GAME 1: San Antonio Spurs (0-0) vs. Dallas Mavericks (0-0) | 8:30pm CST ESPN!

[david75090]

Mavs will get 'em next year. Or, the year after. One of these years. This years not it.

[michaeltex]

I guess the last takeaway I had from this game (cautious, because only one game) is that while I'm interested in this new defensive identity to an extent, I suuuuuuuure hope the Mavs hopes aren't dependent on the refs letting them play physically every night. You'll get away with more some nights, sure, but it's pretty ridiculous that Davis, Lively AND Washington all got into such deep foul trouble so early. That can't happen - they need to be able to adjust to the officiating much earlier in the game. I realize that some of that was due to Wembenyama bing a freak, but some of the fouls were pretty dumb, too.

Excellent point. Lively only played 10 minutes last night. With Gaff out, that pretty much scraps the twin towers concept. Once that happened, there was no guarding Wemby.

[Jym]

Kidd wanting that lottery pick

Haven't even seen anyone mention Dlo and Nembhard playing together in the 1st quarter. Then Christie and Marshall were the forwards

[KillerLeft]

Excellent point. Lively only played 10 minutes last night. With Gaff out, that pretty much scraps the twin towers concept. Once that happened, there was no guarding Wemby.

Yeah, not only were they in foul trouble, they were in ridiculous foul trouble. All three of their best defensive front court players were affected, and almost immediately. Not a great situation to find yourself in against Wembenyama.

[KillerLeft]

Kidd wanting that lottery pick

Haven't even seen anyone mention Dlo and Nembhard playing together in the 1st quarter. Then Christie and Marshall were the forwards

Honestly, I was hoping not to even have to process that just yet. When the announcer said something about how Kidd likes DLo and Nembhard together, I arched an eyebrow and decided to wait a few games before delving into that one. They basically started with no guards and then played a bench unit of mostly guards. Interesting, to say the least, but as someone else mentioned, the plan was probably negatively impacted by the early foul trouble.

[Smitty]

Excellent point. Lively only played 10 minutes last night. With Gaff out, that pretty much scraps the twin towers concept. Once that happened, there was no guarding Wemby.

Yep, AD and Lively played 8 minutes together. AD and Powell played 0. There was no "twin tower" aspect to last night's game. Which, to your point, is supposed to be their identity. BUT that means AD played 24 of his 32 minutes as the lone-big, like many of us believe he should, and they still got run out of the gym...

[KillerLeft]

Sorry, one more thing:

In the game thread, I kept reading about how the Spurs were "more athletic" than the Mavs. This may or may not be true, but I promise it wasn't helped by this ridiculous idea of playing uber big at every position. IT'S A RUNNING SPORT. You have to be faster and quicker than your opponent - bigger isn't the only metric that matters. Imagine what an athletic freak Flagg would have appeared to be if he wasn't matched up with Castle to start the game!

[Jym]

Honestly, I was hoping not to even have to process that just yet. When the announcer said something about how Kidd likes DLo and Nembhard together, I arched an eyebrow and decided to wait a few games before delving into that one. They basically started with no guards and then played a bench unit of mostly guards. Interesting, to say the least, but as someone else mentioned, the plan was probably negatively impacted by the early foul trouble.

Then there were a couple times with that all guard lineup that AD brought the ball up and jacked up a shot without anyone else touching the ball 
Confusing to say the least

[KillerLeft]

Yep, AD and Lively played 8 minutes together. AD and Powell played 0. There was no "twin tower" aspect to last night's game. Which, to your point, is supposed to be their identity. BUT that means AD played 24 of his 32 minutes as the lone-big, like many of us believe he should, and they still got run out of the gym...

It wasn't a great AD game, that's for sure. 

Kind of seemed like the plan was for him to be the third option guarding Wembenyama coming into the game, or possibly even 4th, in his defense (sort of). PJW was doing well, but couldn't do it without fouling. As much as I think folks are starting to turn on Lively too soon, I do think part of what will measure his career is whether or not he learns how to play against Wembenyama, seeing as they're in the same division and all. 

Hopefully, this was a learning experience for the whole team.

[KillerLeft]

Then there were a couple times with that all guard lineup that AD brought the ball up and jacked up a shot without anyone else touching the ball 
Confusing to say the least

Yeah, this is what drives me crazy. I'm slowly piecing together that I might be AD's biggest fan on this board, but he is not, nor has he ever been the kind of go-to-guy on offense you can build a winning team around. If the plan is to feature him on offense, this project will die before it gets started, imho.

[Smitty]

As much as I think folks are starting to turn on Lively too soon, I do think part of what will measure his career is whether or not he learns how to play against Wembenyama, seeing as they're in the same division and all. 

I don't want it to seem like I'm turning on Lively. I think he's a good young player. I thought he was very good his rookie year. I thought he played Wemby incredibly well that season. Since then, Wemby has gotten better and Lively has not, which is my overall point. Just because I think he's regressed, probably due to injuries and missed time, doesn't mean I think he's bad.

[Jym]

I don't want it to seem like I'm turning on Lively. I think he's a good young player. I thought he was very good his rookie year. I thought he played Wemby incredibly well that season. Since then, Wemby has gotten better and Lively has not, which is my overall point. Just because I think he's regressed, probably due to injuries and missed time, doesn't mean I think he's bad.

So disappointed he didn't take the shooting leap 
And I don't think he's anywhere close to that. I haven't even seen a single practice clip where he's getting up threes with the shooters

[Mavs2021]

You all really drank too much NiCool-Aid to suggest something as stupid as trading Lively for basketball reasons. The guy is literally the only NBA player on the roster that is on the same timeline as Flagg. A lob threat, with a soft touch hook shot, court vision and passing ability that is an above average defender. Shocking that he is not as good with Flagg/D-LO/Nembhard running point as he is with Luka freaking Doncic or Kyrie Irving.

We have no control over our picks from 2026 onwards, and you want to trade a proven starting center.

  Oh but he doesn´t shoot threes.

[Smitty]

So disappointed he didn't take the shooting leap 
And I don't think he's anywhere close to that. I haven't even seen a single practice clip where he's getting up threes with the shooters

I never expected him to be a shooter. I know others have wished for it and Cuban even saying it's critical that he does so. I just want him to get stronger, better. His offensive game is very limited. Mostly still a rim-roller. He is a good passer. Decent rebounder. His calling card right now is his ability to defend in space, on the perimeter, while also being a rim deterrent. This year I'd hope he can be more is all.

[Chicagojk]

Lively will be fine. Really good if he can healthy.

I would not put much stock in the game. There are concerning signs and they may prove to be fatal, but that team was shook by seeing 7’6 Michael Jordan on the court. He absolutely wrecked the game. Anyone who got into the paint was impacted even if Wemby was not close. On offense, they could do nothing to stop him. Because of this they probably had some bad fouls.

Wemby may be the best player in the league but he won’t have that type of game very night. Bless the rest of the league if he is close to that every night. That is the most unstoppable guy the league may have ever had than.

Btw, I thought Castle was awesome too.

[KillerLeft]

I don't want it to seem like I'm turning on Lively. I think he's a good young player. I thought he was very good his rookie year. I thought he played Wemby incredibly well that season. Since then, Wemby has gotten better and Lively has not, which is my overall point. Just because I think he's regressed, probably due to injuries and missed time, doesn't mean I think he's bad.

Well, for what it's worth, I thought he started last night's game very well, affecting shots on defense, presenting himself as a cutter on offense, etc.  My read on how the entire front court played was that a cascade of foul trouble ruined the game plan they came in with and rather than adapt and overcome, they crumbled, with each front court player contributing to said crumble. And to be fair to your point, Wembenyama smelled blood in the water once the foul trouble started and contributed to the crumble quite a bit, too.

[michaeltex]

I don't want it to seem like I'm turning on Lively. I think he's a good young player. I thought he was very good his rookie year. I thought he played Wemby incredibly well that season. Since then, Wemby has gotten better and Lively has not, which is my overall point. Just because I think he's regressed, probably due to injuries and missed time, doesn't mean I think he's bad.

I think it's because of the roles they are expected to play. So far, Lively has been cast as a rim protector/rebounder/dunker. Nobody really expects him to do anything outside of the paint While he's proven pretty reliable on short roll decisions, he's not going to get the ball on the wing and drive to the basket, or at least he's not done that so far. His role has been pretty defined since he first came into the league. With the foot surgery, it doesn't sound like he had much chance to work on improving his skills this summer. Same with AD.

Wemby, OTOH, has a wider role and has spent the last few seasons developing into what we saw last night. An unblockable shooting big with good outside efficiency and enough ball handling skills to take advantage of closeouts. He's going to be a problem for everyone all season long if this keeps up. First real game since last February, so he's had a lot of time to prepare.

[KillerLeft]

Btw, I thought Castle was awesome too.

I did, too. 

Being guarded by a rookie, 6'10" forward and 97 year old Klay Thompson makes for a fun night when you're a legit NBA ball-handling guard. You know, the kind of guard almost every other team in the league features?

[Smitty]

I think it's because of the roles they are expected to play. So far, Lively has been cast as a rim protector/rebounder/dunker. Nobody really expects him to do anything outside of the paint While he's proven pretty reliable on short roll decisions, he's not going to get the ball on the wing and drive to the basket, or at least he's not done that so far. His role has been pretty defined since he first came into the league. With the foot surgery, it doesn't sound like he had much chance to work on improving his skills this summer. Same with AD.

Wemby, OTOH, has a wider role and has spent the last few seasons developing into what we saw last night. An unblockable shooting big with good outside efficiency and enough ball handling skills to take advantage of closeouts. He's going to be a problem for everyone all season long if this keeps up. First real game since last February, so he's had a lot of time to prepare.

Yeah, I didn't mean to compare the two. Completely different players. I was just replying to Killer about Lively's ability to defend Wemby going forward, as a measuring stick, and how I thought he did so incredibly well his rookie year. Last night he couldn't defend without fouling, which is one of his weaknesses. Most of those were what I consider "bad fouls". I didn't mean for this to turn into Lively critique thread. The entire frontcourt got worked over by Wemby. Overall, I think Lively will be an important part of what this team is trying to be. He is an impact player on the defensive end. I hope he continues to get better and has an injury free season. The Mavs success now and in the future depends on it.

[vfromlmf]

I can live with the Nembhard + DLo concept for backup guard minutes. Russell has always been more of a scoring guard and if you squint you can see a 6th man candidate there. He'll look good at times. It's a stretch but maybe Nembhard can develop into a TJ McConnell type in 5 years. I'll be rooting for him. But he threw a pass to a coach in the second row last night and his closest teammate was 10 feet away. There's no way this team is going to win this year.

Lively is a good young center who does trad-center things pretty well. But what does he do exactly that's waaay better than, say, Luke Kornet? Or Gafford for that matter? Don't get me wrong, I love DLive, but he needs to turn the corner pretty quickly. Otherwise, you just have a two-headed center who costs $19M and gives you 18/12 and 12 fouls. Not bad but not game-changing. In fact, that might be exactly how the Mavs view things. The trouble is Lively+Gaff need 40 minutes to put up those numbers. A guy like Zabac gives you similar in 30.

The other guys are good rotation players. JAGs that can get hot.

I predicted 38-wins and stand by that number unless they get honest with themselves and tank.