BRUNSON BURNER: to NYK for 4yrs/$104M (no SnT) | NYK docked 2025 2nd for tampering

[khaled1987]

https://twitter.com/ktfuntweets/status/1...3145720838

I am late to the party, but this feels like S & T is already discussed

[ItsGoTime]

Another thing to be said is, the narrative being pushed that we could have traded him at the TDL, while true, the trade could have happened as early as NY showed interest in making him their PG of the future. I think SH said that was reported as early as December. That’s plenty of remaining time in last season to extract a bit more for him in trade. Heck, NY could have come out on top of that too by extending him after the trade!


In the very beginning of last season, Kidd was quoted as saying JB is gonna get PAID. Something else to be added to this whole grieving process.

[KillerLeft]

I can't speak for anyone else, but I assumed (wrongly) that the Mavs would be competent enough to EITHER trade Brunson at the deadline OR offer the contract it would take to retain his services into the future. 

When the deadline came and went with him on the team, I never dreamed for a second they'd be incompetent enough to allow this third, dark outcome to transpire. 

And, I don't understand all of the chest thumping going on. We've read page after page of sign and trade possibilities which, while entertaining and from impressively knowledgeable and creative writers, aren't actually what seems likely to happen. So, what's with the "I told you so's?" 

NOBODY was saying "I think the Mavs are going to keep Brunson through the deadline and then allow him to bail on the team with nothing, not even minor assets, coming back. That will be fine." I don't think ANY of us were anything close to "right" about this.

[Winter]

NOBODY was saying "I think the Mavs are going to keep Brunson through the deadline and then allow him to bail on the team with nothing, not even minor assets, coming back. That will be fine." I don't think ANY of us were anything close to "right" about this.

True enough, but I think most of us were under the impression that it would be close to impossible to be outbid.

The reports now are that the Mavs simply didn't want to go over 106 million. See below. I guess Cuban can make a pitch with some incentives or something, but it still appears that the Mavs have a limit they don't want to go over... and NY is willing to beat. So I am not sure what will be different tomorrow. 

A league source tells Stefan Bondy of The New York Daily News that the Mavericks have been unwilling to offer more than $106MM to this point, with Brunson reportedly seeking $125MM. Haynes confirms Bondy’s report, stating that Dallas has pitched a five-year, $106MM deal to Brunson, so it sounds like he might be open take a slight per-year discount ($125MM over five years vs. $110MM over four) if the Mavs are willing to go that high using his bird Rights

[KillerLeft]

The reports now are that the Mavs simply didn't want to go over 106 million. See below. I guess Cuban can make a pitch with some incentives or something, but it still appears that the Mavs have a limit they don't want to go over... and NY is willing to beat. So I am not sure what will be different tomorrow. 

Yes, that's the conclusion we reached 24 hours ago. 

I agree, very unlikely Cuban raises his offer.

If your point is that the Mavs made a calculated risk (at the deadline) that no team would make Brunson an offer north of what they were comfortable offering him themselves, I agree. But, to my mind, that's a HUGE risk and a huge mistake. I could've told you then that NY would be able to clear enough space to make a huge offer, and Detroit, who had rumored interest at the time, already projected to have plenty of space.

[DanSchwartzgan]

And, I don't understand all of the chest thumping going on. We've read page after page of sign and trade possibilities which, while entertaining and from impressively knowledgeable and creative writers, aren't actually what seems likely to happen. So, what was the point of those? 

And all along the theory has been that ‘if’ NY needed to pay to move contracts, they would make that level of assets available to Dallas just as easily as they would a third team.  Turns out it was much easier to move multiple contracts than anyone imagined.

Every TDL and every summer many of us offer up all sorts of clever ideas and the team never does them.  I think the last time I nailed a trade it was Gary Trent (the original one).

[WildArkieBoy]

I am late to the party, but this feels like S & T is already discussed

About the Brunson/suitors meeting:

If Brunson is not embellishing things and the strategic plan of each franchise for "winning" is in play, something he wants articulated, spelled out and detailed, then I'd be more comfortable selling the Mavs' plan than the Knick's.

OK, you say I'm simply naive and that this is all about tampering coverup.  

So, Mark and Co., by agreeing to a meeting, are simply facilitating a Knick's coverup?

BTW, who do you prefer here as lead spokesperson, Cuban or Nico?

[ItsGoTime]

I can't speak for anyone else, but I assumed (wrongly) that the Mavs would be competent enough to EITHER trade Brunson at the deadline OR offer the contract it would take to retain his services into the future. 

When the deadline came and went with him on the team, I never dreamed for a second they'd be incompetent enough to allow this third, dark outcome to transpire. 

And, I don't understand all of the chest thumping going on. We've read page after page of sign and trade possibilities which, while entertaining and from impressively knowledgeable and creative writers, aren't actually what seems likely to happen. So, what was the point of those? 

NOBODY was saying "I think the Mavs are going to keep Brunson through the deadline and then allow him to bail on the team with nothing, not even minor assets, coming back. That will be fine." I don't think ANY of us were anything close to "right" about this.

For me, it’s not about chest thumping. It’s an attempt to alter the mindset of the reader to either read and react to what is being said (without you adding your own words to the thought) or, if you don’t understand, ask unassuming questions. I think disagreeing with DS’s thoughts as written would have been fine. Calling him a JB hater for thinking this outcome could have happened… not so much.


Assumption is so rampant on social media, there’s no need to bring it here!

[KillerLeft]

And all along the theory has been that ‘if’ NY needed to pay to move contracts, they would make that level of assets available to Dallas just as easily as they would a third team.  Turns out it was much easier to move multiple contracts than anyone imagined.

Every TDL and every summer many of us offer up all sorts of clever ideas and the team never does them.  I think the last time I nailed a trade it was Gary Trent (the original one).

Yeah, and to be clear, I'm not trying to dis the trade ideas. They're awesome, and we all love engaging on them. 

It's the "I told you so" element to this, which is probably unintended, that rubbed me the wrong way. Truly, I think the team would be better if you were running it.

---

I think disagreeing with DS’s thoughts as written would have been fine. Calling him a JB hater for thinking this outcome could have happened… not so much.

I have never done this, nor would I have ever.

[ItsGoTime]

I have never done this, nor would I have ever.

Sorry for giving the impression that you did. I have not seen you do it, but there are those here that have. It’s not really about changing your specific mindset either. You have a good handle on nuanced thoughts. You also don’t ask assuming questions, but there are those here that do.

[JBB]

Has anyone looked into the state income tax impacts of the differing offers between Mavs and Knicks?  I originally viewed the meeting as purely a way to avoid the tampering discussion, I don't think the Mavs would be sending such a strong representation party if it were just for show (especially Mark).  

PS first time poster moving over from another forum.  Nice activity level over here.

[KillerLeft]

Has anyone looked into the state income tax impacts of the differing offers between Mavs and Knicks?  I originally viewed the meeting as purely a way to avoid the tampering discussion, I don't think the Mavs would be sending such a strong representation party if it were just for show (especially Mark).  

PS first time poster moving over from another forum.  Nice activity level over here.

Welcome to our community. Jump in! 

I think the meeting can be for show from team Brunson's POV and viewed as a last chance from the Mavericks' POV. I don't think all parties have to hold the same view on how legit the meetings are in order for them to take place. 

For the Mavs' sake, I hope it's not a done deal and that Cuban has rethought his offer ceiling.

[cow]

New York has a sliding income tax scale that goes up to 8.2% which would only affect games you play at home  (you wouldn't pay income tax for away games against the Magic, Heat, Spurs, Mavs or Rockets.  And you'd pay whatever the income state tax is for away games against other teams).  For back of the napkin purpose just cut the salary and half and take 8%.

[Hypermav]

JB changes his mind and Dolan says "we respect that, I would hate to see anything bad happen to your dad."

[cow]

JB changes his mind and Dolan says "we respect that, I would hate to see anything bad happen to your dad."

[JBB]

New York has a sliding income tax scale that goes up to 8.2% which would only affect games you play at home  (you wouldn't pay income tax for away games against the Magic, Heat, Spurs, Mavs or Rockets.  And you'd pay whatever the income state tax is for away games against other teams).  For back of the napkin purpose just cut the salary and half and take 8%.

Thanks for this feedback. Back of napkin math computes to roughly a $4-5m swing in taxes between Texas and NY (based on rough total contractual numbers getting thrown around).  California teams and Nets push it slightly higher.

[Winter]

If your point is that the Mavs made a calculated risk (at the deadline) that no team would make Brunson an offer north of what they were comfortable offering him themselves, I agree. But, to my mind, that's a HUGE risk and a huge mistake.

Devil's advocate.... what was Mark going to say publicly? I mean what else could he say? He had to act as if the Mavs had the upper hand.

He screwed up. His best option coming into this 2 weeks ago was to say he was confident and not give NY any motivation or incentive to continue the pursuit. Of course they went balls out anyway and Cuban still looks like an idiot, but it's the only hand he had to play 2 weeks ago. No sense in behaving as if you lost back then. A little bluff is all he had. 

But the mistake was made months ago, and perhaps this outcome is no surprise to him now. We are at a point where Cuban can still sell his offer to the Brunson camp, or maybe up it a little. Good. Maybe it happens.

But part of it still feels like this another D. Jordan moment from years ago.... the one where the player increases the drama and then all eyes focus on Cuban... and the Mavs come away with zippo, and the organization has egg on its face.

[cow]

Devil's advocate.... what was Mark going to say publicly? I mean what else could he say? He had to act as if the Mavs had the upper hand.

He screwed up. His best option coming into this 2 weeks ago was to say he was confident and not give NY any motivation or incentive to continue the pursuit. Of course they went balls out anyway and Cuban still looks like an idiot, but it's the only hand he had to play 2 weeks ago. No sense in behaving as if you lost back then. A little bluff is all he had. 

But the mistake was made months ago, and perhaps this outcome is no surprise to him now. We are at a point where Cuban can still sell his offer to the Brunson camp, or maybe up it a little. Good. Maybe it happens.

But part of it still feels like this another D. Jordan moment from years ago.... the one where the player increases the drama and then all eyes focus on Cuban... and the Mavs come away with zippo, and organization looks like it was duped.

All we need are reports about Cuban driving around New York aimlessly trying unsuccessfully to call Jalen's cell.  

I don't think we are anywhere near that drama but what got the Mavs to this situation is worse and should be a major lesson for whoever is responsible for managing the cap and contract structures.  On the other hand, the Mavs draft so dismally that they probably never imagined Jalen would garner this type of contract which just moves the egg on their face from one side to another.

[Winter]

All we need are reports about Cuban driving around New York aimlessly trying unsuccessfully to call Jalen's cell.  

Perfect.

[Dirknows]

Why won’t Cuban just offer him 5/125 with a PO? This dude seriously doesn’t care about winning if he lets Brunson walk for nothing and it’s going to end up costing us Luka.