NEWS: Donnie out | Nico Harrison (Nike) as Pres/GM | Fin as VP | Dirk as Advisor

[cjeter24]

Somebody cheer me up please. 

What 
The
Hell

I saw your reply to Stein or Coop's tweet on Twitter and started to reply. I'm equally pissed. 

I honestly didn't think we'd ever reach the day where I've become indifferent on the Mavs because of a meddlesome owner that continues to mothball the team by poor decision making. I legit think Jerry Jones is a better owner than Mark at this point. Jerry don't try to hide it at least. He's literally the GM. 

Cuban is a rich guy playing fantasy sports and he sucks at it. I'm seriously so done with him. 
Ultimately I'll give Finley a chance because I think he could do a good job eventually. But I may have to dial back how much I care about the Mavs because Idk if I can handle the torture I get from Cuban being Cuban.

[KillerLeft]

Cuban is a rich guy playing fantasy sports and he sucks at it.

That sums up my POV on this, too. 

I'm sure there are other owners in sports who operate this same way, so it's not the absolute end of the world, but I do think we can stop hoping that switching Donnie out for someone else is going to fix all of this overnight.

[cow]

I'd take it farther.  Cuban might be fine at fantasy sports but in the real world, personal skills and relationships matter.  Cuban hasn't proven he's good at that aspect.  Seemingly one of his most trusted advisors (what about Bob) isn't any better.  Cuban could absolutely know what is best for the team as far as building around Luka is concerned but I don't have much faith in him executing that plan.  That puts him well behind the other Dallas owner that everyone likes to dunk on.

[DrMav]

I’m going to remain in denial for the moment and pretend all is going according to plan. I don’t want Ainge, and I think Ujiri is still under contract so it would make complete sense to deny going after him.

[cjeter24]

I’m going to remain in denial for the moment and pretend all is going according to plan. I don’t want Ainge, and I think Ujiri is still under contract so it would make complete sense to deny going after him.

It's not the name for me. I didn't want Ainge unless he reported to someone with a plan. He has absolutely no vision to build a team. Great GM otherwise. 

Ujiri was a long shot.

It's the fact that they aren't even letting the search firm do their job. They've already decided who they are hiring and it's a yes man and puppet for Mark to keep telling what to do. They clearly aren't changing a damn thing. It's just the same old setup with different names. And they'll expect different results. 

Heck I don't even care if Mark wants to be involved or have final sign off on some decisions. He's paying the bills so naturally he should have some say especially if it's something like going into the tax. That's normal. But being the de facto GM and having chaos underneath him is not normal. 

I really hope Finley does well and proves the doubters wrong. He needs to tell Cuban to shove it and let him do his job. But that doesn't seem like his personality. He seems like a really nice guy that will let Cuban run all over him.

[Scott41theMavs]

It's not the name for me. I didn't want Ainge unless he reported to someone with a plan. He has absolutely no vision to build a team. Great GM otherwise. 

Ujiri was a long shot.

It's the fact that they aren't even letting the search firm do their job. They've already decided who they are hiring and it's a yes man and puppet for Mark to keep telling what to do. They clearly aren't changing a damn thing. It's just the same old setup with different names. And they'll expect different results. 

Heck I don't even care if Mark wants to be involved or have final sign off on some decisions. He's paying the bills so naturally he should have some say especially if it's something like going into the tax. That's normal. But being the de facto GM and having chaos underneath him is not normal. 

I really hope Finley does well and proves the doubters wrong. He needs to tell Cuban to shove it and let him do his job. But that doesn't seem like his personality. He seems like a really nice guy that will let Cuban run all over him.

They haven't hired Finley yet.

[Tyler]

So here's where things appear to be headed in terms of responsibility (the official org chart is probably relatively flat between 1 and 3):

0. Owner: Mark. He gets the final say, just like any owner. 
1. CEO: Cynthia Marshall. She seems to handle stuff like marketing, public relations, HR, ticket sales, etc.
2. President of basketball operations: Finley. I see him overseeing stuff like the G-league, game scheduling, basketball personnel, legal issues, internal player discipline, etc. Important stuff, but less roster-based than some people think.
3. GM: TBD, and the primary target of the search firm. He'll be the main guy managing the roster, coaching staff, and I imagine the scouting department.
4. Coach: Mosley. The young and well-liked players coach who is due for a lead gig either here or elsewhere.

Personally, I don't think the news that Mark won't be hiring a guy like Masai or Ainge to do both 2 and 3 is surprising in the slightest. Not only do I think both guys are kinda overrated and full of themselves (if they're so indispensable, why do neither have contracts right now?), but I also don't think dividing those responsibilities between two voices is automatically a problem. 

The idea of Finley managing all of the basketball office stuff isn't even that big of a deal, as I think people are overthinking that role in terms of how it really affects the product on the floor. And internal or not, I think Mosley is a great coach and exactly the type of guy they should be looking for over other big-name retreads. I have no problem with him at all. So the key hire right now is the same one that we knew about from the moment Donnie was fired -- GM. Get the right guy in that position who has the required strategic basketball mind and connections around the league, and the entire front office team can work just fine. That's where an agent or a well-respected assistant GM would be a nice fit.

The wildcard to me is the unstated 5th spot:

5. Analytics: Voulgaris. The nerd who crunches all of the numbers looking for an edge.

I think Voulgaris needs to go. He may be smart, but he's undeniably an organizational cancer. I'll also believe he's not coming back only when I see them hire someone else for the job. Mark's silence on him right now speaks volumes, but I'm holding out hope that he's waiting to see if the new GM has another guy for the same role in mind before publicly pulling the plug.

So to sum it all up, I sorta see where Mark is going with this and am not the full doomer just yet. The key to making the team work is to hire a talented GM to focus primarily on the roster, and that's still on the table. And the key to making sure the internal bullshit is fixed is to officially remove Voulgaris from the organization. That's still TBD, and I'll reserve my right to hate on Mark if he doesn't make that change along with the next GM.

[Scott41theMavs]

So here's where things appear to be headed in terms of responsibility:

0. Owner: Mark. He gets the final say, just like any owner. 
1. CEO: Cynthia Marshall. She seems to handle stuff like marketing, public relations, HR, ticket sales, etc.
2. President of basketball operations: Finley. I see him overseeing stuff like the G-league, game scheduling, basketball personnel, legal issues, internal player discipline, etc. Important stuff, but less roster-based than some people think.
3. GM: TBD, and the primary target of the search firm. He'll be the main guy managing the roster, coaching staff, and I imagine the scouting department.
4. Coach: Mosley. The young and well-liked players coach who is due for a lead gig either here or elsewhere.

Personally, I don't think the news that Mark won't be hiring a guy like Masai or Ainge to do both 2 and 3 is surprising in the slightest. Not only do I think both guys are kinda overrated and full of themselves (if they're so indispensable, why do neither have contracts right now?), but I also don't think dividing those responsibilities between two voices is automatically a problem. 

The idea of Finley managing all of the basketball office stuff isn't even that big of a deal, as I think people are overthinking that role in terms of how it really affects the product on the floor. And internal or not, I think Mosley is a great coach and exactly the type of guy they should be looking for over other big-name retreads. I have no problem with him at all. So the key hire right now is the same one that we knew about from the moment Donnie was fired -- GM. Get the right guy in that position who has the required strategic basketball mind and connections around the league, and the entire front office team can work just fine. That's where an agent or a well-respected assistant GM would be a nice fit.

The wildcard to me is the unstated 5th spot:

5. Analytics: Voulgaris. The nerd who crunches all of the numbers looking for an edge.

I think Voulgaris needs to go. He may be smart, but he's undeniably an organizational cancer. I'll also believe he's not coming back only when I see them hire someone else for the job. Mark's silence on him right now speaks volumes, but I'm holding out hope that he's waiting to see if the new GM has another guy for the same role in mind before publicly pulling the plug.

So to sum it all up, I sorta see where Mark is going with this and am not the full doomer just yet. The key to making the team work is to hire a talented GM to focus primarily on the roster, and that's still on the table. And the key to making sure the internal bullshit is fixed is to officially remove Voulgaris from the organization. That's still TBD, and I'll reserve my right to hate on Mark if he doesn't make that change along with the next GM.

I like this take. Hopeful, but cautious.

[cjeter24]

They haven't hired Finley yet.

No but I'm pretty sure Mark knew he was hiring him the day he fired Donnie.

[Scott41theMavs]

No but I'm pretty sure Mark knew he was hiring him the day he fired Donnie.

Welp, we'll see. I like Tyler's idea of Finley being the Cynt of the basketball office and bringing in another guy to be the GM/basketball matters decision maker/negotiator.

[cjeter24]

So here's where things appear to be headed in terms of responsibility (the official org chart is probably relatively flat between 1 and 3):

0. Owner: Mark. He gets the final say, just like any owner. 
1. CEO: Cynthia Marshall. She seems to handle stuff like marketing, public relations, HR, ticket sales, etc.
2. President of basketball operations: Finley. I see him overseeing stuff like the G-league, game scheduling, basketball personnel, legal issues, internal player discipline, etc. Important stuff, but less roster-based than some people think.
3. GM: TBD, and the primary target of the search firm. He'll be the main guy managing the roster, coaching staff, and I imagine the scouting department.
4. Coach: Mosley. The young and well-liked players coach who is due for a lead gig either here or elsewhere.

Personally, I don't think the news that Mark won't be hiring a guy like Masai or Ainge to do both 2 and 3 is surprising in the slightest. Not only do I think both guys are kinda overrated and full of themselves (if they're so indispensable, why do neither have contracts right now?), but I also don't think dividing those responsibilities between two voices is automatically a problem. 

The idea of Finley managing all of the basketball office stuff isn't even that big of a deal, as I think people are overthinking that role in terms of how it really affects the product on the floor. And internal or not, I think Mosley is a great coach and exactly the type of guy they should be looking for over other big-name retreads. I have no problem with him at all. So the key hire right now is the same one that we knew about from the moment Donnie was fired -- GM. Get the right guy in that position who has the required strategic basketball mind and connections around the league, and the entire front office team can work just fine. That's where an agent or a well-respected assistant GM would be a nice fit.

The wildcard to me is the unstated 5th spot:

5. Analytics: Voulgaris. The nerd who crunches all of the numbers looking for an edge.

I think Voulgaris needs to go. He may be smart, but he's undeniably an organizational cancer. I'll also believe he's not coming back only when I see them hire someone else for the job. Mark's silence on him right now speaks volumes, but I'm holding out hope that he's waiting to see if the new GM has another guy for the same role in mind before publicly pulling the plug.

So to sum it all up, I sorta see where Mark is going with this and am not the full doomer just yet. The key to making the team work is to hire a talented GM to focus primarily on the roster, and that's still on the table. And the key to making sure the internal bullshit is fixed is to officially remove Voulgaris from the organization. That's still TBD, and I'll reserve my right to hate on Mark if he doesn't make that change along with the next GM.

Intersting take. 

Ujiri doesn't have a contract because he hasn't wanted to sign one.  He seems to like to play out his contract. And he gets paid alot so whatever he's been doing works for him financially.

I can certainly get behind Finley running the business side aspect and having someone else below him as the actual gm. Basically the power of the roster construction isn't the president of basketball ops like it has been but in the GM instead. 

If that's the case, then I'm ok with it. But nothing suggests that's the way Cuban plans on operating. 

Also as far as analytics, do we have other analytics guys? You should have an entire analytics department. And you should also have one for the business side.

---

Welp, we'll see. I like Tyler's idea of Finley being the Cynt of the basketball office and bringing in another guy to be the GM/basketball matters decision maker/negotiator.

I'm fine with. Not sure if I really like it but I can buy into that. 

Also how am I the one that thinks the sky is falling and you are the one that's calm? The sky is falling is your thing dang it! lol

[Scott41theMavs]

Cjeter, it seems from what we've heard that Cuban still wants a basketball mind to listen to. As long as the chain of command makes sense and there isn't the cluster of the past two years (and the incompetence of the prior years), this could turn out ok. Fingers crossed.

[Tyler]

I can certainly get behind Finley running the business side aspect and having someone else below him as the actual gm. Basically the power of the roster construction isn't the president of basketball ops like it has been but in the GM instead. 

If that's the case, then I'm ok with it. But nothing suggests that's the way Cuban plans on operating. 

To the contrary -- I think the evidence is there that this is exactly what Cuban is planning.

For reference, Donnie carried the dual titles of General Manager and President of Basketball Operations. Note that Marc Stein reported that Finley is being strongly considered for the President of Basketball Operations position and that Dallas plans to hire at least one external exec. The logical conclusion is that they're still actively looking for a GM.

But we'll see soon enough.

[cjeter24]

Cjeter, it seems from what we've heard that Cuban still wants a basketball mind to listen to. As long as the chain of command makes sense and there isn't the cluster of the past two years (and the incompetence of the prior years), this could turn out ok. Fingers crossed.

I'm worried Finley is the basketball mind. 
but more concerning there was clear dysfunction and poor structure in the front office here. And they are going to promote from within someone who has only known dysfunction and poor structure here. It's really hard to expect that changes. 

that's why we needed an outside voice in charge IMO.

---

To the contrary -- I think the evidence is there that this is exactly what Cuban is planning.

For reference, Donnie carried the dual titles of General Manager and President of Basketball Operations. Note that Marc Stein reported that Finley is being strongly considered for the President of Basketball Operations position and that Dallas plans to hire at least one external exec. The logical conclusion is that they're still actively looking for a GM.

But we'll see soon enough.

Man... I so hope you are right. I'm skeptical and disheartened as a fan right now. I'm having a hard time being optimistic about anything Mavs.

This week has been rough.

[Kammrath]

So here's where things appear to be headed in terms of responsibility (the official org chart is probably relatively flat between 1 and 3):

0. Owner: Mark. He gets the final say, just like any owner. 
1. CEO: Cynthia Marshall. She seems to handle stuff like marketing, public relations, HR, ticket sales, etc.
2. President of basketball operations: Finley. I see him overseeing stuff like the G-league, game scheduling, basketball personnel, legal issues, internal player discipline, etc. Important stuff, but less roster-based than some people think.
3. GM: TBD, and the primary target of the search firm. He'll be the main guy managing the roster, coaching staff, and I imagine the scouting department.
4. Coach: Mosley. The young and well-liked players coach who is due for a lead gig either here or elsewhere.

Personally, I don't think the news that Mark won't be hiring a guy like Masai or Ainge to do both 2 and 3 is surprising in the slightest. Not only do I think both guys are kinda overrated and full of themselves (if they're so indispensable, why do neither have contracts right now?), but I also don't think dividing those responsibilities between two voices is automatically a problem. 

The idea of Finley managing all of the basketball office stuff isn't even that big of a deal, as I think people are overthinking that role in terms of how it really affects the product on the floor. And internal or not, I think Mosley is a great coach and exactly the type of guy they should be looking for over other big-name retreads. I have no problem with him at all. So the key hire right now is the same one that we knew about from the moment Donnie was fired -- GM. Get the right guy in that position who has the required strategic basketball mind and connections around the league, and the entire front office team can work just fine. That's where an agent or a well-respected assistant GM would be a nice fit.

The wildcard to me is the unstated 5th spot:

5. Analytics: Voulgaris. The nerd who crunches all of the numbers looking for an edge.

I think Voulgaris needs to go. He may be smart, but he's undeniably an organizational cancer. I'll also believe he's not coming back only when I see them hire someone else for the job. Mark's silence on him right now speaks volumes, but I'm holding out hope that he's waiting to see if the new GM has another guy for the same role in mind before publicly pulling the plug.

So to sum it all up, I sorta see where Mark is going with this and am not the full doomer just yet. The key to making the team work is to hire a talented GM to focus primarily on the roster, and that's still on the table. And the key to making sure the internal bullshit is fixed is to officially remove Voulgaris from the organization. That's still TBD, and I'll reserve my right to hate on Mark if he doesn't make that change along with the next GM.

Good stuff. This is really what I have been trying to get at. Appreciate you taking the time to articulate it so well.

Where you and I diverge is on Voulgaris. I am not convinced he is the cancer that he has been painted to be. No question the reporting speaks to him being a terrible people person, but I am not convinced one bit that he is the source of the dysfunction. I still think much of that could (not certain) have come from Donnie and RC. So I am still "wait and see" on Voulgaris. And I think Cuban would be really smart to KEEP him and HIDE him if he is actually good at his analytics side of things. Only Cuban really knows what Voulgaris has been suggesting over these years, and maybe most of his suggestions have been gold, but others have been sabotaging them.

[fifteenth]

Yeah,  I'm having fun with my pitchfork,  but Tyler's is probably a reasonable way to think.

[cow]

While not unreasonable, the person they hire from the outside better be able to recruit and whip the organization into shape when it comes to drafting.  Status quo isn't good enough.

[omahen]

Initial message is certainly not good. On the contrary, the message is everything was fine and we continue this way. That outside person you cling on so much hope will obviously have little power.

[Branduil]

As I said before, there is no way Bob is such an irreplaceable genius that it outweighs the negative aspects of him being hated by most of the organization.

[DanSchwartzgan]

So here's where things appear to be headed in terms of responsibility (the official org chart is probably relatively flat between 1 and 3):
 
So to sum it all up, I sorta see where Mark is going with this and am not the full doomer just yet. The key to making the team work is to hire a talented GM to focus primarily on the roster, and that's still on the table. And the key to making sure the internal bullshit is fixed is to officially remove Voulgaris from the organization. That's still TBD, and I'll reserve my right to hate on Mark if he doesn't make that change along with the next GM.

As they say, it is an upgrade-game.  At the end of the day, is all of this an upgrade?  We don't know yet.  Better soft skills and worse X's and O's from Mosley could be an upgrade.  A more clearly defined hierarchy and youthful energy might supersede Donnie's vast experience.  Maybe not.  I'm at least willing to wait for the actual announcements.

But, in the end, it all comes down to 0. Owner: Mark.  I don't buy the criticism that "he's not a basketball guy".  After 21 years of this, he's a basketball guy.  The question is whether he's a good one or not.  If he's going to make all major decisions, then quit hiding behind this veil of secrecy about how decisions are made.  Man up and take responsibility for the good and the bad.   I think being the money guy and the vision/strategy guy and the spreadsheet guy and a fan and the person through whom most media inquiries flow directly is self limiting.  

My hope in all of this is Cuban upgrades himself by narrowing his role to whatever he's best at and hires the rest of it out.  I have serious doubts as to whether vision/strategy guy is the right answer.  He appears to hold to certain philosophies that haven't been productive.  Undervaluing the draft and this constant pursuit of Sammie Superstar is killing us.  Singles and doubles would be much better than striking out because you are trying so hard to exclusively hit home runs.  Where would we be if someone had convinced him that we should actually use resources the last two summers rather than chase Giannis (hint...probably still playing).  Atlanta and Phoenix are still playing and we are not partially because we kept our powder dry while they went out and got Paul and Crowder and Gallinari and Bogdanovic and Lou Williams and Torrey Craig to supplement the core that was already there.  That isn't just a failing on Donnie's part.  It is a failing of vision and strategy.  The madness has to stop.