strongly. I believe Nico Harrison agrees and has been desperately trying to find a way to get him. I view Grant as a monumental leap forward in offensive creation and finishing for this team, including adding dimensions they don't even have right now in addition to just improving off-ball spacing in the areas of the Mavs' sets that the league now knows to ignore, thanks to Boston. I also believe this is in line with the other priority of "not losing the defensive identity" because in the worst-case, Grant can guard 2-4 positions and be closer to DJJ/PJ than he is to Green/Hardaway in effectiveness, and in the best-case, I think he'd make an impact on that end similar to the ones DJJ/PJ made down the stretch. He's at the very least another long, athletic, versatile, switchable forward - the kind every team in the NBA covets. 

11) Because I believe Harrison agrees with me about Grant, because he prioritized re-signing DJJ, because he went out and got Grimes (who is rather obviously meant specifically as an upgrade in the role Green had during the playoffs) and even because of who they targeted the other night with their second rounder, I believe rather faithfully that Harrison and the Mavs are seeing the team the same way I do, and the same way many of the people upset with this Klay Thompson rumor do, too. I think their aim is to keep the team long, athletic and potentially more switchable, while searching for ways (with some urgency) to add BOTH improved shooting/spacing to what's already working on offense (to make it work better) AND add more variety to how that offense is generated. This is a "thank God" moment for me, but all those goals, combined, constitutes something much easier said than done. 

12) #11 leads me to believe that Grant is either unavailable for what the Mavs are able/willing to offer, or that he doesn't really want to come here. That sucks, from my POV, but it might be beyond them to get it done and thus can't be helped. Because I think the interest in Grant points rather overtly to the idea that they were toying with the idea that this offensive improvement could come by upgrading PJ's spot, and not DJJ's, I think this speaks loudly that they, like many of us, believe that POA defender is an area they'd prefer not to disturb in a perfect world. 

13) Ok, so who's out there and gettable who represents an offensive leap forward at the 4 without losing too much (if any) defense, once we eliminate Grant? And bear in mind, not only can the defense not drop off from where PJ was down the stretch, but the offensive improvement must be significant enough to be more attractive than the prospect of potential improvement from PJ, himself, who is only 25 and fit here eerily well. The only name I've read all summer that even comes close to qualifying is Kyle Kuzma, who I think is more of a natural offensive player than PJ, and could fix some of these problems on offense. (For the record, I now understand why the Mavs kicked the tires on him at the deadline. I think that's an indication that Harrison saw this problem coming in advance, and even though I loathe Kuzma, I'm currently finding comfort in this, even, because I understand the why of it now and take it as yet another sign that Harrison is seeing the puzzle the same way I do). But, Kuzma's basketball IQ is low, so I doubt he'd help as much as Harrison would hope. I don't think he's up to playing defense how DJJ/PJ do, and with those factors, combined, I'd struggle with the idea of pushing PJ to the bench (or even moving him) to make room for Kuzma, who likely wouldn't want a bench role, himself, given that he didn't want to come here when the starting job was his for the taking at the deadline. 

14) #13 got a little wordy, sorry, but the moral of the story is that Grant was literally the only path to accomplishing everything they needed to accomplish I saw this summer, at least in a close to ideal way, and it doesn't look like that's a possibility. So, that brings us to finding "less than ideal" ways, to my thinking. 

15) If you can't add a new style/dimension to your offensive system then the logical fallback is to improve the off-ball shooting, which was already at least 2nd or 3rd on the list of priorities. 

16) Nothing, and I mean nothing, from the observations above gives me any reason to believe Harrison and the Mavs don't see this athletic, POA component to what worked for them as any less important than many of us do. So, I'm not going to panic until they give me a real, concrete reason to do so. I think they know that a defender like that is needed next to Luka and Kyrie. 

Conclusions:

There are so, so many things about this Thompson stuff that we don't know yet. We can assume what his motives/drives are, but this is a team that just made the Finals. The Warriors didn't make the playoffs, right? Is it not possible he'd be coming in more on the Mavs' terms than we immediately suspect? I don't think the Mavs' recent actions are those of a team afraid to make tough rotation decisions when they determine how to move forward. 

The contract range being discussed isn't problematic to me, and it really can't reach a problematic place, due to the limited size of what's available after DJJ signs relative to the hard cap they're now dealing with (and likely always intended as a limiter). By rule, a sign-and-trade has to be three years, but what if years two and three aren't fully guaranteed? On one extreme, this could end up being a freaking trade chip at the deadline. I don't expect something that favorable, but I'm just illustrating that the details matter here. 

For that matter, are we even sure yet that this is real? Is it possible that this is a leverage play from either side, or even both? It doesn't feel that way, but isn't that the point of a good leverage play, and if it's that, wouldn't that represent improvement in front office craft, rather than a revert back to the Cuban style? This could be a way to lower the trade-cost for Grant or even someone we haven't thought of. This could be a way to lower the contractual demands of DJJ to maintain future flexibility, which might explain why he just changed representation. There are just so many factors in play we don't know. 

We don't even know whether GS or the Clippers are interested in doing this for Thompson/Dallas, even if the mutual interest is real.

And, above all, there is a way to make adding Klay Thompson to last year's rotation a positive. We can worry that they won't hit the sweet spot with it, but again, nothing in the above observations leads to believe they're said in some meeting "eff it, let's just go back to only caring about shooting." I assume that if this is real, they think they can work Klay into what's already working, and that's supported clearly, I think, by the prioritization of retaining DJJ (at a significant markup in salary) AND adding Grimes. If they're wrong, they're wrong, but it's not going to be some window closer, because I don't think they'll allow it to prevent them from retaining Jones, which at the very least gives them the option to play pretty much exactly the way they just did in the playoffs, whether Thompson is here or not. 

It's cool to compare what they do (if they do this) to the "what ifs" of other paths, but we don't even know what other paths are really, actually available. The people making the decisions outlined above seem like they see what I do, so while this wouldn't have been my first choice of paths, I'm reasonably confident whatever they wind up doing will be pretty close to the top of the list of what is actually possible.

Good stuff in here. Thank you 

I see what you see mostly. There’s a bit of nuance 

A. If we were to go back and re-watch every game from last year I believe the big takeaway would be just how far below 100% Luka was for the entire playoff run. (Kyrie also worn down by the finals) To me this might be the most important problem to deal with to be able to get back. 

B. The biggest improvement offensively last season was due to the increase in pace. Players with both size and speed flourished. Especially in the regular season where the fast break exists. More of this style would make offense easier 

C. The takeaway from Boston is skilled ball is still the goal. The biggest difference between the teams as far as skill was not just shooting like is pointed out. Boston has 4 guys that can dribble and attack from anywhere and that was a big difference offensively. Defensively they had more rim protection and perimeter defense from their guards

D. Lively is not some role player. He’s on the superstar track. I think the organization plans for him being a focal point on both ends. I don’t think there’s any limits to his versatility 

E. We should change our offensive system to have something else. I’m at a loss what that will look like besides the more minor changes like pace. Luka is at the heart of this and would need to want it. I’m not sure where we’re at with that. Luka loves to spam PnR and run iso for large stretches. The situation is complicated

[KillerLeft]

You are David against Goliath here, and just know that I am your biggest cheerleader.

Scott, most people agree with you. YOU are Goliath.

[audiosway]

Point is that people weren't happy with THJ. Even in his best season. And the below average season from Klay isn't a random occurrence in his prime. He is in his mid 30s and hasn't been the same after his injuries. Is on a downwards trajectory. All-NBA level defense is a thing of the past and even his shooting percentages are trending in the wrong direction.
We can talk ourselves into all kinds of scenarios where he has a throwback season with the Mavs. But we should also consider that the Mavs have made the same mistake in the past. Invested assets/capspace and ended up with the corpse of a former great.

If the stories are to be believed I can actually see why Dallas would be interested in Klay. I live in the Bay Area and still keep up with the Warriors as well. It's true that Klay can't move the way he could 4-5 years ago. It happens. He has recovered from the Knee and Achilles just fine.

Coming off of a screen there is no one more deadly. The guy is just a pure sniper. He is the kind of sniper I was talking about that the Mavs desperately need. THJ has never played as well as Klay even now. At 33 Klay still plays better defense than THJ ever has. He's an above average defender despite what the stats show. He has the length and BBIQ to still play solid defense.

There aren't any videos from this season but here is one from the 21-22 season when Klay was 31-32. He can't move his feet laterally like he used to but he still has no problem moving the ball handler into help forcing his will on them. He is very strong and can defend well in the post also. He is strong, active hands, good anticipation, and most importantly his BBIQ is off the charts. Those guys age well.



The reason this season wasn't as good for him and the Warriors was the addition of CP3. They are also trying to work in young players since the core is getting older. The shooting is not something that will go on him. Granted, he is going to have a couple of duds a year like any shooter but he always bounces back next game. For example, he had an 0-10 night last season and followed it up 25 shooting 50% from 3.

As a starter he can comfortably give you 28-29 minutes a night of solid 2 way play. He will also still have nights of 30+ points as well. He had a season high 35 last year. Most of the time you'll get 18-25 points a game from him with solid defense. His passing is also heavily underrated. He moves the ball to the right man.

Another thing that is not being recognized here by fans is that this guy has ice in his veins. He's got 4 titles. He is not going to flinch. He will stay cool headed and be a serious calming influence on the young guys including Luka. He brings a championship swagger with him. Imagine the influence he could have on guys like PJ, Grimes, O-Max, Hardy, etc. It would also set it up where you can put him at the 3 and mitigate the loss in speed. He generally plays the 3 anyway. That would have PJ at the 4. That's a very solid pairing.

The defense will get better alone due to teaching guys from his experience. The shooting of the team will likely improve as well. He is one of the best pure shooters of all time. That stuff tends to rub off.

[BigDirk41]

I do agree with Jason Terry that Lively's offensive game will be expanded noticeably. I think he'll be allowed to shoot next year and he can facilitate some offense at the free throw line hitting the corner guys. He's great with that play. He has great vision for a big man. If he can turn and shoot from the free throw line, a lot would open up for him.

[BigDirk41]

Lively knocking down corner 3s next year will add a new dimension as well.

[KillerLeft]

Good stuff in here. Thank you 

I see what you see mostly. There’s a bit of nuance 

A. If we were to go back and re-watch every game from last year I believe the big takeaway would be just how far below 100% Luka was for the entire playoff run. (Kyrie also worn down by the finals) To me this might be the most important problem to deal with to be able to get back. 

B. The biggest improvement offensively last season was due to the increase in pace. Players with both size and speed flourished. Especially in the regular season where the fast break exists. More of this style would make offense easier 

C. The takeaway from Boston is skilled ball is still the goal. The biggest difference between the teams as far as skill was not just shooting like is pointed out. Boston has 4 guys that can dribble and attack from anywhere and that was a big difference offensively. Defensively they had more rim protection and perimeter defense from their guards

D. Lively is not some role player. He’s on the superstar track. I think the organization plans for him being a focal point on both ends. I don’t think there’s any limits to his versatility 

E. We should change our offensive system to have something else. I’m at a loss what that will look like besides the more minor changes like pace. Luka is at the heart of this and would need to want it. I’m not sure where we’re at with that. Luka loves to spam PnR and run iso for large stretches. The situation is complicated

Thanks for this! 

I’m mostly with you, and especially with E. That’s the one element of what Dallas is doing that I think I’m out on, philosophically. Relying on the 1-5 PNR exclusively in the “hard roll” sense leads to having a certain type of big, exclusively, which leads to far more drop coverage than I like, personally. 

But, either that is what Kiddy believes in, or that is how Luka/the Mavs believe they need to play for him to be at his best. Personally, I think he was at his best towards the end of the Carlisle years, even if he hadn’t developed his mid-range game yet to where is now, but that’s a completely different conversation. 

And, I’m pretty uncomfortable with the suggestion that I am somehow not a believer in Lively. I don’t mean to minimize him at all – I think he’s a great player. But, I think “superstar track“ is one of the more gross exaggerations I’ve read in sometime. He is a very athletic, rim running big with a high basketball IQ and can move the ball intelligently. He plays with maximum energy all the time, which is really rare for a big, and he’s on a path that will likely end up with him being one of the best defenders in the word, for a drop-coverage big. That is an amazing player to have, and can even be viewed as a cornerstone player (I think he’s there already), but that is the description of a premium role player.

[KillerLeft]

Lively knocking down corner 3s next year will add a new dimension as well.

Sure, that’s a good thing. But, Harrison literally said, word for word, “ that’s not something we are ever going to ask him to do very consistently here in Dallas.“

They are locked in on 1–5 screen and roll with a hard roller. I suppose putting lively in the corner can be a solution when guys like Tatum are switched out to him, but it doesn’t seem like they are looking forward to a time when they can run pick and pops with him or anything like that.

I might be wrong about that.

[BigDirk41]

Sure, that’s a good thing. But, Harrison literally said, word for word, “ that’s not something we are ever going to ask him to do very consistently here in Dallas.“

They are locked in on 1–5 screen and roll with a hard roller. I suppose putting lively in the corner can be a solution when guys like Tatum are switched out to him, but it doesn’t seem like they are looking forward to a time when they can run pick and pops with him or anything like that.

I might be wrong about that.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with that comment, but I don't personally take stock in what Nico says about how a certain player will play. I think that's for Kidd to decide. This may be 100% accurate, but I personally think he is going to be given more freedom. To what level, who knows. That's still  to be seen.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

Any interest in D’Angelo Russell?

I personally do not like his knuckleheadness but he could be a third combo guard if they don’t trust Hardy yet. The Spencer Dinwiddie role. Shot 41.5% from three.

He just opted in for $18.7 million. Not sure how that would work.

[BigDirk41]

Any interest in D’Angelo Russell?

I personally do not like his knuckleheadness but he could be a third combo guard if they don’t trust Hardy yet. The Spencer Dinwiddie role. Shot 41.5% from three.

He just opted in for $18.7 million. Not sure how that would work.

Hell to the no...lol

[F Gump]

We happen to have a TPE of $16.2mm from the THJ trade.  

This is the scenario I brought up last night where you bring Thompson into this slot.  DJJ takes about $10.5mm and you keep Maxi.  You have your cushion, but you have to trade Green into space, a TPE or someone's NT MLE (or to LAC depending on everything else).  At that point you've traded THJ/Green for Thompson/Grimes.  You gave up some seconds and would presumably get seconds back (at least one of which would go to GSW for the S&T).

One last note.  How positive are we Grimes is here to stay.  One design no one has looked at yet is Grimes/Maxi as the outgoing.  DJJ (and a little OMax) is your backup behind PJ, Green/Thompson share the 3 and you've created more space for Hardy to get some minutes.  You can take Thompson into that same TPE from the Hardaway deal, but DJJ has to take about $11mm.  

I've got to go do some yard work, but I wonder if there is a version where Wiggins, Moody, Maxi and Grimes go to LAC and Thompson coming here for Maxi/Grimes.  You have flexibility in setting Thompson's number (or you sub in Exum instead of Grimes or BP instead of Moody.  I don't have time to work out the math, but it feels like there is a version in there somewhere depending on what Thompson is really willing to take (which we don't know for sure)

FYI the idea you quoted of us having 16.3 before filling slot 14 is significantly off. But we do have room to pay Klay the 16.xM if he will take it. It's limited to 16.2M if using the TPE from a THJ trade, but can be expanded to the Apron room (whatever it is) after paying DJJ, if the THJ trade is linked with the Klay trade.

In the idea of keeping Maxi, and rolling a Klay SNT into the THJ deal, and then setting aside 1M for a cushion under the Apron, you have 12 players and 2 empty slots. Your total for just those 12 players including dead cap, incentives, Apron accounting, etc and including the cushion is $152.1M. $0 on the empty slots, of course.

178.6 APRON
177.6 Available (allow for a cushion)

160.1 13 players currently under contract
1.5 Incentives not included in the above
2.2 Dead money
163.8 TOTAL

13.9 Available now for 1 slot (slot 14)
26.5 Available for 2 slots (slots 13, 14) if Green is outgoing in a trade

That leaves you about $26.54M to pay BOTH Klay and DJJ. Or you can pay Klay, then try to sign DJJ with TxMLE. If you are paying 10.5 to DJJ, you only have 16M for Klay.

[dirkfansince1998]

If the stories are to be believed I can actually see why Dallas would be interested in Klay. I live in the Bay Area and still keep up with the Warriors as well. It's true that Klay can't move the way he could 4-5 years ago. It happens. He has recovered from the Knee and Achilles just fine.

Coming off of a screen there is no one more deadly. The guy is just a pure sniper. He is the kind of sniper I was talking about that the Mavs desperately need. THJ has never played as well as Klay even now. At 33 Klay still plays better defense than THJ ever has. He's an above average defender despite what the stats show. He has the length and BBIQ to still play solid defense.

There aren't any videos from this season but here is one from the 21-22 season when Klay was 31-32. He can't move his feet laterally like he used to but he still has no problem moving the ball handler into help forcing his will on them. He is very strong and can defend well in the post also. He is strong, active hands, good anticipation, and most importantly his BBIQ is off the charts. Those guys age well.

The reason this season wasn't as good for him and the Warriors was the addition of CP3. They are also trying to work in young players since the core is getting older. The shooting is not something that will go on him. Granted, he is going to have a couple of duds a year like any shooter but he always bounces back next game. For example, he had an 0-10 night last season and followed it up 25 shooting 50% from 3.

As a starter he can comfortably give you 28-29 minutes a night of solid 2 way play. He will also still have nights of 30+ points as well. He had a season high 35 last year. Most of the time you'll get 18-25 points a game from him with solid defense. His passing is also heavily underrated. He moves the ball to the right man.

Another thing that is not being recognized here by fans is that this guy has ice in his veins. He's got 4 titles. He is not going to flinch. He will stay cool headed and be a serious calming influence on the young guys including Luka. He brings a championship swagger with him. Imagine the influence he could have on guys like PJ, Grimes, O-Max, Hardy, etc. It would also set it up where you can put him at the 3 and mitigate the loss in speed. He generally plays the 3 anyway. That would have PJ at the 4. That's a very solid pairing.

The defense will get better alone due to teaching guys from his experience. The shooting of the team will likely improve as well. He is one of the best pure shooters of all time. That stuff tends to rub off.

The bench unit with CP3 was one of the few bright spots for the Warriors. So good that they even tried to start CP3 instead of Klay for a few weeks. Thompson stood out as the player with the worst plus/minus numbers on the team in any given role. Didn't work next to Curry/Draymond. Was even worse off the bench.
 
Not trying to be an asshole because it isn't really about you but I am so freakin done with the despite the numbers narrative. We have reached a point where the NBA/synergy is tracking everything. I can confirm my eyetest with his post defense numbers. Can look at the tracking numbers to confirm that he gets deflections or secures lose balls. Can look at his blow by %. Can look at his plus/minus impact.
There might be a case that one of those metrics is underrating Thompson's defensive abilities but when all of them paint the same picture and confirm the narrative that most Warriors related media outlets and my eyetest agree with I am inclined to believe that he isn't a good defender.

It's interesting that you mention his passing. From what I can tell his athletic decline hurt his decision making. He isn't able to attack close outs like he used to and the Warriors aren't running as much split action for him because teams aren't afraid of his ability to cut. Resulting in an even higher 3-point volume. More contested 3s.

What remains is the intangible part that you mentioned. His reputation. I think that no matter what happens Klay is always going to have a gravity that only a few select star players can match. No one is going to help off him. Even if he is only shooting 37-38% from 3 for the season. That's certainly a positive.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

Ice water in his veins except when they got eliminated in the playin and he went 0-10.

Tired of fans with all the descriptors for formerly great players. Had to go through the same thing when the Rangers trade for Max Scherzer last year.

[KillerLeft]

Ice water in his veins except when they got eliminated in the playin and he went 0-10.

Tired of fans with all the descriptors for formerly great players. Had to go through the same thing when the Rangers trade for Max Scherzer last year.

Can you clarify the point you're making here? I know who Max Scherzer is, but I'm not up on what most fans thought of the move. 

Are you saying that memory of past greatness is leading fans to reach unrealistic expectations of old players' future chances? Do I have that right?