GAME 20: GSW (11-11) @ DAL (10-10) | 116-113 win

[dirkfansince1998]

Pretty sure I don't like the anti-Dinwiddie talk in the thread tonight.

As one of the leaders of the +/- fanclub on this board it is hard to argue that SD or at least lineups that feature SD aren´t a problem. Dead last in on/off and really bad next to Luka.

[Chicagojk]

Entertaining game.  Luka Great.  Green Great.  And a welcome appearance by Hardaway.

The missed free throws is going to be a killer though.   Those are winning plays the Mavs constantly leave points on the table.  

I thought the third quarter was going to be the reason we lost the game.  Our offense was humming but it seemed like Golden State was getting very easy baskets on the other end of the court.   With how we scored in the third, we should have been able to build a cushion.

As much as the Luka isolation offense is tough to watch at times, the Dinwiddie pounding the ball offense when Luka rests is really, really tough.   The definitely need another creator to play with Dinwiddie at times.  Who loses those minutes though?   I think Dinwiddie is best playing off a lead creator.  

I know Bullock does things that may not show up in the stat sheet, but man has he been brutal.   It was certainly a nice addition to have Hardaway 22 points instead of the 3 from Bullock in the starting lineup.  Lets see if Tim can build off that performance.   I thought he took good shots mostly tonight.  Maybe that is playing with Luka where he doesn't need to create much.  

Very fun game and a much needed win.   Although, I feel pretty confident who the better team is between those two teams .

[Reunion Mav]

Yes you can’t take away the Title of better team from Golden State after one game but you have to start somewhere. However, how about best player? Luka made a big statement tonight and has been doing so all year.

[KillerLeft]

As one of the leaders of the +/- fanclub on this board it is hard to argue that SD or at least lineups that feature SD aren´t a problem. Dead last in on/off and really bad next to Luka.

It's just that he's not playing the role he's meant to play. He has had two good stretches, one in Brooklyn and here, after the trade deadline last year. What they have in common is him coming off the bench. 

I honestly thought he had a shot at 6th man of the year coming into the season. He was PERFECT for this team in that role. 

Instead, they're trying to make Hardaway and Wood into that, and for differing reasons I don't think either of them is well suited for it.

[omahen]

Fun game to watch. Unfortunately it takes Luka in God mode for Mavs to register a win. THJ and Green were excellent and still Mavs needed GSW to shoot 25 % from three to barely win it. Unfortunatelly, Luka with such a heavy workload is not sustainable. I am affraid he will get worn out by Christmas and just can't see how bad would Mavs look if he gets injured.

[SleepingHero]

I think it's pretty bad our major offseason addition that we targeted specifically to help in the matchup against a team like GSW went out and shot 2-12 and was pretty much horrid all night.

Wood missed by my count 8 defensive rotations. I stopped counting after the 3rd quarter. Dude was out of it. 


Only bringing this up because it worries me the guy we got to punish teams trying to use Looney as a viable option couldn't really capitalize all night.

[MrGoat]

As one of the leaders of the +/- fanclub on this board it is hard to argue that SD or at least lineups that feature SD aren´t a problem. Dead last in on/off and really bad next to Luka.

Preach. The refs actually saved us by giving Dinwiddie that BS ejection which led to Luka coming back in earlier than normal. He had already help turn our lead at the end of the 3rd quarter into a deficit by that point.

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I think it's pretty bad our major offseason addition that we targeted specifically to help in the matchup against a team like GSW went out and shot 2-12 and was pretty much horrid all night.

Wood missed by my count 8 defensive rotations. I stopped counting after the 3rd quarter. Dude was out of it. 


Only bringing this up because it worries me the guy we got to punish teams trying to use Looney as a viable option couldn't really capitalize all night.

McGee was actually the addition we picked up almost specifically for Golden State. Kind of surprised we didn't use him at all considering this was the team we literally signed him to play against

[omahen]

Luka buldozed Powell on that first action in the clip

Luka Doncic (41 points, triple-double) Highlights vs. Golden State Warriors - YouTube

[dirkfansince1998]

Rewatched the last 5 minutes. Maxi doesn´t get enough credit for his defense. No suprise that the Mavs couldn´t close games without him. His ability to switch is key for the Mavs clutch defense. Would feel a lot better about this team if they had another Maxi-like big instead of McGee.

[Chicagojk]

Rewatched the last 5 minutes. Maxi doesn´t get enough credit for his defense. No suprise that the Mavs couldn´t close games without him. His ability to switch is key for the Mavs clutch defense. Would feel a lot better about this team if they had another Maxi-like big instead of McGee.

Yeah, those are hard to find though.   It again leaves us over reliant on a over 30 injury concern role player.    

I just don't know what the end game of this roster is.   Is that type of play going to work to win one playoff series?   What is frustrating to me is we have seen how Dwight is limited starting in playoff series.   Are we just going down this route because at least he cares and plays hard and will be fine in the regular season?   I have not come to a final conclusion but I actually think Kidd may be right and Wood needs to be a high minute scoring bench player on good teams.   It is just the rest of our front court is so limited.   I really have no idea what we should do.   I would like to see Wood get 10 plus starts so we can get better answers before we decide one way or the other.

[ItsGoTime]

Luka buldozed Powell on that first action in the clip

Luka Doncic (41 points, triple-double) Highlights vs. Golden State Warriors - YouTube

Watch Powell as he goes down. He turns around with his hands up looking at the ref as if to say, call the foul. Guess he wasn’t aware it was Luka that put him there.

[DanSchwartzgan]

What a difference a game makes.  New starters with THJ got smoked against the Bucks, but looked really good last night.  Josh/Maxi were in the closing lineup both halves last night.  Josh has been closing second quarters and often plays late into the fourth, but actually closing the game has been rare for him.  Maybe SD’s flagrant was fortuitous and foreshadows things to come.  Of course, it also meant Luka had to re-enter the game in the fourth earlier than usual and that helped also.  I personally wish Luka would exit with about two minutes left in the third and come back earlier in the fourth every game.

When Tim is hitting shots, I really like getting him away from Wood, SD and Josh (don’t want him at all when he isn’t hitting shots).  As Kamm has pointed out, it is also nice to break up DFS, RBJr and Dinwiddie.  Lineups are basically divided into four parts each half.  1. Starters, 2. Luka w/Bench, 3. SD w/Bench and the closing six minutes of the half.  All sorts of strange things happen in that final grouping, but it is those 12 minutes that tell you who Kidd prioritizes.  Last night the players who got over 20 minutes were Luka, THJ, DFS, Green, Wood, Maxi and Dinwiddie.  That feels about right for a top seven.  THJ won’t always be that good and Wood won’t always be as bad as he was last night.

The trick is finding combinations that work for those segments.  I don’t think who starts is nearly as important as the groups working well and setting things up so the right people are available to finish halves.  Kidd continues to ‘sneak’ a few minutes for Wood without Maxi or Powell each half and those minutes continue to be consistently unproductive.  He clearly isn’t ready to make Wood a stand-alone center for major minutes, but that stance forces Powell (or McGee) to be the only big in lineups when they are in.  Powell’s On-Minus-Off is fantastic in limited minutes, but there is high variability to the results. I can’t imagine swapping THJ for Bullock is going to ‘unlock’ a more consistent Powell.  

So, the question is whether Powell, DFS, THJ, SD and Luka can hold serve for the first 6 minutes of each half (and anytime we contemplate a Powell-based starting lineup, there is the question of regular season versus playoffs).  Swapping Green for SD would help the group defensively.  But, Green has been critical to making other groupings work and simply swapping THJ/Green for SD/Bullock probably doesn’t give you enough creation on the floor.  Swapping Wood for Powell is just not going to happen.  It just isn’t.  The question then becomes leave Wood as a super sub or completely redo the starting lineup to include Maxi/Wood.  That takes Maxi out of closing games and that isn’t going to happen either.  So, Kidd will keep playing around the edges IMHO.  He seems to have gotten on the Green bandwagon somewhat.  Time will tell if THJ starting makes that group work consistently and if, by extension, the Maxi/Wood/Green/Bullock/Ball-Handler lineups will be better served by removing a guy in THJ that needs (or certainly takes) a lot of shots.  I’m actually hopeful we give this a run for about 10-15 games.  As long as Maxi, DFS, Green and Luka are closing, I don’t really care who the fifth guy is.  So, figure a way to make the other segments work that sets things up to where that four can finish halves consistently and start to get a good feel for playing together.

[Kammrath]

What a difference a game makes.

I appreciate your analysis, but I think all of it is muted by the fact that Luka was +41 on/off last night (+22 on, -19 off). It was such a herculean, GOAT type of performance that I am not sure what we can learn about the lineups and rotations unless Luka somehow plays like that every game in the regular season (yeah right!). 

I think this team still has massive problems and the coaching is doing it no favors. 

I did like two major things:
1) Breaking up SD/DFS/RB, like you said (good coaching there....finally).
2) Closing with JG and not SD (not sure Kidd will ever make that choice with SD available). 

The only way forward to true improvement as a team is through Wood and JG. If Kidd is not going to go there, then this team is going to need Luka to play like he did last night for things to get any better. And even with Luka's performance the Mavs BARELY won and were LUCKY to get out of there with a win.

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

And even with Luka's performance the Mavs BARELY won

What I don't understand about this line of thinking is the fact that we did this against the reigning champs and when push comes to shove in the playoffs we know that we'll need Luka to play like an All NBA talent to win.  This is the formula.

[Kammrath]

What I don't understand about this line of thinking is the fact that we did this against the reigning champs and when push comes to shove in the playoffs we know that we'll need Luka to play like an All NBA talent to win.  This is the formula.

GSW shot 25% from three. And Luka played maybe the best two-way game I have EVER seen from him. And the Mavs won by three...at HOME...giving up a wide open three look to one of the best shooters of all time. 

If that is the formula, then the Mavs are not going to be contenders and win these kind of games very often.

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

GSW shot 25% from three. And Luka played maybe the best two-way game I have EVER seen from him. And the Mavs won by three...at HOME...giving up a wide open three look to one of the best shooters of all time. 

If that is the formula, then the Mavs are not going to be contenders and win these kind of games very often.

Or you can look at it as the Mavs beating a title contender who's best player gave you his best punch.  There's no pictures in the record books so I'm going to take this much needed tally in the left column in November when this team looked down and out.

[DanSchwartzgan]

2) Closing with JG and not SD (not sure Kidd will ever make that choice with SD available). 

The change is already happening, just not as obvious as last night.  Josh has been finishing the second quarter more lately.  More importantly, Kidd brings him back for a second run in the second half.  I don’t recall it getting all the way to the end of the game, but I do recall it getting all the way to the final 2-3 minutes on more than one occasion.  The process is a dimmer, not a light switch.

[dirkfansince1998]

Adjustments are definitely going in the right direction. Outside of a completly new starting five that features Wood and Kleber that´s the only remaining move I see.

Against the Warriors we had:

Doncic 39
SD 23
THJ 31
DFS 29
Powell 18

Green 27
Bullock 14
Bertans 7
Kleber 25
Wood 26

THJ will only get 30+ minutes on a hot shooting night. On average it should be closer to 25. With DFS playing 30+ minutes and a non-ejected SD getting some of THJs minutes. Green should be getting 25-30 minutes. Don´t really care about the starting spot as long as he closes games more often than not. If the SD minutes continue to hurt the Mavs moving him to a 6th man role and starting Green is the next logical move.

Personally I would remove Bullock from the rotation and split his minutes between Frank (new in the rotation) and Bertans. Really liked what I saw from Bertans in the last few games. Frank can give the Mavs 5-10 minutes against the opposing teams best ballhandler.

Would be great to reduce Luka´s minutes but right now I just don´t see a way.

Looking at the bigs we have 60-70 minutes between Kleber, Wood and Powell. Unless Wood´s ability/willingness to play defense improves Maxi is still my number one option to close games. With the option to play Wood/Kleber if the matchup allows it. Powell has earned the token starter spot and is giving the Mavs good minutes. Thankfully McGee is out of the rotation.

Something like...

Doncic 36
SD 28
THJ 24
DFS 32
Powell 16

Ntilikina 10
Green 26
Bertans 14
Kleber 26
Wood 26

Edit: Frank spot could also turn into Kemba. But personally I would rather reduce SD´s minutes.

[cow]

GSW shot 25% from three. And Luka played maybe the best two-way game I have EVER seen from him. And the Mavs won by three...at HOME...giving up a wide open three look to one of the best shooters of all time. 

If that is the formula, then the Mavs are not going to be contenders and win these kind of games very often.

You are underselling the Mavs complete failures to close the game.

-DFS personal foul followed by Maxi's personal foul before the ball is inbounded.  Free point for GSW. 
-Josh Green refusing to shoot an open corner three with 6 or 7 ticks left on the shot clock.
-DFS refusing to dunk the ball on an inbounds play and then splitting free throws.
-The GSW inbounds play you mentioned.

That's some JV level play we got away with to squeak out a win.

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

You are underselling the Mavs complete failures to close the game.

-DFS personal foul followed by Maxi's personal foul before the ball is inbounded.  Free point for GSW. 
-Josh Green refusing to shoot an open corner three with 6 or 7 ticks left on the shot clock.
-DFS refusing to dunk the ball on an inbounds play and then splitting free throws.
-The GSW inbounds play you mentioned.

That's some JV level play we got away with to squeak out a win.

Damn, I feel like I'm witnessing a messy breakup.