Finney-Smith at the SF, Improvement in Rebounding

[nash_funk]

Bruce Bowen was 100x time the defender DFS is. I think everyone in here completely overestimates DFS defense ability. He is a good, but not great defender, and definitely not one like Bruce Bowen. This is not a valid comparison at all.

DFS provides a lot of energy and value for money, but after WCF and to Finals, he will always count as negative. Always. Not saying a team with him cant win, if we are positive compared to opponents on other positions. Especially with Luka. But the team would greatly increase chances for a championship if we got a better quality player here.

DFS is not even close to being one of the best defenders in the league. He is a good defender, that's it. He is good shooter on open 3s - thats it. Its a huge advantage in Luka offense to get those opportunities. He cant create his own shot, he cant shoot covered by defenders, this is what you need to do in WCF and Finals if you want to contribute to winning and destroy the opponents gameplan. He cant distribute the ball around and make contested shots around the paint, which you need to do against the best teams.

All in all, im not saying we should get rid of DFS, that he is bad, he is a good player, he is better at that value than many other options, but it is clear to be a dynasty or championship team, you need a lot a lot more playmaking, bbIQ, and a lot more defense from your wing/PF. A championship team absolutely need to be composed of not only good, but great players, that can mess up opponents gameplans. DFS is not that player.

I don't remember saying DFS was as great a defender as Bowen.

The point is that every championship team has blue collar guys who bring value that doesn't show up on the stat sheet.

[ThisIStheYear]

True, DFS isn’t as good a defender, but he’s much better on offense than Bowen.  His contract is a steal.

[F Gump]

Kidd said it's

PG - Luka
SG - Dinwiddie
SF - DFS
PF - Wood
C -  Mcgee

So 4 changes in the starting lineup

Kidd listed out all 5 starting players? I guessed I missed that. I thought he only mentioned McGee and Dinwiddie, and was speaking from that basis.

[mvossman]

I disagree a little about “isn’t a drop off in any respect.” I think there are similarities between the players, but that each does some things way better than the other. 

But that’s not even the point. The comparison isn’t Brunson vs Dinwiddie. It’s Luka and Dinwiddie (or even Brunson, for that matter) with a dinosaur in the dunker’s spot vs. THEMSELVES last year after the Porzingis trade when they each feasted on the space Dallas had that other teams couldn’t match. THAT is why they got to the conference finals. 

If McGee is on the floor, his man will be near the paint at all times. This makes it soooooo much easier for the guy guarding Luka or Dinwiddie to handle them. NIGHT AND DAY DIFFERENT. Thats why “negative asset” Dinwiddie looked like a 6MOTY candidate pretty much right after coming here, because the system made his life so much easier. 

Further, if McGee is on the floor and you’re not using him as a screener, what DO you do with him? Nothing. He can’t stand in the corner - his man will clog the paint anyway and the ball will find him pointlessly. He can’t be a cutter, because his man will be in the paint already. Point being: it’s going to be Luka and new second option Javale McGee running pick and roll with hopeful star addition Wood standing above the break or in the corner getting bored, just like Porzingis did under Carlisle. Or, even worse - Luka/Wood running pnr with Wood at the extended free throw area with his hand up, literally blocking their path to the basket like Porzingis did for the first month of Kidd’s tenure. 

I’m getting more depressed the longer I type.

---

Btw, if this is really the direction they’re going, the Kokoskov exit is starting to make more sense to me.

I share your concerns.  Don't know why Din would start with McGee.  His game is much more effective in 5 out, especially when playing with Luka.  My biggest concern is that we are going with a traditional center model with McGee/Powell and playing Wood and Maxi primarily at the 4.  It would be a constant clogging of the lane taking away some of the best offensive options from both Wood and Dinwiddie, while taking away one of Maxi most useful qualities (allow us to go 5 out).  

I will feel way better about what we are trying to do if they send out Powell in a trade.  At that point it will be a max of 15-20 minutes of McGee, and most of that won't be with Wood or Maxi (who I think would be ideal playing together).

If we go into the season with McGee and Powell on the roster, I will be more disappointed in the kind of basketball we are playing than the fact we gave 3 years at over 5 mil pre to a mid 30s backup center who's last two coaches stopped playing in the playoffs.

[Tyler]

Kidd listed out all 5 starting players? I guessed I missed that. I thought he only mentioned McGee and Dinwiddie, and was speaking from that basis.

That's a fair point. Unless someone can point me to a full Kidd quote that proves otherwise, I believe you're correct that he's never publicly called Wood a starter. The full lineups I've seen spread on Twitter are just people filling in gaps with their own assumptions.

I'd be pretty surprised if Wood doesn't start, though.

[BolsDamols]

I think people are overlooking the Mavs quest to make Luka the first 6MOTY + MVP in league history

[F Gump]

That's a fair point. Unless someone can point me to a full Kidd quote that proves otherwise, I believe you're correct that he's never publicly called Wood a starter. The full lineups I've seen spread on Twitter are just people filling in gaps with their own assumptions.

I'd be pretty surprised if Wood doesn't start, though.

I certainly see how that would be possible, but from what is being said (and not said) so far, I'm more inclined to see Wood as the 1st sub off the bench at C when the season starts. And playing all his minutes at C.

[Branduil]

If the Mavs want Wood off the bench they should just trade him now, because he's gone in the offseason.

[KillerLeft]

If the Mavs want Wood off the bench they should just trade him now, because he's gone in the offseason.

Well, I for one certainly don’t believe it’s coincidence that the guy they chose to acquire via trade is on the last year of his contract. Let your imagination do with that suggestion what it will.

[F Gump]

If the Mavs want Wood off the bench they should just trade him now, because he's gone in the offseason.

I don't think that's true. You can still get your minutes and opportunities without starting. But a huge question mark on Wood has been whether he is more about team goals or himself, and that would certainly be a good way to ascertain his priorities.

[cow]

Well, I for one certainly don’t believe it’s coincidence that the guy they chose to acquire via trade is on the last year of his contract. Let your imagination do with that suggestion what it will.

Being on the last year of the deal is why they were able to afford him in the first place.  Wood is really talented but has a ton of red flags.  Turning a late pick and four guys that got next to no playing time into someone who will be in the rotation and has a lot of upside but you also don't have to commit too is smart.  I'm hoping he puts it all together and is a side benefit to the McGee signing as he struggled a lot for a lot of his 20s in the league.

[KillerLeft]

Being on the last year of the deal is why they were able to afford him in the first place. 

Disagree. I think every case is different, and in this one, Houston wanted to be out of the Wood business in order to make more opportunity for Sengun and the new guy. I think they would have gotten much less for him had he come with the strings of more guaranteed years. 

Now, if he is much more established and the teams looking to trade for him aren’t sure they can retain him, you might have a point. In Wood’s case, I think the onus is on him to earn offers next summer. I don’t think he’s guaranteed to get the kind of offers he wants without a good season (and not just on the court).

[cow]

Disagree. I think every case is different, and in this one, Houston wanted to be out of the Wood business in order to make more opportunity for Sengun and the new guy. I think they would have gotten much less for him had he come with the strings of more guaranteed years. 

Now, if he is much more established and the teams looking to trade for him aren’t sure they can retain him, you might have a point. In Wood’s case, I think the onus is on him to earn offers next summer. I don’t think he’s guaranteed to get the kind of offers he wants without a good season (and not just on the court).

You might be right.  Maybe Wood's run out of good graces in the league and isn't desirable.  Just dumping the four players we dumped is probably worth the first we paid.  Returning a rotation guy is a pretty big cherry on top, especially considering the talent level.  It's why I loved the move by the Mavs.  It's very moneyball.  

I personally am excited for Wood as he has a skillset that we haven't seen with Luka.  I think he's going to flourish.

[StepBackJay]

I don't think that's true. You can still get your minutes and opportunities without starting. But a huge question mark on Wood has been whether he is more about team goals or himself, and that would certainly be a good way to ascertain his priorities.

Dude he is starting

[KillerLeft]

You might be right.  Maybe Wood's run out of good graces in the league and isn't desirable.  Just dumping the four players we dumped is probably worth the first we paid.  Returning a rotation guy is a pretty big cherry on top, especially considering the talent level.  It's why I loved the move by the Mavs.  It's very moneyball.  

I personally am excited for Wood as he has a skillset that we haven't seen with Luka.  I think he's going to flourish.

I am excited about him, too. Don’t get me wrong. 

And I don’t know that it’s clear lowering future salary, either for a run at cap space or just to lower the future out-of-pocket for Cuban, was the goal here. But, I wouldn’t put it past him to think getting off of the meager amount of future (beyond this year) salary they did AND get one year of Wood for “only” a 1st is smart, even if the dude just walks (effectively making the luxury tax not an issue for quite a while).

Like, we all hope it works out and he’ll be re-signed, and if not, we’ll be disappointed. We assume they have the same hope, and maybe they do. But for Cuban, I’m starting to think the prospect of future benefits like that aren’t a hurdle these deals need to clear in order to motivate him to pull the trigger. I sure hope I’m wrong. I’m probably not articulating this fairly abstract thought clearly enough, but that’s for the best because in the headspace I have right now, it’s getting scarier with each passing second to be a Mavericks fan.

[cow]

I am excited about him, too. Don’t get me wrong. 

And I don’t know that it’s clear lowering future salary, either for a run at cap space or just to lower the future out-of-pocket for Cuban, was the goal here. But, I wouldn’t put it past him to think getting off of the meager amount of future (beyond this year) salary they did AND get one year of Wood for “only” a 1st is smart, even if the dude just walks (effectively making the luxury tax not an issue for quite a while).

Like, we all hope it works out and he’ll be re-signed, and if not, we’ll be disappointed. We assume they have the same hope, and maybe they do. But for Cuban, I’m starting to think future benefits like that are a hurdle these deals don’t need to clear in order to motivate him to pull the trigger. I sure hope I’m wrong. I’m probably not articulating this fairly abstract thought clearly enough, but that’s for the best because in the headspace I have right now, it’s getting scarier with each passing second to be a Mavericks fan.

I factor Mavs draft history in when I say "only a first".  Sad but true.  lol

[Smitty]

Don’t get attached to Christian Wood.

[Branduil]

I don't think that's true. You can still get your minutes and opportunities without starting. But a huge question mark on Wood has been whether he is more about team goals or himself, and that would certainly be a good way to ascertain his priorities.

Wood has openly talked about wanting to be an all-star. You don't get voted to the all-star game off the bench. Of course you want unselfish, team-oriented guys, but let's be honest, 99% of NBA players will still want their own accolades even if they are. It's rare to find guys happy to come off the bench, especially if they have a chip on their shoulder. I suspect the best way to get Wood to buy in will NOT be to stick him on the bench after he's been a 20/10 guy as a starter.

[KillerLeft]

I factor Mavs draft history in when I say "only a first".  Sad but true.  lol

Sorry, wasn’t meaning to add snark about your points with the quotation marks. It was snark directed at how they view first round pics, so kind of the point you are making above.

[cow]

Don’t get attached to Christian Wood.

I wonder who is winning the Vegas TDL odds for the Mavs:  Powell, THJ or Wood?