NBA Summer League | Mavs end off 4-1

[khaled1987]

FOR EVERYONE THAT HAS QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PLAYING TIME OF OMAX AND LIVELY I REPEAT MYSELF. THEY ONLY HAD 1 FULL 5 on 5 PRACTICE WITH THE TEAM! And yes that had to be caps

The same is the reason for Lively's "bad hands". ALl but one of those passes weren't exactly good passes IMO. And you need chemistry and repetition to know your teammates.

Silva, MC Wright were rally bad, they're not NBA players.

Hardy has a lot of learning to do as a ball handler/playmaker, I've got to say I expected a bit more of him in that department.

Same as Wallace who played better tbh. Seems like just a Mav decision for whatever reason

[Chicagojk]

I expect Chet to be bullied early but he is legit if he can stay healthy. His impact at the rim will be felt immediately and I think he will play really well off Shai, Williams and Giddey as he gets stronger and more tight on offense. Wallace looked really good. Not sure you can count on him to hit 6 threes often but his form looked good. But I thought he made Jaden work for his points. That may be a trade that really works for both teams.

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I can't remember....have we won a summer league game the last two years? Maybe one. I think we win a few this year. Although if Jaden doesn't play, maybe not.

[ThisIStheYear]

Jeez. OKC finessed the Mavs. Presti is a master. Watching Wallace is like watching a point guard Kawhi. He’s just incredibly precise. Very impressive. Best looking player on the floor by far. He just straight up dominated on both sides. At least the Mavs did get a lot back in that trade though. Prosper looks like a guy who can get some minutes this year. Lively made some good defensive plays but that offense. Yikes. Hardy looks like he’s ready for the lead bench scorer role.

[SleepingHero]

I expect Chet to be bullied early but he is legit if he can stay healthy.  His impact at the rim will be felt immediately and I think he will play really well off Shai, Williams and Giddey as he gets stronger and more tight on offense.  Wallace looked really good.  Not sure you can count on him to hit 6 threes often but his form looked good.  But I thought he made Jaden work for his points.  That may be a trade that really works for both teams.

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I can't remember....have we won a summer league game the last two years?  Maybe one.  I think we win a few this year.  Although if Jaden doesn't play, maybe not.

We were the summer league champions with DSJ, DFS, Johnathan Motley, Yogi, and Ding Yingwuhan or something. 

So really we're a force to be reckoned with in the summer.

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Jeez. OKC finessed the Mavs.  Presti is a master. Watching Wallace is like watching a point guard Kawhi.  He’s just incredibly precise. Very impressive. Best looking player on the floor by far. He just straight up dominated on both sides. At least the Mavs did get a lot back in that trade though. Prosper looks like a guy who can get some minutes this year. Lively made some good defensive plays but that offense. Yikes. Hardy looks like he’s ready for the lead bench scorer role.

That's a really odd reaction to me. Like yes, Cason showed out and looked great. But I suppose it boils down to would you rather have:

Lively+Omax Or Cason Wallace+Bertans 

I think Lively and Omax will fit better and hold their own even if Wallace might be the better player individually.

[audiosway]

STELLAR defense in space to shut Chet down there, followed in the same possession with perfect drop coverage.

Lively is not as raw as this board claims.

Yeah. I thought he looked really good. Playing with Luka and Ky will help with his awareness in the dunker's spot with the ball. They will have him looking for the pass. I want to see him set better screens. His screens were weak. Obviously FTs.

Outside of that, I LOVE what I saw from Lively, OMax, and Lawson. Their defense was just swarming. Them combined with Grant Williams will be a massive upgrade on that side of the ball.

[ThisIStheYear]

We were the summer league champions with DSJ, DFS, Johnathan Motley, Yogi, and Ding Yingwuhan or something. 

So really we're a force to be reckoned with in the summer.

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That's a really odd reaction to me. Like yes, Cason showed out and looked great. But I suppose it boils down to would you rather have:

Lively+Omax Or Cason Wallace+Bertans 

I think Lively and Omax will fit better and hold their own even if Wallace might be the better player individually.

I’d rather have the guy who’s going to be an all star.  But the Mavs already have three excellent guards. They did get alot for him in that trade. I realize now why OKC was willing to give up so much for him.

[SleepingHero]

I’d rather have the guy who’s going to be an all star.  But the Mavs already have three excellent guards. They did get alot for him in that trade. I realize now why OKC was willing to give up so much for him.

I'm not going to say Lively+OMax can't turn into all-stars just based off of 1 summer league game. Especially when they both looked really damn good, although not complete packages. 

Wallace isn't a sure-fired allstar either. He had a great first game.

I think this is going to turn out to be a rare trade where both teams are happy with the result.

[OBX Maverick]

Yeah. I thought he looked really good. Playing with Luka and Ky will help with his awareness in the dunker's spot with the ball. They will have him looking for the pass. I want to see him set better screens. His screens were weak. Obviously FTs.

Outside of that, I LOVE what I saw from Lively, OMax, and Lawson. Their defense was just swarming. Them combined with Grant Williams will be a massive upgrade on that side of the ball.

AJ Lawson…..someone not mentioned too often around here lately. He had a solid game, especially on the defensive end. He fits the wing area of need and can hit a 3. Wonder how much of a role he carves out this year.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

Memphis has two bruisers in David Roddy and Kenneth Lofton Jr. I expect them to be in the rotation this year. Both can play.

[audiosway]

I'm not going to say Lively+OMax can't turn into all-stars just based off of 1 summer league game. Especially when they both looked really damn good, although not complete packages. 

Wallace isn't a sure-fired allstar either. He had a great first game.

I think this is going to turn out to be a rare trade where both teams are happy with the result.

I agree. Cason looks good for OKC. I'm perfectly happy with the trade that said. Dallas needed exactly what they got. I love what Nico is building. Hardy is looking like a good scorer with active hands on D. Lawson looked like he is ready to make the team. Lively and OMax are going to be great fits that I think will surprise this year.

[Scott41theMavs]

I'm not going to say Lively+OMax can't turn into all-stars just based off of 1 summer league game. Especially when they both looked really damn good, although not complete packages. 

Wallace isn't a sure-fired allstar either. He had a great first game.

I think this is going to turn out to be a rare trade where both teams are happy with the result.

I get what TITY is saying - scoring - especially self-shot creation is at a premium when considering who the best players are. Wallace is also solid defensively. 

I would hope that none of us here would expect Lively or OMax to be an all-star in the next five years. We might propose that, and be very happy if, they make all-NBA first or second defensive team. But there's a difference between that and a major two-way all-star who can create his own shot. This trade made sense for the Mavs in terms of already having Luka, Kai, and Hardy. It came down to having such gigantically pervasive roster needs and two being better than one. But I think Wallace is going to be better than Hardy - better at distributing, better at defending, and better even at what Hardy has the "IT" factor in - scoring. It's like CJ McCollum vs. Dame.

[Jakeospikez]

If Lively's shot develops to a decent level then he's easily worth a lottery pick. Stretch 5's with good defense are one of the rarest things on the planet. Not just a drop coverage center either, he looks to have great mobility. Not off to a great start with his FTs though so it's years away but at least the form looks good. If he can expand on the passing he showed today and some minor handles then the pick will be fine even if the shot never comes. I wouldn't overreact to the screens yet, no reason to blast people in freakin Summer league and put both himself and the other guy at risk in meaningless games.

[SleepingHero]

I get what TITY is saying - scoring - especially self-shot creation is at a premium when considering who the best players are. Wallace is also solid defensively. 

I would hope that none of us here would expect Lively or OMax to be an all-star in the next five years. We might propose that, and be very happy if, they make all-NBA first or second defensive team. But there's a difference between that and a major two-way all-star who can create his own shot. This trade made sense for the Mavs in terms of already having Luka, Kai, and Hardy. It came down to having such gigantically pervasive roster needs and two being better than one. But I think Wallace is going to be better than Hardy - better at distributing, better at defending, and better even at what Hardy has the "IT" factor in - scoring. It's like CJ McCollum vs. Dame.

Absolutely. I agree that this trade makes sense and that the skills Wallace has are at a premium. He looked fantastic. But some thoughts on where I'm coming from.

First, I rarely expect any rookie to be a sure-fire all-star. Especially after 1 game of summer league. The ones I do expect are usually top 5, heralded prospects, or at worse top 10. That's what's expected of guys who go that high after all. I don't think it's likely that Lively nor Omax can be one, as their games aren't necessarily conducive to flashy stats and whatever else goes into getting picked for the all-star game (but Rudy's made it a bunch so who knows?). But I also don't think it's likely for Cason to be one either. The numbers are against him being a top 30 player in the league, and its even less likely he can be a top 15 player at his own position given the talent at guard. 

Further, to think that after 1 game we can make any sweeping statements like OKC fleeced the Mavs, I think is a bit nutty. I sure love to make overreactions because its fun, but definitive putdown statements to me kind of takes the air out of the balloon. Cason had a good game and he looked good. But so did Lively AND Omax. Really good in fact. So good that the Mavs were winning the minutes with them on the court. So I think to come away with the thought that the Mavs got fleeced and OKC are kings of the draft yet again is a bit premature. I think both teams got exactly what they wanted.

Finally, if Wallace is better than Hardy is that really a surprise? One was picked 37th, the other 10th. I'm leaning heavily on draft position here, but there is usually a clear gradation between 2nd rounders and lottery picks. What I find funny is you saying Wallace looked better at scoring than Hardy, yet Hardy ended up scoring 24 to Wallace's 20. Wallace had him beat efficiency wise, shooting 46.7% to Hardy's 44.4% (and it took Hardy 3 more shots to get 4 more points).

[SwisherPrice]

AJ Lawson definitely deserves a regular roster spot and not any of the 2-way slots, especially with them not bringing back Pinson. Lively was fine, he just needs to get stronger so it will take a few years. If he develops a jumper at some point then great but mainly he will need to be able to make contested shot attempts inside when he gets the ball there.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

Hardy took all the shots, 18. The next closest players took 9. No balance on shot distribution. Must be a referendum on him to be the primary scorer.

[Scott41theMavs]

Absolutely. I agree that this trade makes sense and that the skills Wallace has are at a premium. He looked fantastic. But some thoughts on where I'm coming from.

First, I rarely expect any rookie to be a sure-fire all-star. Especially after 1 game of summer league. The ones I do expect are usually top 5, heralded prospects, or at worse top 10. That's what's expected of guys who go that high after all. I don't think it's likely that Lively nor Omax can be one, as their games aren't necessarily conducive to flashy stats and whatever else goes into getting picked for the all-star game (but Rudy's made it a bunch so who knows?). But I also don't think it's likely for Cason to be one either. The numbers are against him being a top 30 player in the league, and its even less likely he can be a top 15 player at his own position given the talent at guard. 

Further, to think that after 1 game we can make any sweeping statements like OKC fleeced the Mavs, I think is a bit nutty. I sure love to make overreactions because its fun, but definitive putdown statements to me kind of takes the air out of the balloon. Cason had a good game and he looked good. But so did Lively AND Omax. Really good in fact. So good that the Mavs were winning the minutes with them on the court. So I think to come away with the thought that the Mavs got fleeced and OKC are kings of the draft yet again is a bit premature. I think both teams got exactly what they wanted.

Finally, if Wallace is better than Hardy is that really a surprise? One was picked 37th, the other 10th. I'm leaning heavily on draft position here, but there is usually a clear gradation between 2nd rounders and lottery picks. What I find funny is you saying Wallace looked better at scoring than Hardy, yet Hardy ended up scoring 24 to Wallace's 20. Wallace had him beat efficiency wise, shooting 46.7% to Hardy's 44.4% (and it took Hardy 3 more shots to get 4 more points).

You're presuming that I'm knee-jerking based on one game with Wallace. If you go back to the draft thread, I was on board with the Mavs taking him at 10 prior to the draft. Presuming that all of the red flags on Whitmore come to fruition, I believe he was the best player available at that pick, with the rest of the top 9 (with Whitmore no longer in consideration) off the board. I understand why the Mavs did what they did, and the broader team-building strategy involved. The best case scenario when you're drafting in the lottery is to be able to take the best player available. But when you need two, as the Mavs did with the roster situation the post-Luka-draft era has put them in, you have to trade down. 

In a world where FVV makes more than Kyrie Irving and an 18 and 10 guy is having trouble getting a contract over vet minimum, correctly valuing players is hard - for NBA GMs, and even more so for two dudes typing away on a message board.

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Hardy took all the shots, 18. The next closest players took 9. No balance on shot distribution. Must be a referendum on him to be the primary scorer.

Considering that he's going to have to be able to score at least 18 ppg consistently for this team to compete, that's a good referendum.

[KillerLeft]

I'm glad the Mavs didn't draft Wallace. I have no opinion of him as a player, but from context I'm gleaning that he's an offensive guy. I agree that's valuable, but the Mavs are already trying to walk a tight rope between putting out a competitive product this season and getting younger - this is not an easy thing to do.

Kyrie and Luka are going to dominate the ball, and if THJ is here, he'll be an offensive focal point, too. Then, mix in the idea that they'd like to bring Hardy along within the context of winning games and to me, that's a lot they're trying to accomplish all at once. I doubt they could do that while trying to develop an additional rookie scorer.

A couple of rookie role players whose end goal is learning how to play off of Luka? I can see that.

And, they turned that pick into two, possibly three guys who could be in their rotation as early as this season. I'm satisfied with the approach, myself.

[Scott41theMavs]

I'm glad the Mavs didn't draft Wallace. I have no opinion of him as a player, but from context I'm gleaning that he's an offensive guy. I agree that's valuable, but the Mavs are already trying to walk a tight rope between putting out a competitive product this season and getting younger - this is not an easy thing to do.

Kyrie and Luka are going to dominate the ball, and if THJ is here, he'll be an offensive focal point, too. Then, mix in the idea that they'd like to bring Hardy along within the context of winning games and to me, that's a lot they're trying to accomplish all at once. I doubt they could do that while trying to develop an additional rookie scorer.

A couple of rookie role players whose end goal is learning how to play off of Luka? I can see that.

And, they turned that pick into two, possibly three guys who could be in their rotation as early as this season. I'm satisfied with the approach, myself.

I more or less agree with you, with the caveat that Wallace is scouted to be excellent on defense as well as being a scorer.

[KillerLeft]

I more or less agree with you, with the caveat that Wallace is scouted to be excellent on defense as well as being a scorer.

I get you. I just think a guy like that needs to be a focal point to get to where he needs to get. Unless the Mavs plan to play Lively big minutes right away, their two rookies just seem like guys who can help you as you bring them along. IDK, maybe I'm just drinking the kool aid. I have a feeling both guys are going to work out, though.

[dirkfansince1998]

I'm glad the Mavs didn't draft Wallace. I have no opinion of him as a player, but from context I'm gleaning that he's an offensive guy. I agree that's valuable, but the Mavs are already trying to walk a tight rope between putting out a competitive product this season and getting younger - this is not an easy thing to do.

Kyrie and Luka are going to dominate the ball, and if THJ is here, he'll be an offensive focal point, too. Then, mix in the idea that they'd like to bring Hardy along within the context of winning games and to me, that's a lot they're trying to accomplish all at once. I doubt they could do that while trying to develop an additional rookie scorer.

A couple of rookie role players whose end goal is learning how to play off of Luka? I can see that.

And, they turned that pick into two, possibly three guys who could be in their rotation as early as this season. I'm satisfied with the approach, myself.

Wallace was regarded as one of (if not the) the best on ball defenders of the draft class. Between him and Black. He had an injury that slowed him down in the second half of the season. Most popular pre draft comp was Jrue Holiday.