Trade & FA 2023-24: PHI Keeping An Eye on Butler | Butler Wants Max Extension

[SleepingHero]

Of course. Why would the Nets?  Claxton has been one of the most efficient players in the league and he can rebound and defend. He’s an outstanding player. I’d give all that up just for him. But can’t see why the Nets would take it.

Claxton is a free agent this year and will hit free agency due to extension limitations. Nets might balk at paying 20+mil for him and won't want to lose him for nothing. 

They have a glut of forwards in O'Neal, DFS, Johnson, and Mikal, and they are certainly not a contender. They're getting a 1st and 3 young guys that can develop into something and/or be able to flip for even more assets later down the road. 

It's a light trade but I can see a team like the Nets wanting a guy like Josh Green and Hardy, 2 guys that can move the ball. Currently they only have Dinwiddie as a PG. 

Another variation I have is sending THJ to Orlando for a 1st and Gary Harris. Then reroute those 2 to the Nets and we keep Maxi and our 2027. Or even send 2027 along with the Orlando first if that's what it takes. 

I really like this trade for depth and flexibility.

[ItsGoTime]

Claxton is a free agent this year and will hit free agency due to extension limitations. Nets might balk at paying 20+mil for him and won't want to lose him for nothing. 

They have a glut of forwards in O'Neal, DFS, Johnson, and Mikal, and they are certainly not a contender. They're getting a 1st and 3 young guys that can develop into something and/or be able to flip for even more assets later down the road. 

It's a light trade but I can see a team like the Nets wanting a guy like Josh Green and Hardy, 2 guys that can move the ball. Currently they only have Dinwiddie as a PG. 

Another variation I have is sending THJ to Orlando for a 1st and Gary Harris. Then reroute those 2 to the Nets and we keep Maxi and our 2027. Or even send 2027 along with the Orlando first if that's what it takes. 

I really like this trade for depth and flexibility.

Claxton is about to get about $20M next year and you think he’s a backup?

[SleepingHero]

Claxton is about to get about $20M next year and you think he’s a backup?

I think he's what we need and regardless of his contract number he'd be an asset. 

Lively can easily play off the bench his first 2 years. If Lively outplays Claxton then we have a solid trade asset at a good contract number for star players.

[omahen]

Would you guys do this trade along with the 2027 first? 

No. Having another center that can actually play would be great, but the trade doesn't really solve Mavs biggets needs while the cost is most of the assets. Mavs biggest gain this summer was that Lively can play and is a cheap starting centre. This leaves way more opportunity to get that good 3-D wing, while getting a decent back-up centre shouldn't be difficult to do in the summer. I don't think DFS moves the needle, just another fringe starter.

[IamDougieFresh]

WTF...

You guys assured me that Dwight was a viable backup who can start if necessary.

You lied to me?

[omahen]

LaVine value seems to be very low. Lakers would be willing to offer Russel, Hachimura, one young player and one protected pick for LaVine.

I don't think he is a player Mavs need, so just watching how it unfolds

https://theathletic.com/5151265/2023/12/...ch-lavine/

[F Gump]

I would love a trade that lands Claxton and DFS. But I don't think the Nets would be open to trading them. 

About Claxton's contract, in the offseason I myself proposed trading for Claxton for that reason. Unfortunately, even after the loss of Durant and Kyrie, the Nets have stayed in the "trying to win" mode, which means they want to keep their key contributors. That means Claxton (and DFS also) go nowhere, and they aim at finding a way to keep Claxton and work out a reasonable deal to re-sign him (just the same as the Mavs would do if they traded for him).

If you are the Nets and have a nice core of good-but-not-great players, your next move is to package some of them for a star, if you can, not for a package of randos that don't move the needle in their current form, like Powell, Kleber, Green, and Hardy. I hate to admit it, but that's all those players are these days.

[ThisIStheYear]

Claxton is about to get about $20M next year and you think he’s a backup?

I understand the rationale for the Nets now (thanks for the explanation) but for the Mavs?  I’m pretty sure Claxton and Lively can’t play together. Why would Claxton resign here?  That would be crazy given the shortage of effective centers in the NBA. And the Mavs paying him let’s say $30 million is a bad investment when you already have a quality center.

[surfpuckmd]

I think he's what we need and regardless of his contract number he'd be an asset. 

Lively can easily play off the bench his first 2 years. If Lively outplays Claxton then we have a solid trade asset at a good contract number for star players.

Claxton is one of the best defensive players in the NBA.  He would be awesome here and would give us a top 7 roster in the NBA.  I don't think we have the assets to acquire him though.  Teams like the Pelicans and the Thunder could offer 3 first-round picks for him.  I think that would be Brooklyn's price.  Regardless, the Nets don't control their own picks for a while and have no incentive to tank.  I'd be shocked if they traded Claxton.

Also, his next contract will be for way more than $20 million per year.  Zach Collins received an extension for almost $17 million per year.  Claxton will receive closer to $30 million per year.

[surfpuckmd]

We clearly need a better backup center.  I think DP might be more functional if we had a bigger 4 to play with him.  However, lineups with him and Grant Williams are clearly failing.

I've posted trade proposals for Wendell Carter Jr before and I think he would be a good fit here.

Another good fit who is likely available is Daniel Gafford.  He is among the best rim protectors in the NBA.  He is an above average rebounder.  He is an elite finisher at the rim shooting over 69% from the field.  His FT percentage is solid for a big as well at 70%.

The Wizards are terrible with minimal promising young talent-   they are a lock to tank for the next several seasons.  

I believe a fair trade would be the following:

Mavs send Richaun Holmes, Maxi Kleber and their 2027 unprotected first to the Wizards i.e. Daniel Gafford, Delon Wright and Gallinari.    

Gafford gives us great platoon center to go with Lively and is on a reasonable contract.

Delon Wright and Gallinari are expiring contracts and would free up enough room for us to have the full MLE this coming summer.  

I think this solves two big problems for us.  I'd even consider including Jaden Hardy in the deal if the Wizards would include a future 2nd rounder.

[StepBackJay]

We clearly need a better backup center.  I think DP might be more functional if we had a bigger 4 to play with him.  However, lineups with him and Grant Williams are clearly failing.

I've posted trade proposals for Wendell Carter Jr before and I think he would be a good fit here.

Another good fit who is likely available is Daniel Gafford.  He is among the best rim protectors in the NBA.  He is an above average rebounder.  He is an elite finisher at the rim shooting over 69% from the field.  His FT percentage is solid for a big as well at 70%.

The Wizards are terrible with minimal promising young talent-   they are a lock to tank for the next several seasons.  

I believe a fair trade would be the following:

Mavs send Richaun Holmes, Maxi Kleber and their 2027 unprotected first to the Wizards i.e. Daniel Gafford, Delon Wright and Gallinari.    

Gafford gives us great platoon center to go with Lively and is on a reasonable contract.

Delon Wright and Gallinari are expiring contracts and would free up enough room for us to have the full MLE this coming summer.  

I think this solves two big problems for us.  I'd even consider including Jaden Hardy in the deal if the Wizards would include a future 2nd rounder.

You lost me at unprotected first for Daniel Gafford

[mvossman]

We clearly need a better backup center.  I think DP might be more functional if we had a bigger 4 to play with him.  However, lineups with him and Grant Williams are clearly failing.

I've posted trade proposals for Wendell Carter Jr before and I think he would be a good fit here.

Another good fit who is likely available is Daniel Gafford.  He is among the best rim protectors in the NBA.  He is an above average rebounder.  He is an elite finisher at the rim shooting over 69% from the field.  His FT percentage is solid for a big as well at 70%.

The Wizards are terrible with minimal promising young talent-   they are a lock to tank for the next several seasons.  

I believe a fair trade would be the following:

Mavs send Richaun Holmes, Maxi Kleber and their 2027 unprotected first to the Wizards i.e. Daniel Gafford, Delon Wright and Gallinari.    

Gafford gives us great platoon center to go with Lively and is on a reasonable contract.

Delon Wright and Gallinari are expiring contracts and would free up enough room for us to have the full MLE this coming summer.  

I think this solves two big problems for us.  I'd even consider including Jaden Hardy in the deal if the Wizards would include a future 2nd rounder.

This is basically sending out an unprotected first for a backup center and to clear some cap space.

Its a weird place to be in.  We need a better backup center, but you don't really want to pay a lot for that, and the guys that are reasonably good (like Gafford) are going to want to start somewhere and wont want to be here. 

One way around this is to get a 4/5 guy that can play some minutes with Lively so he is not strictly a backup.  That's why guys like Stewart and Wendle Carter are brought up. 

Another option that you referred to in your first sentence was to get a bigger 4.  Powell is useless playing with Williams or Timmy in the frontcourt.  He might be tolerable next to a big 4 (too bad Maxi can't seem to get on the court).

[surfpuckmd]

This is basically sending out an unprotected first for a backup center and to clear some cap space.

Its a weird place to be in.  We need a better backup center, but you don't really want to pay a lot for that, and the guys that are reasonably good (like Gafford) are going to want to start somewhere and wont want to be here. 

One way around this is to get a 4/5 guy that can play some minutes with Lively so he is not strictly a backup.  That's why guys like Stewart and Wendle Carter are brought up. 

Another option that you referred to in your first sentence was to get a bigger 4.  Powell is useless playing with Williams or Timmy in the frontcourt.  He might be tolerable next to a big 4 (too bad Maxi can't seem to get on the court).

It would turn our greatest weakness into a strength.  It would make us less small and better able to compete with the West's best teams-  Denver and Minnesota.  

I think it would be worth it.  Gafford is a better player than Isaiah Stewart and a better fit on our roster.  He's only 26 so could still improve.  I like Wendell Carter as well and I've posted a trade suggestion targeting him.  Gafford is just better defensively though- his rim protection and ability to finish at the rim provide exactly what we most need from a center. 

Most importantly, I think Gafford is likely actually available.  I've seen no indication that Wendell Carter is.  

Cap space is no small thing anymore.  My proposed trade would allow us to have the full MLE this coming summer.  That likely would allow us to re-sign DJJ.  Dumping Maxi's contract on the Wizards is another huge benefit.  Gafford won't make much more than Maxi over the next 3 years so we solve a major issue without adding much to the cap in 2025-2026.

[surfpuckmd]

You lost me at unprotected first for Daniel Gafford

Gafford is a really good player on a reasonable contract.  We'd be swapping our two worst contracts for an excellent platoon center.  It would also free up the funds this coming summer to re-sign Derrick Jones Jr.  

The price of this would be an unprotected first.  There are several other good teams that could really use Gafford.  We wouldn't be betting against ourselves here.

[sefant]

I've seen no indication that Wendell Carter is. 

Reddit had a good suggestion for once. Goga had a DNP with WCJ back. Thats is your natural backup target with Isaac maybe. Only 24 yrs old, also eastern european, tho probably a good chemistry fit with Luka.

They are kinda stacked on bigs as well with Mo Wagner, who always killing it from the bench with multiple 20 PPG+ games. They ain't trading Wagner because of Franz.

He is expiring.

Goga 6th best D-EPM in the league, higher than Gobert/AD/Mobely. He is sandwiched by KP/Edwards on EPM 

[Mike lorenzo]

Curry+2 SRP for Achiuwa?

Or...

THJ to PISTONS 

Wiseman +Burks+O-Max to HAWKS 

Hunter to MAVS

[IamDougieFresh]

Reddit had a good suggestion for once. Goga had a DNP with WCJ back. Thats is your natural backup target with Isaac maybe. Only 24 yrs old, also eastern european, tho probably a good chemistry fit with Luka.

They are kinda stacked on bigs as well with Mo Wagner, who always killing it from the bench with multiple 20 PPG+ games. They ain't trading Wagner because of Franz.

He is expiring.

Goga 6th best D-EPM in the league, higher than Gobert/AD/Mobely. He is sandwiched by KP/Edwards on EPM 

THJ + Maxi + Powell for Isaac + Harris + Goga

[surfpuckmd]

Reddit had a good suggestion for once. Goga had a DNP with WCJ back. Thats is your natural backup target with Isaac maybe. Only 24 yrs old, also eastern european, tho probably a good chemistry fit with Luka.

They are kinda stacked on bigs as well with Mo Wagner, who always killing it from the bench with multiple 20 PPG+ games. They ain't trading Wagner because of Franz.

He is expiring.

Goga 6th best D-EPM in the league, higher than Gobert/AD/Mobely. He is sandwiched by KP/Edwards on EPM 

I have a moonshot bet on the Magic to win the NBA championship so I'm a Magic fan this year as well as the Mavs.  I've watched most of their games..

Goga has been awesome this year. and has been one of the best defensive centers in the NBA.

It's difficult to determine his value but I think he would also also require a first round pick to acquire.  Teams like the Pelicans and Thunder really need another center and can casually offer a first plus some additional assets.

Also, I believe if we did trade for him we would only have his early bird rights.   My understanding is we would only be able to offer him the league average salary this coming summer which seems to be around $10 million per year.  I believe he'd receive offers elsewhere on teams where he could start and make significantly more money.  

We'd likely be renting him for just this season.  As I don't think we're a contender here, I probably wouldn't offer a first for him.  

He would be great as a platoon center here though.  He's a better version of Gafford.

[DanSchwartzgan]

I have a moonshot bet on the Magic to win the NBA championship so I'm a Magic fan this year as well as the Mavs.  I've watched most of their games..

Goga has been awesome this year. and has been one of the best defensive centers in the NBA.

It's difficult to determine his value but I think he would also also require a first round pick to acquire.  Teams like the Pelicans and Thunder really need another center and can casually offer a first plus some additional assets.

Also, I believe if we did trade for him we would only have his early bird rights.   My understanding is we would only be able to offer him the league average salary this coming summer which seems to be around $10 million per year.  I believe he'd receive offers elsewhere on teams where he could start and make significantly more money.  

We'd likely be renting him for just this season.  As I don't think we're a contender here, I probably wouldn't offer a first for him.  

He would be great as a platoon center here though.  He's a better version of Gafford.

You are correct about his EB status.  He was waived by Indy last season, but Orlando did a deal with him that ran the rest of that season and the current season.  He is a Schwartz guy, so I assume we’d be able to trust them if nothing else.  Also, even as a “starter” in Orlando, Goga was only getting 20 minutes a game.  

To me, Orlando would be a logical trading partner.  They have 3 viable centers and should probably cash one of them in.  Unlike some of the other teams we talk about trading with, they aren’t likely to go big game hunting.  They have stars, they just need them to marinate some more.  They have expiring contracts in case Dallas wants to create more room under the first apron next summer.  And, and a I’m not sure if this is positive or negative, they have a coach who knows some of the players we might send out very well.  The trick for them is improving their O without harming their really good D.

[mvossman]

I have a moonshot bet on the Magic to win the NBA championship so I'm a Magic fan this year as well as the Mavs.  I've watched most of their games..

Goga has been awesome this year. and has been one of the best defensive centers in the NBA.

It's difficult to determine his value but I think he would also also require a first round pick to acquire.  Teams like the Pelicans and Thunder really need another center and can casually offer a first plus some additional assets.

Also, I believe if we did trade for him we would only have his early bird rights.   My understanding is we would only be able to offer him the league average salary this coming summer which seems to be around $10 million per year.  I believe he'd receive offers elsewhere on teams where he could start and make significantly more money.  

We'd likely be renting him for just this season.  As I don't think we're a contender here, I probably wouldn't offer a first for him.  

He would be great as a platoon center here though.  He's a better version of Gafford.

Actually the early bird salary for this year is 12 mil (close to the MLE) and will be higher next season.  Goga reminds me a lot of DJJ and Exum as guys that signed roughly min contracts and are playing way above that early this season.  All three can be re-signed by their own team for roughly the same amount (Goga early, DJJ MLE, Exum early in 2 years) but they are playing so well there is concern they can be retained.  My guess is all three will regress at least a little and be retainable by their current teams.