MAVS NEWS:

[Chicagojk]

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1o..._trade_is/


I think this team is better than it has shown, but they question is then what?   Even if healthy, are they really a contender?  Even if the answer is yes, then for how long?

Even if they are good, do we really think a playoff series against the Lakers would be beneficial to the Mavs?  I think the smart play is to fire Nico (at some point this year) and lay all the blame on him.   Just with that you get some goodwilll.  Even if most of us really dislike the new ownership group, they can get some goodwill.  Then instead of trying to do a bandaid quick fix, start your build around Flagg over the next few years.

Yes, it sucks and no easy, quick rebuild.  Just imagine how dire it would be now without a Flagg.

[Chicagojk]

You dont get the nickname “Street Clothes” or “Day to Dayvis” for nothing.

I obviously wnat to see him healthy, but man I hope he moves better when he gets back.  I understand he could not play much this summer, but he was moving really slow to start the year.    If that doesn't improve, this is going to be a really rough watch.

[Chicagojk]

It is an interesting theory.  The hallmark of a good tank at this point in the season is plausible deniability.  The fact that there are people on all sides of this means so-far, so-good if that is indeed the plan.  There comes a point when you are so far behind everyone else that you don't have to keep pretending.

So here are my questions (if indeed this is a tank)...

Is Kidd going rogue or is everyone in on this?  

Will this be another 10th/11th type tank as we've seen twice now where they keep their options open regarding a playoff run.  Or, will they fully commit and go for a top 3 pick?

How do they do this without killing AD's trade value?

Would the gap year theory mean we are 1. Rebuilding around the two kids (plus Lively and maybe Christie), or 2.  Still all-in with Nico's vision in 26/27 (which is mainly AD/Kyrie as your stars).  I don't think a tank necessarily means we plan to jettison AD...unfortunately.

Do we sell off some pieces at the TDL to teams that are in need of some of what we have?  I can see selling off some depth in either scenario above...especially if it helps the financial situation heading into the 26 and 27 seasons.

I think they eventually play better.   Whether that means they are playoff contention team or now is TBD.   With the lottery odds changed, I really don't want to root for a full year of tank.  Especially not with such an important young prospect.   They may be bad enough where it doesn't matter.   I find myself not rooting for them to lose, but I am not stressed out rooting for them to win either.

I think next year version of the team is probably going to include AD and Kyrie still being here (unless a no brainer trade presents itself).   If they do that (and AD and Kyrie can stay heathy) I would be fine with this.  Although, I think the supporting players would have be switched out.   #1 no more old guys-so maybe the selloff at the trade deadeline can help the financial situation you mention.   #2 Add shooting and creation.   I could see a prototype like this working out.  Especially if they found another young player who cna be a core player with Flagg moving forward.

[KillerLeft]

I wavered on this a bit during the finals run, but I think Kidd is pretty awful, honestly. I think the worst, most depressing development of this summer might've been his last minute extension.

Looking back, my complaints about Luka's game started around the time Carlisle left, and got steadily worse from there. Don't get me wrong, I understand that Carlisle had been here so long that his leaving solved some issues that were blocking the way forward at the time. I'm not suggesting that everything would've worked out fine had he stayed, but he was a real coach with real expertise as an architect and teacher of cutting edge systems that work in the NBA. Kidd's "offense" is pathetic, regardless of whose skills it's built around, only Luka was dominant enough to make it (the offense) just passable enough for the team to be competitive, while still being ineffective enough to piss me off.

Luka's coach is obviously not the problem when it comes to his inconsistent conditioning, complaining to the refs instead of getting back on defense and prioritizing his national team over his NBA team (all complaints I've had about him), but I watched the SA/LAL game the other night, and the ball was moving more that night than it had been here since Kidd took over from Carlisle, so I do think Luka will benefit from Reddick's ability to think the game.

You'd think that would be a strength of Kidd's, too, since he's such a basketball savant, but I've seen basically no evidence of it during his time here. His offensive systems are TRASH, regardless of whose skills they're "built" around. His ATOs are even worse. His defensive systems seem lacking in any acknowledgement that the shots the Mavs want to give up are the exact shots modern offenses are hoping to generate. I think Kidd has some talent in the area of relating to his players, and that's a good thing, but even that he manages to mess up pretty regularly by refusing to take any blame for anything, ever. I could be wrong about this part, but when he denigrates players or personnel publicly, it doesn't seem to me that those are calculated decisions born from understanding of psychology the way Carlisle's used to be.

This is why I don't fall in with the "fire Nico" crowd. I have no need for Harrison to escape blame, or retain his job, and I think he SHOULD be fired, even if it's just to help the fanbase heal. But, I think people are focused on him to an unhealthy level in the context of what's wrong now. Removing the GM won't fix this. It's not as simple as "things were working here when Lindsey was on board," I can promise you that. If we attribute the PJW/Gafford deals to him, we must also attribute the offer of two firsts for Kyle Kuzma to him. The Grant Williams signing comes to mind, too, as do other things. The reality is that no GM is going to get everything right, and the other reality is that, as RoyTarpleysGhost pointed out above, many of the people most critical of Harrison have been 100% on board this summer with the architectural structure of HOW THIS TEAM WAS DESIGNED TO BE PLAYED. I find it mildly offensive that some loud voices are trying to have their cake and eat it, too, on some of these matters.

I agree with Smitty that we haven't had a chance to truly see the imagined identity of this team on the court yet, but I don't care. I hate it. THAT is the reason to hate Harrison, only the same people calling for his head seem to AGREE with how he sees the game and it drives me crazy.

Further, if we think this is all happening "to" Kidd, I think that's a hugely incorrect interpretation. I think HE'S on board with the architecture of this team, too, and I hate it doubly from him, because HE should've known better.

I guess what I'm saying is that between how the basketball side is running with a lack of transparency, the apparent lack of a professional staff in place to prevent and minimize injury, the apparent belief (from top to bottom) the organization had that this was a complete, balanced roster, the hair-pulling ineptitude of the game plan on a night-to-night basis, etc...I fear it might take a lot more than a GM change to fix this, and while I'm ready for Harrison to go, I won't be happy unless Kidd goes with him. In fact, if forced to make a choice between the two, I might actually prefer Kidd go first. I know I'm probably the only one who feels that way, and don't get me wrong - I think the new owners missed a chance to win back a lot of support when Harrison wasn't fired this summer.

[Kidnova]

I agree. I think Kidd is a bad coach from both a game manager perspective and with regards to Xs and Os. It was hard to argue that on this board when they had Luka and they were making deep playoff runs, but that was because the gameplan was give the ball to Luka and let him cook. I do think he's good with players, obviously, and that's something, but he's a net negative during a game, IMO. Unfortunately NYK's widely publicized interest in him convinced Mavs ownership that he was in demand and they gave him an extension he didn't deserve.

[mvossman]

While I agree that Kidd is a poor offensive coach and Rick would have been able to squeeze more out of this roster offensively, there is a limit to what he could have done. Part of the reason Rick's offense was so good is that he made it a priority to get the right personnel on the court to run it. How often did we see three guard (or even 3 PG) lineups on the court?

As much as I think Kidd is the wrong coach to squeeze offense out of this roster, the real issue is the roster itself. Changing coaches is not going to fix the real underlying problem.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

Once Kyrie went down with the ACL injury, the smartest move for this season became pretty clear. 

Yeah, trade for someone that can dribble a basketball. 

That one week when we had twitter rumors about Darius Garland was nice.

[KillerLeft]

While I agree that Kidd is a poor offensive coach and Rick would have been able to squeeze more out of this roster offensively, there is a limit to what he could have done.  Part of the reason Rick's offense was so good is that he made it a priority to get the right personnel on the court to run it.  How often did we see three guard (or even 3 PG) lineups on the court?

As much as I think Kidd is the wrong coach to squeeze offense out of this roster, the real issue is the roster itself.  Changing coaches is not going to fix the real underlying problem.

I agree with that, too, only I don't think Harrison is doing this all in the "rogue" way some people assume. 

I flatly do not believe Luka gets traded without Kidd's approval. I do not believe the roster finishes the summer with this much imbalance if Kidd (and Vogel, probably) aren't on board with it. 

I think they're all idiots, not just Harrison. That's my point.

[F Gump]

So here are my questions (if indeed this is a tank)...
1 Is Kidd going rogue or is everyone in on this?  
2 Will this be another 10th/11th type tank as we've seen twice now where they keep their options open regarding a playoff run.  Or, will they fully commit and go for a top 3 pick?
3 How do they do this without killing AD's trade value?
4A Would the gap year theory mean we are 1. Rebuilding around the two kids (plus Lively and maybe Christie), or 2.  Still all-in with Nico's vision in 26/27 (which is mainly AD/Kyrie as your stars).  I don't think a tank necessarily means we plan to jettison AD...unfortunately.
4B  Do we sell off some pieces at the TDL to teams that are in need of some of what we have?  I can see selling off some depth in either scenario above...especially if it helps the financial situation heading into the 26 and 27 seasons.

1 I don't imagine Kidd (or any coach) would ever tank as a rogue act. 
2 The point of tanking THIS early would be to create position to go for a top pick. 
3 AD is injured. That's half the solution. And when he played, he created good stats but the team result was ugly. That would be the other half. And the third half would be that he COULD be traded at some point (at least in theory) - for example, if the record got really bad and then rumors start swirling that he wants to be on a diff team.
4A, 4B  IMO all of those questions are very flexible -- even if they are tanking, who to keep and who to sell off, and when you might make a trade or 3, doesn't have to be decided up front. 

All that having been said, while I am open to talking about it because it looks SOOOOOO bad in spite of so much talent (and also because we are seeing "weird" injury things happening right and left), I am very fickle on the tank idea - all it will take will be 2-3 games in a row where everything clicks to make me wonder if they just started with bad chemistry and it took them time to figure it out and they aren't tanking after all.

[fifteenth]

I wavered on this a bit during the finals run, but I think Kidd is pretty awful, honestly. I think the worst, most depressing development of this summer might've been his last minute extension.

Looking back, my complaints about Luka's game started around the time Carlisle left, and got steadily worse from there. Don't get me wrong, I understand that Carlisle had been here so long that his leaving solved some issues that were blocking the way forward at the time. I'm not suggesting that everything would've worked out fine had he stayed, but he was a real coach with real expertise as an architect and teacher of cutting edge systems that work in the NBA. Kidd's "offense" is pathetic, regardless of whose skills it's built around, only Luka was dominant enough to make it (the offense) just passable enough for the team to be competitive, while still being ineffective enough to piss me off.

Luka's coach is obviously not the problem when it comes to his inconsistent conditioning, complaining to the refs instead of getting back on defense and prioritizing his national team over his NBA team (all complaints I've had about him), but I watched the SA/LAL game the other night, and the ball was moving more that night than it had been here since Kidd took over from Carlisle, so I do think Luka will benefit from Reddick's ability to think the game.

You'd think that would be a strength of Kidd's, too, since he's such a basketball savant, but I've seen basically no evidence of it during his time here. His offensive systems are TRASH, regardless of whose skills they're "built" around. His ATOs are even worse. His defensive systems seem lacking in any acknowledgement that the shots the Mavs want to give up are the exact shots modern offenses are hoping to generate. I think Kidd has some talent in the area of relating to his players, and that's a good thing, but even that he manages to mess up pretty regularly by refusing to take any blame for anything, ever. I could be wrong about this part, but when he denigrates players or personnel publicly, it doesn't seem to me that those are calculated decisions born from understanding of psychology the way Carlisle's used to be.

This is why I don't fall in with the "fire Nico" crowd. I have no need for Harrison to escape blame, or retain his job, and I think he SHOULD be fired, even if it's just to help the fanbase heal. But, I think people are focused on him to an unhealthy level in the context of what's wrong now. Removing the GM won't fix this. It's not as simple as "things were working here when Lindsey was on board," I can promise you that. If we attribute the PJW/Gafford deals to him, we must also attribute the offer of two firsts for Kyle Kuzma to him. The Grant Williams signing comes to mind, too, as do other things. The reality is that no GM is going to get everything right, and the other reality is that, as RoyTarpleysGhost pointed out above, many of the people most critical of Harrison have been 100% on board this summer with the architectural structure of HOW THIS TEAM WAS DESIGNED TO BE PLAYED. I find it mildly offensive that some loud voices are trying to have their cake and eat it, too, on some of these matters.

I agree with Smitty that we haven't had a chance to truly see the imagined identity of this team on the court yet, but I don't care. I hate it. THAT is the reason to hate Harrison, only the same people calling for his head seem to AGREE with how he sees the game and it drives me crazy.

Further, if we think this is all happening "to" Kidd, I think that's a hugely incorrect interpretation. I think HE'S on board with the architecture of this team, too, and I hate it doubly from him, because HE should've known better.

I guess what I'm saying is that between how the basketball side is running with a lack of transparency, the apparent lack of a professional staff in place to prevent and minimize injury, the apparent belief (from top to bottom) the organization had that this was a complete, balanced roster, the hair-pulling ineptitude of the game plan on a night-to-night basis, etc...I fear it might take a lot more than a GM change to fix this, and while I'm ready for Harrison to go, I won't be happy unless Kidd goes with him. In fact, if forced to make a choice between the two, I might actually prefer Kidd go first. I know I'm probably the only one who feels that way, and don't get me wrong - I think the new owners missed a chance to win back a lot of support when Harrison wasn't fired this summer.

I agree. We need new ownership, GM and coach

[Chicagojk]

https://archive.ph/2025.11.07-192256/htt...ka-doncic/

[KillerLeft]

I agree. We need new ownership, GM and coach

Yeah, and since that's not likely to happen (I'd say ANY of those happening is unlikely, ALL of it happening is pretty much impossible) the question becomes: follow the Mavs, or don't follow the Mavs.

[F Gump]

https://archive.ph/2025.11.07-192256/htt...ka-doncic/

Great analysis. Great article. Great read.

[chaparral]

So how many years are on Kidd and Nico's contracts? And how much do they make a year?

[fifteenth]

Yeah, and since that's not likely to happen (I'd say ANY of those happening is unlikely, ALL of it happening is pretty much impossible) the question becomes: follow the Mavs, or don't follow the Mavs.

True, I'm living in the limbo of that tough decision

[Kidnova]

For good or ill, once I pick a team I stick with them. I've stuck with the Cowboys through the last 30 years. I stuck with the Rangers for decades when they were playing bad baseball and had bad management. Now my interest level may wax and wane, and my willingness to buy tickets and/or gear may decrease, but ultimately I know I'll stick with them even through this mess.

[Razzmatazz_Hopskidillydoo]

I'm in the Fire Kidd team even before Christian Wood's time (although he was right about Wood most times, but that's not the point here). Kidd - the player sees plays happening in real time, and he can conjure things up on the fly, but as a coach? He is slow to see what's happening, slow to react, and slow to adjust. This has happened in every season -- Kidd devises a plan and sticks with it. In game adjustments are a whack for this guy, as it takes him 8 to 10 games to see what's not working. The Mavs offense worked in large part because of Luka, Brunson and later on Kyrie. Those guys were the in-game coaches of the team that helped the Mavs overcome Kidd's deficiency. Kidd was too reliant on his star guards that he didn't bother to install a structured go-to offense. I remember a time when the Fire Kidd movement has taken hold, but no thanks to Luka and Kyrie's brilliance, Kidd had a shot at the title and retained his job -- and some fans disgustingly equated this success vis-a-vis with coaching competency. I often LOLed at Nick of Locked-On-Mavs for this. With all that said, the first order of business is to fire Nico. Kidd can stay to help with the tanking part since even if he wanted to win -- he likely wouldn't have the competency to do that. But by the start of next season, I'd want a fresh start. I love Coooper Flagg and will support him even if he just becomes Franz Wagner at his peak. I'd want AD out, Klay out and Martin out. It's enough these guys remind me of Nico's mess but they have real detrimental flaws. Get this done and even if the Mavs do not make the play-offs for 3 years -- most of the lost fans will be supporting the team just as much as the Dirk days.

[BoredAssistant]

I don't comment much because I don't have anything substantive to say (eta: not that I ever have) and it would be negative but today I heard on one local radio station the host guessing/speculating the mavs gm being gone in a month if this continues and another station was talking about "liberating the fans" to heal. Not that it means anything but it got me to listen. I said I wasn't going to watch any nba until ownership was gone but I admit I did watch most of 1 game and 5-10 minutes here and there of both the Lakers and Mavs. It feels like I'm watching in a hospital lounge but I still check in to mavsboard almost everyday because I enjoy reading the comments and there's the anticipation I might read some unexpected news.

[ThisIStheYear]

Fire Kidd. Hire Thibs. But not until the end of the year so the Mavs can maximize draft position. This team needs a strong coach who’ll will kick the hell out of this unfocused, undisciplined roster.

Kidd getting another contract extension was a masterful move. You have to give him credit. He’s stealing money.

[audiosway]

Yeah, and since that's not likely to happen (I'd say ANY of those happening is unlikely, ALL of it happening is pretty much impossible) the question becomes: follow the Mavs, or don't follow the Mavs.

And that my friend is why I left for the Lakers. I only come back occasionally to see how you guys are doing. I never in a million years would have imagined this is where it would end up. I feel terrible for you guys.