TRADE: Davis, Hardy, DLO, Exum to WAS | Middleton, filler, 2 FRPs, 3 SRPs to DAL

[Nowitzki Way]

No on else seems to be saying it. This was a terrible trade from an assets standpoint. The players we got back are trash. The picks are trash. Fake 1sts.

I was all on board getting rid of AD, but this was a salary dump. I hope they have plans for that cap space.

[mvossman]

No on else seems to be saying it. This was a terrible trade from an assets standpoint. The players we got back are trash. The picks are trash.  Fake 1sts. 

I was all on board getting rid of AD, but this was a salary dump. I hope they have plans for that cap space.

70 mil in cap relief is an asset.  I agree it matters what they do with it, but when you see teams pay significant assets to get out of 5 or 6 mil, its hard to quantify what it means to go from over apron 2 to well under the cap line.

[KillerLeft]

No on else seems to be saying it. This was a terrible trade from an assets standpoint. The players we got back are trash. The picks are trash.  Fake 1sts. 

I was all on board getting rid of AD, but this was a salary dump. I hope they have plans for that cap space.

Oh, it was absolutely a salary dump, but one of the better ones I've seen, and a better one than I had come to expect. 

I find it funny that people's noses are turned up soooo much about the picks. 1sts, 2nds. whatever. There are 5 more picks in the chest than there were yesterday, including a 2nd pick in the upcoming draft a lifetime everyone is talking about. Can that be used to move up just a little from wherever their own pick lands? Maybe. Can they find another Brunson type with it? Maybe. 

I get that they aren't even close to premium picks, but yesterday people were convinced AD wouldn't fetch a single pick, and not only did he go for expiring contracts, but WAS ate a TON of money on THIS YEAR'S payroll...AND they got 5 picks. You normally have to pay draft capital to pull off a deal like this. I don't know if it was the right move, but I do think it marked a higher value for AD than what this board had convinced itself was factual, and I for one am happy to be out from under the worry of him being hurt all the time. In a sense, it's just nice to have this Luka trade chapter behind us, to whatever extent that will ever be possible.

[Mavs2021]

No on else seems to be saying it. This was a terrible trade from an assets standpoint. The players we got back are trash. The picks are trash.  Fake 1sts. 

I was all on board getting rid of AD, but this was a salary dump. I hope they have plans for that cap space.

You mean it´s not the Pelicans 1st, Cavs 1st, Risacher, Okungwu, cap relief and two unprotected future 1sts, which I heard was the realistic AD value.

[cow]

You mean it´s not the Pelicans 1st, Cavs 1st, Risacher, Okungwu, cap relief and two unprotected future 1sts, which I heard was the realistic AD value.

To play devil's advocate, we'll probably know what the realistic value of AD was based on our subpar front office.  Davis has no doubt been a medical disaster in Dallas and combined with the baggage attached to the Luka trade, we certainly sold him at an all time low.  Could that value have been rehabbed if we waited?  Certainly, but it could have gone the opposite direction too.  And speaking of our subpar front office, they have a lot of work to do to make this trade a success.  If they can get enough assets to get us into the top six pick this year should the ping pong gods not favor us (likely), that would be a good start.

[SleepingHero]

No on else seems to be saying it. This was a terrible trade from an assets standpoint. The players we got back are trash. The picks are trash.  Fake 1sts. 

I was all on board getting rid of AD, but this was a salary dump. I hope they have plans for that cap space.

The GSW pick is 100% a fake first.

Top 20 protected and if not conveyed it becomes a 2nd.

The Thunder pick is a first, just a low one. In this draft I'm fine with that. Especially since its ammo that can be used to potentially move up. 

I'm sure the Thunder would be VERY interested in their own FRP back plus a very distant FRP for one of their myriad of picks this year. They just don't have the roster spots and the 30th pick salary is the cheapest possible salary you can get in the first round. 

Their Philly pick stands out at #18 currently. But truthfully somethings gotta give. They have 12, 18, and 37 in this years draft as it stands.

[Mavs2021]

To play devil's advocate, we'll probably know what the realistic value of AD was based on our subpar front office.  Davis has no doubt been a medical disaster in Dallas and combined with the baggage attached to the Luka trade, we certainly sold him at an all time low.  Could that value have been rehabbed if we waited?  Certainly, but it could have gone the opposite direction too.  And speaking of our subpar front office, they have a lot of work to do to make this trade a success.  If they can get enough assets to get us into the top six should the ping pong gods not favor us (likely), that would be a good start.

I´m just having a little fun with the lecturer that was convinced that AD was this massive trade chip.  

I agree that the next moves will ultimately determine the true value of the AD trade. I also floated the idea to wait out the Cavs/LeBron summer situation and I would not be shocked at all, if Washington moved AD to Cleveland for better assets in the summer.

Nevertheless if we can get Kuminga for Klay (which should now be legal), two 1st round picks for Poeltl, and at least on paper Thunder and AJ Johnson are 1st round picks, too. Then you could argue you achieved absolute max cap relief, test drive two former 1st rounders with relative little exposure and you get three 1st round cracks all at the future cost of Poeltl. Let´s not forget we were arguing about AD for Quickley + Poeltl straight up recently.

Funny enough I´m pretty sure I did the Middleton trade at some point as a throw away idea.

[cow]

I´m just having a little fun with the lecturer that was convinced that AD was this massive trade chip.  

I agree that the next moves will ultimately determine the true value of the AD trade. I also floated the idea to wait out the Cavs/LeBron summer situation and I would not be shocked at all, if Washington moved AD to Cleveland for better assets in the summer.

Nevertheless if we can get Kuminga for Klay (which should now be legal), two 1st round picks for Poeltl, and at least on paper Thunder and AJ Johnson are 1st round picks, too. Then you could argue you achieved absolute max cap relief, test drive two former 1st rounders with relative little exposure and you get three 1st round cracks all at the future cost of Poeltl. Let´s not forget we were arguing about AD for Quickley + Poeltl straight up recently.

Funny enough I´m pretty sure I did the Middleton trade at some point as a throw away idea.

I don't know Toronto's pick situation, but their own FRPs probably aren't attractive enough to take on Poeltl's contract numbers as F Gump laid out.  Me and Gump on the same page over and over again means the world is ending.

I get wanting to be out of the AD business, but be careful with the victory laps.  Plan Powder wasn't all that long ago either, so it's hard to get excited.  We still need a GM and get rid of Kidd before I'm ready to buy in an MBT3.0.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

No on else seems to be saying it. This was a terrible trade from an assets standpoint. The players we got back are trash. The picks are trash.  Fake 1sts. 

I was all on board getting rid of AD, but this was a salary dump. I hope they have plans for that cap space.

Yes, it was.  And I love it.

[Dirknows]

I don't know Toronto's pick situation, but their own FRPs probably aren't attractive enough to take on Poeltl's contract numbers as F Gump laid out.  Me and Gump on the same page over and over again means the world is ending.

I get wanting to be out of the AD business, but be careful with the victory laps.  Plan Powder wasn't all that long ago either, so it's hard to get excited.  We still need a GM and get rid of Kidd before I'm ready to buy in an MBT3.0.

Things can change quickly in the NBA. I wouldn't be asking about this years pick from Toronto, but who knows what they'll be next year or 2 years from now. Remember, a part of OKC building their chest of draft picks by taking on bad players and contracts or facilitating trades.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

To play devil's advocate, we'll probably know what the realistic value of AD was based on our subpar front office.  Davis has no doubt been a medical disaster in Dallas and combined with the baggage attached to the Luka trade, we certainly sold him at an all time low.  Could that value have been rehabbed if we waited?  Certainly, but it could have gone the opposite direction too.  

We've been waiting for 8 months and his value has continued to go down.

There's like a 10% chance AD would ever have value again.  Stay healthy all offseason.  Stay healthy training camp.  Stay healthy for 40-50 games next year.  Play at an All-Star level until next year's trade deadline.

Yall really wanted to Sit around with your fingers crossed for another 12 months while your franchise is being held hostage?

[myconsumerclub]

A $20.8 million trade exception (TPE) in the NBA allows a team over the salary cap to acquire a player (or players) earning up to $20.800001 million ($20.8M + $1) in a single transaction without sending back matching salary. This exception must be used within one year of its creation and cannot be combined with players or other exceptions to acquire a higher-salaried player.

Key Aspects of a 20.8M Trade Exception:
Capacity: The team can absorb one or more players whose total combined incoming salary does not exceed the TPE amount.
Usage: It is most commonly used to trade for players on similar or smaller contracts, such as $18M–$20M, or to take on "bad" contracts from other teams in exchange for draft picks.
Restrictions: It cannot be used to sign free agents.
Partial Use: If the full $20.8M is not used, the remainder can, in some cases, be used on another player, depending on the specific transaction rules.
Essentially, the team acts as a "bank" for that amount, allowing them to add salary to their cap sheet that they wouldn't normally be able to.

[Smitty]

I was all on board getting rid of AD, but this was a salary dump. I hope they have plans for that cap space.

Salary dump? No. The same team made a trade for Young and Davis. Just look at the two deals and determine which was a pure “salary dump”.

[Mavs2021]

I don't know Toronto's pick situation, but their own FRPs probably aren't attractive enough to take on Poeltl's contract numbers as F Gump laid out.  Me and Gump on the same page over and over again means the world is ending.

I get wanting to be out of the AD business, but be careful with the victory laps.  Plan Powder wasn't all that long ago either, so it's hard to get excited.  We still need a GM and get rid of Kidd before I'm ready to buy in an MBT3.0.

To be honest, I consider the Raptors success flukey. I think their picks will never be much worse than 20th, cause the roster simply does not have that much current or future upside. In the pre-season the Raptors were projected for 39.5 wins, which is a lottery team in the current East standings. I rate their own picks.

I´m willing to hear out the whole TPE scenarios. What´s your ideas? The thing is only valid for 12 months that realistically means NOW, the summer or at much deteriorated last minute value at the next trade deadline.

Say you wait 12 months and then take on a bad contract with three years left. Then it´s the same as doing Poeltl now, whose final year is only partially guaranteed. In two years you can move on from Poeltl´s contract already as a semi-expiring. 

I think going the other way and trading future assets to facilitate a mid-level talent like Mathurin right now is making the Porzingis trade all over again. You don´t even know what exactly is needed around Cooper and who his #2 star going to be. I´d rather have Poeltl and the 19th pick and a future 1st than giving up three 2nd rounders to get Mathurin at the same salary.

[F Gump]

I'm probably on an island, but I'm really good with Kidd as the coach here for an extended stretch. I think he's been really good at developing younger talent (if you give him some talent to work with), and the Mavs road ahead will depend heavily on finding young guys with raw skill who can be turned into very good rotation pieces.

The Mavs still need a wayyyyyyyyy better scouting and GL team. They have remained fairly abysmal in that area. Their draft skills outside the lottery have remained horrendous, and they need to get the raw talent, overlooked by others, if they are to create useful players from nothing. The Legends are still useless. Cuban gave those disciplines no attention or money, or talented personnel to make things happen and it doesn't seem to have changed.

Kidd as a GM type, running that end of things? Not interested at all. But I don't see anything that truly has pointed to that outcome as something on the horizon.

[Scott41theMavs]

Oh, it was absolutely a salary dump, but one of the better ones I've seen, and a better one than I had come to expect. 

I find it funny that people's noses are turned up soooo much about the picks. 1sts, 2nds. whatever. There are 5 more picks in the chest than there were yesterday, including a 2nd pick in the upcoming draft a lifetime everyone is talking about. Can that be used to move up just a little from wherever their own pick lands? Maybe. Can they find another Brunson type with it? Maybe. 

I get that they aren't even close to premium picks, but yesterday people were convinced AD wouldn't fetch a single pick, and not only did he go for expiring contracts, but WAS ate a TON of money on THIS YEAR'S payroll...AND they got 5 picks. You normally have to pay draft capital to pull off a deal like this. I don't know if it was the right move, but I do think it marked a higher value for AD than what this board had convinced itself was factual, and I for one am happy to be out from under the worry of him being hurt all the time. In a sense, it's just nice to have this Luka trade chapter behind us, to whatever extent that will ever be possible.

Cow was talking about our "sub-par front office." What about our FO when we hire a real GM? He'll have the flexibility to do something really savvy. If he doesn't make hay with it, that would indicate they hired the wrong guy.

[Mavs2021]

Even when the Mavs trade half the roster one player in inevitable.

[DL2RimRocker]

The GSW pick is 100% a fake first.

Top 20 protected and if not conveyed it becomes a 2nd.

The Thunder pick is a first, just a low one. In this draft I'm fine with that. Especially since its ammo that can be used to potentially move up. 

I'm sure the Thunder would be VERY interested in their own FRP back plus a very distant FRP for one of their myriad of picks this year. They just don't have the roster spots and the 30th pick salary is the cheapest possible salary you can get in the first round. 

Their Philly pick stands out at #18 currently. But truthfully somethings gotta give. They have 12, 18, and 37 in this years draft as it stands.

Wonder if another trade is in the works.

Would Naji/Gaff/BWill/DP for Hartenstein/12/18/37 be a decent deal?

Not sure it would work out salary wise. OKC is looking for cheaper starting caliber center.

[SleepingHero]

Wonder if another trade is in the works.

Would Naji/Gaff/BWill/DP for Hartenstein/12/18/37 be a decent deal?

Not sure it would work out salary wise. OKC is looking for cheaper starting caliber center.

Pretty sure this deal works just fine with just Gafford+Naji and no need to include B-Willl/DP. 

And if this deal is on the table I am smashing 100% yes. 

Imagine we get #7. I'd like to imagine 7/12/30 gets you either the 4th or 5th pick on draft night.

[Scott41theMavs]

Wonder if another trade is in the works.

Would Naji/Gaff/BWill/DP for Hartenstein/12/18/37 be a decent deal?

Not sure it would work out salary wise. OKC is looking for cheaper starting caliber center.

It works financially, but not sure why OKC would do it.