Game 47 Dirkie: Tim Hardaway Jr 41.38% (not definitive enough bc haters)

[KillerLeft]

The games when Hardaway deserves consideration for the Dirkie are so telling. Some people (many) just can't get there.

Also, those hyping Isaac should be hopeful that my forbidding of the Mavs to trade O-Max holds, imo. That's the vision for who he can be, only healthy. I fully understand that getting there is not a given for him, but I also understand that players with that body type, wingspan, foot speed, motor and all around athletic package don't come around very often. I don't think there's even one per draft, to be honest. When you get a guy like that you can't throw him away.

In case the Mavs are reading and need me to restate this for legal purposes: The Mavs cannot trade O-Max. I forbid it. This is a lawful order when issued by one of the best and most loyal Mavericks fans (which of course we all know me to be).

You're welcome, everyone!

[Scott41theMavs]

Lively is great and is going to be fantastic in a couple of years.

FIFY

[KillerLeft]

FIFY

I think you're both wrong. 

Lively is fantastic NOW!

He'll get better, sure, and it's not lost on me that the reason he looks so great this year is just that he fits Luka and this team like a dream, but we can't hold good fit against him, why would we? 

Honestly, other than the specific year of Tyson Chandler we saw in 2011, just that one season, have any of us seen a better season of center play for the Mavericks? I guess some of the old timers might go back to the Moody Madness days with ideas here, but I didn't really experience that era. Lively is fitting better than Dampier (who I defended) ever did, that's for sure, and while Diop had his moments, I don't think he was this impactful.

[DanSchwartzgan]

Also, those hyping Isaac should be hopeful that my forbidding of the Mavs to trade O-Max holds, imo. That's the vision for who he can be, only healthy. I fully understand that getting there is not a given for him, but I also understand that players with that body type, wingspan, foot speed, motor and all around athletic package don't come around very ofter. I don't think there's even one per draft, to be honest.  When you get a guy like that you can't throw him away.

One of the nice things about attending games is getting to watch specific players in warm-ups.  It can fool you as I've seen Powell drain 20 threes in a row.  But, OMax has some ball skills (if you want to get excited about running against tackling dummies).  He also has great size.  He isn't young though.  For instance, Kuminga is younger and finally seems to be coming into his own.  So, this isn't waiting for some promising 19 year old to figure it out.

Still, I'd make OMax a consideration when looking at trade candidates.  We've tended to be mentioned for bigger guys who can create offense for themselves and others more than pure 4's.  I think that's at least partially because they think OMax can play alongside a big wing in the mold of the guys who often get mentioned for Dallas.  I don't agree with some of your positional assumptions if/when we trade for such a forward, but I do agree with the idea that GWill needs to go.  Trading for a big forward while retaining Williams blocks Prosper's path to the throne.

[youzigizag]

I think you're both wrong. 

Lively is fantastic NOW!

He'll get better, sure, and it's not lost on me that the reason he looks so great this year is just that he fits Luka and this team like a dream, but we can't hold good fit against him, why would we? 

Honestly, other than the specific year of Tyson Chandler we saw in 2011, just that one season, have any of us seen a better season of center play for the Mavericks? I guess some of the old timers might go back to the Moody Madness days with ideas here, but I didn't really experience that era. Lively is fitting better than Dampier (who I defended) ever did, that's for sure, and while Diop had his moments, I don't think he was this impactful.

My comment is coming from the opinion that he still hasnt fully figured out the speed of the NBA, learned his teammates tendencies completely, fumbles a lot of passes and rebounds...but most importantly...he will be bigger and stronger in a few years.

I think he is playing well.   Im not in the "rookies cant contribute for 4 years" school of thought.   Personally...I think making comments like that are uncalled for and not based on anything factual.   Its just blasting an opinion that is not fact for all players...so why even say it.

Lively fumbles passes he isnt expecting because he doesnt know Luka's tendencies completely yet.   In 2 years the kid will look so good next to Luka if we dont trade him.   In 4 years they will be dynamite.

[KillerLeft]

One of the nice things about attending games is getting to watch specific players in warm-ups.  It can fool you as I've seen Powell drain 20 threes in a row.  But, OMax has some ball skills (if you want to get excited about running against tackling dummies).  He also has great size.  He isn't young though.  For instance, Kuminga is younger and finally seems to be coming into his own.  So, this isn't waiting for some promising 19 year old to figure it out.

Still, I'd make OMax a consideration when looking at trade candidates.  We've tended to be mentioned for bigger guys who can create offense for themselves and others more than pure 4's.  I think that's at least partially because they think OMax can play alongside a big wing in the mold of the guys who often get mentioned for Dallas.  I don't agree with some of your positional assumptions if/when we trade for such a forward, but I do agree with the idea that GWill needs to go.  Trading for a big forward while retaining Williams blocks Prosper's path to the throne.

Age is relative, sure. But he IS young, as I use the term. To me, Luka is still young. I get your point, that he's on the older side for a rookie, but it's not like he's that "Sarge" guy they wasted a pick on back in the day (can't remember his name, sorry). 

O-Max has already shown more handles IN GAMES than I expected him to have, but I'm happy to hear that he's out there working on skills and caught your eye. 

Did you make any observations about his physical presence? Did he seem bigger or smaller than you expected?

[DallasMaverick]

I think you're both wrong. 

Lively is fantastic NOW!

He'll get better, sure, and it's not lost on me that the reason he looks so great this year is just that he fits Luka and this team like a dream, but we can't hold good fit against him, why would we? 

Honestly, other than the specific year of Tyson Chandler we saw in 2011, just that one season, have any of us seen a better season of center play for the Mavericks? I guess some of the old timers might go back to the Moody Madness days with ideas here, but I didn't really experience that era. Lively is fitting better than Dampier (who I defended) ever did, that's for sure, and while Diop had his moments, I don't think he was this impactful.

James Donaldson!!

---

I think you're both wrong. 

Lively is fantastic NOW!

He'll get better, sure, and it's not lost on me that the reason he looks so great this year is just that he fits Luka and this team like a dream, but we can't hold good fit against him, why would we? 

Honestly, other than the specific year of Tyson Chandler we saw in 2011, just that one season, have any of us seen a better season of center play for the Mavericks? I guess some of the old timers might go back to the Moody Madness days with ideas here, but I didn't really experience that era. Lively is fitting better than Dampier (who I defended) ever did, that's for sure, and while Diop had his moments, I don't think he was this impactful.

…and how about Roy Tarpley?

[KillerLeft]

James Donaldson!!

I of course know the name, but that's before my time as an educated fan, I'm ashamed to say. I'll have to take your word for it.

Can you think of anyone from the Dirk or Luka eras? That's a looooooong time.

[omahen]

I will give Maxi an honorable mention.  The D just worked when he was in the game and it didn't seem to work as well when GWill was in the game.  

Maxi enabled Mavs to play bigger, as Luka and Lively played almost whole game. He was good in the zone defense. They packed the paint and defended three well in the second half, mostly forcing Orlando into tough long 2 pointers. Luka was great on Banchero. Orlando lacking a good PG is I think what killed them (besides Mavs playing really well in the second half). But, Maxi is so bad on offense, it is painful to watch. Mavs survived that in a game of excellent shooting from top 3 perimeter scorers this game. I don't think they can survive against a really good team. He decided to do something just twice in 22 minutes. Once was a TO and once a bad miss. We had said it many times, big wing is Mavs biggest need.

[SleepingHero]

Age is relative, sure. But he IS young, as I use the term. To me, Luka is still young. I get your point, that he's on the older side for a rookie, but it's not like he's that "Sarge" guy they wasted a pick on back in the day (can't remember his name, sorry). 

O-Max has already shown more handles IN GAMES than I expected him to have, but I'm happy to hear that he's out there working on skills and caught your eye. 

Did you make any observations about his physical presence? Did he seem bigger or smaller than you expected?

Bernard the Sarge James! What a throwback. 

I actually really liked him in his little time here. At 27 he was a finished of a product as he could be but you could see why they liked him. Wasted pick seems a little harsh but they did miss out on guys like Draymond Green and Khris Middleton, and on the lesser side Kyle O'Quinn and our resident cow's favorite Will Barton.

While we may forever be at odds regarding THJ, I rest easy at night knowing we both are ardent defenders of OMax, 1st of his name, defender of wings, terrorizer of stars, lord in waiting. 

Cannot trade him at all. Seeing him dominate in the G-League is giving me a lot of hope.

[mvossman]

The games when Hardaway deserves consideration for the Dirkie are so telling. Some people (many) just can't get there.

Its just like the ideal roles thread where most folks could not bring themselves to put Timmy in the 6th man role when he is one of the top contenders for 6th man of the year.

[DanSchwartzgan]

Did you make any observations about his physical presence? Did he seem bigger or smaller than you expected?

Big....and fluid.

He was kind of going 3/4 speed while others were going 1/4 speed.  I've obviously watched him in NBA games and seen the highlights of his G-League games.  He gets to the basket well in either environment, but looks like a man among boys in the G-League.  In the NBA his D is kind of herky-jerky and he can't just overpower people.  I knew he was fairly big, so 'fluid' was the bigger impression.