MacMahon: Mavs to explore trade market for Davis, „plotting to pivot to the future“

[Winter]

On yesterdays bill simmons podcast he starts with an nba six pack.  His number 3 point is the mavs should not move AD at a discount and should keep him as him and Flagg look interesting.

Let's assume we keep AD for the rest of the season.

Our backup center now is Dwight Powell and Cisse (at this point). Let's say Gafford recovers before the TD, but I rather doubt Lively is back then. 

What kind of trade do you make at the trade deadline now if it's not AD? I'm guessing here the Mavs need a backup plan if they don't like the offers for AD. We want a PG, but who do we trade from our roster? What else?

[Chicagojk]

Let's assume we keep AD for the rest of the season.

Our backup center now is Dwight Powell and Cisse (at this point). Let's say Gafford recovers before the TD, but I rather doubt Lively is back then. 

What kind of trade do you make at the trade deadline now if it's not AD? I'm guessing here the Mavs need a backup plan if they don't like the offers for AD. We want a PG, but who do we trade from our roster? What else?

Maybe we see lively again this year, but if not maybe that clears some of the potential jam.  I was thinking Gafford for either Sexton or Colby White.  Maybe not sexton now.  White seems a little rich for Gafford but with him being a free agent that could lower his price.  I like White.  Just don’t see him as a point guard and his value is heavily tied to his next contract to me.  I lose interest if he is at 25 mil or so.

[Hooper21]

Some of these trade proposals are Ghost of Podkolzin level stuff. The only name player we're likely to get from Charlotte is Ball. They've been playing better without him.

[DanSchwartzgan]

Let's assume we keep AD for the rest of the season.

Our backup center now is Dwight Powell and Cisse (at this point). Let's say Gafford recovers before the TD, but I rather doubt Lively is back then. 

What kind of trade do you make at the trade deadline now if it's not AD? I'm guessing here the Mavs need a backup plan if they don't like the offers for AD. We want a PG, but who do we trade from our roster? What else?

I’ve had similar thoughts.  What do we really need if the lineup is projected to eventually be:

AD/Lively

Flagg/PJ/Naji (getting all of the 3 and 4 minutes)

Christie/Klay

Irving/Nembhard

Is there really a whole there big enough that you trade away your safety net at center (Gafford)?  The outgoing would presumably be Gafford plus the player being replaced.  So, which one needs to be replaced?  I need to figure all of that out before I even start to entertain targets.

[KillerLeft]

I’ve had similar thoughts.  What do we really need if the lineup is projected to eventually be:

AD/Lively

Flagg/PJ/Naji (getting all of the 3 and 4 minutes)

Christie/Klay

Irving/Nembhard

Is there really a whole there big enough that you trade away your safety net at center (Gafford)?  The outgoing would presumably be Gafford plus the player being replaced.  So, which one needs to be replaced?  I need to figure all of that out before I even start to entertain targets.

Assuming your depth chart tracks, I'd want to switch one of the shooters at guard (Christie/Thompson) for a better all around player who can shoot as well as they can AND handle/create. Or, I'd like to replace one of the three forwards you list (either PJW or Marshall) for a guy more complementary to Flagg and less overlapping in skills. Basically, someone who can shoot. I'd also much prefer to slide Kyrie to the Christie/Thompson scene for at least half of his minutes, if not MOST, and I doubt he and Nembhard can play together effectively (on defense, at least), so...it's not difficult for me to imagine wants/needs. 

It's really all about the quality level of what's available to them.

[mvossman]

Let's assume we keep AD for the rest of the season.

Our backup center now is Dwight Powell and Cisse (at this point). Let's say Gafford recovers before the TD, but I rather doubt Lively is back then. 

What kind of trade do you make at the trade deadline now if it's not AD? I'm guessing here the Mavs need a backup plan if they don't like the offers for AD. We want a PG, but who do we trade from our roster? What else?

Too many unknowns to make that call right now.  The outlook is very different right now than it was 10 games ago and it will probably swing wildly again before we get near TDL.

[Smitty]

I’ve had similar thoughts.  What do we really need if the lineup is projected to eventually be:

AD/Lively

Flagg/PJ/Naji (getting all of the 3 and 4 minutes)

Christie/Klay

Irving/Nembhard

Is there really a whole there big enough that you trade away your safety net at center (Gafford)?  The outgoing would presumably be Gafford plus the player being replaced.  So, which one needs to be replaced?  I need to figure all of that out before I even start to entertain targets.

The most logical IMO is replacing Naji with someone like L. Ball, C. White, etc., and having Klay overlap more as a Wing and Kyrie as an off-guard.

I guess the ideal player would really be someone like Derrick White, if I’m thinking of ideal fits, and somewhat realistic trade targets.

[Winter]

The most logical IMO is replacing Naji with someone like L. Ball, C. White, etc., and having Klay overlap more as a Wing and Kyrie as an off-guard.

I guess the ideal player would really be someone like Derrick White, if I’m thinking of ideal fits, and somewhat realistic trade targets.

I'm sort of at this point, but let's assume Kyrie is returning.

I can't imagine a lot of Nembhard-Kyrie lineups with them playing together. I'm guessing there's a lineup Kyrie at PG with Nembie subbing in. But I feel like there's a better G\SF type out there to start with Kyrie. I like your Derrick White idea as a fit in this case (I doubt he's available, but maybe). The real need I think is a good 3-point shooter. It could be someone like Derrick White at guard or it could be another small forward.

I think outgoing has to be Naji\PJ if you're looking for real quality in the trade. I'd rather keep Gafford.  I'm not crazy about Ball or C. White incoming, but maybe there's another partner out there.

[mvossman]

For all the talk about building around AD, I feel like the OKC game should be a bit of wakeup call. Its not so much that AD was terrible and had another injury scare, it was more about a reminder on how far this team is from the top teams, especially OKC. They are years away and AD does not fit that timeline. They need to do whatever they can to maximize his trade value and get the best return they can (whether at TDL or offseason). Klay is playing himself into value and should go at the TDL. Kyrie should probably go as well if he can bring back significant value. This season should be about finding out if Nemby is for real, can PJ and Flagg play effectively on the court together, and can Lively ever get healthy.

[Winter]

For all the talk about building around AD, I feel like the OKC game should be a bit of wakeup call.  Its not so much that AD was terrible and had another injury scare, it was more about a reminder on how far this team is from the top teams, especially OKC.  They are years away and AD does not fit that timeline.  They need to do whatever they can to maximize his trade value and get the best return they can (whether at TDL or offseason).  Klay is playing himself into value and should go at the TDL.  Kyrie should probably go as well if he can bring back significant value.  This season should be about finding out if Nemby is for real, can PJ and Flagg play effectively on the court together, and can Lively ever get healthy.

Just so we're clear, I'm not entirely sure everyone is talking about "building around AD" this year. 

My personal take is that it's entirely possible no good trade is available at the TD. Then you have to consider the team's needs going forward. For me, those needs certainly don't assume any plan after the summer to retain AD. I can't see any way he's with the team next year. I certainly wouldn't make roster trades based on that assumption. That's some kind of crazy Nico-think.

I doubt Klay is with the team next year. It makes sense to move him. It makes sense to move Kyrie as well, but I'm not completely sure how that unfolds.

[Chicagojk]

For all the talk about building around AD, I feel like the OKC game should be a bit of wakeup call.  It’s ith the renot so much that AD was terrible and had another injury scare, it was more about a reminder on how far this team is from the top teams, especially OKC.  They are years away and AD does not fit that timeline.  They need to do whatever they can to maximize his trade value and get the best return they can (whether at TDL or offseason).  Klay is playing himself into value and should go at the TDL.  Kyrie should probably go as well if he can bring back significant value.  This season should be about finding out if Nemby is for real, can PJ and Flagg play effectively on the court together, and can Lively ever get healthy.

With the recent improvements this has gone from a disaster to ok.  I really think there are a few simple things that can make it better quickly.  Mavs need to be honest with themselves though.  Zach Lowe has said that this team when healthy is good.  The question is if it is good or a real contender.  That is a big gap.  Plus, with the age the window is not long.   

I am still not hot and heavy to trade AD.  I have not seen one trade that excites me.  I am willing to gamble on disaster waiting for a legit offer I find appealing.  Whether that is two months or 1.5 years from now if ok to me at the moment.  

I learned the sixers have a clippers pick a few years from now and a swap.  This is after the next two years going to the Thunder but that intrigues me a bit.

[Winter]

With the recent improvements this has gone from a disaster to ok.  I really think there are a few simple things that can make it better quickly.  Mavs need to be honest with themselves though.  Zach Lowe has said that this team when healthy is good.  The question is if it is good or a real contender.  That is a big gap.  Plus, with the age the window is not long.   

I am still not hot and heavy to trade AD.  I have not seen one trade that excites me.  I am willing to gamble on disaster waiting for a legit offer I find appealing.  Whether that is two months or 1.5 years from now if ok to me at the moment.  

I learned the sixers have a clippers pick a few years from now and a swap.  This is after the next two years going to the Thunder but that intrigues me a bit.

My guess is that you're going to see an AD trade that definitely does not excite you. Or me. 

It's really hard to imagine that a new GM is going to see AD as part of the future (or Kyrie for that matter). New GMs frequently have a lot of latitude. Standing pat just doesn't seem like anything the owners might want to hear.

just my 2 cents.

[mvossman]

Just so we're clear, I'm not entirely sure everyone is talking about "building around AD" this year. 

My personal take is that it's entirely possible no good trade is available at the TD. Then you have to consider the team's needs going forward. For me, those needs certainly don't assume any plan after the summer to retain AD. I can't see any way he's with the team next year. I certainly wouldn't make roster trades based on that assumption. That's some kind of crazy Nico-think.

I doubt Klay is with the team next year. It makes sense to move him. It makes sense to move Kyrie as well, but I'm not completely sure how that unfolds.

If this is the mindset, then your TDL trades should not be impacted by whether he gets traded then vs offseason.  They need to be made with understanding that he will not be on the roster long term.  For example it may not make sense to trade Gafford if AD is not going to be here as we don't know if Lively will ever be able to stay on the court.

[Mavs2021]

There are a few factors, but none bigger than his expectation to be extended north of 30M a year. I think 90/3 is already  an extremely risky extension given his age and injury history, but he probably expects double that. Also everybody assumes that Kyrie comes back from his ACL the same player. He could also be half the player. 

Regardless of all this I think the most important thing they need to understand is that THEY NEED TO TANK THIS YEAR. And I´m almost positive Cuban will f*** it up again and we´ll end up with a pick outside the top 10. It´s hilarious that Nico might f*** us over twice by getting fired. He stays they are a lock to finish in the bottom eight, cause the place stays so toxic.

[myconsumerclub]

I doubt we will see a trade that is worth taking for AD. That may be a very good thing because it keeps us from making another bad trade. I think he is playing more cautiously now knowing he is coming to the twilight years of his career. He could be a good player to have for the remaining years on his contract.

As long as we lose enough games to get a decent pick in the middle of the first round we could get a decent player to use who knows that 6'9 Greek kid that is getting a lot of assists as a big PG would be a good option to use at SG and back up Cooper especially if he can hit his 3 pointers and be a second PG out there. Somehow we need to trade off guys like Martin and Klay and Dlo to get some picks. We need to add more youth that fits on Coopers timeline.

As the roster evolves I agree we could see some Nemby and Kyrie playing together since Kyrie is a strong 3 point shooter and so it seems is Nemby, since he is hitting 53.6% on 3's with Max behind him at 43.6% and Hardy at 41.7%.

The teams 3 point shooting is improving with Nemby dishing things out to guys and getting them more open looks.

I am shocked how fortunate this team has been with regard to our rookies being as good as they are.

It makes me think how can we get Kelly and Cisse a lot more playing time so we see what they can do.

I would be working on getting Cisse developed so he can get stuck in there when we need him. I understand he needs to improve his FT %.

We may get in as play in team and get that Maverick luck again with the lottery pick. We still need to win games and stealth tank but if we get any more injuries the full tank will need to be prioritized.

Play the games and see what happens that is all we need to do and inch forward to becoming a contender with a younger lineup.

[RasheedsBigWhiteSpot]

I really hope people are viewing this recent team hot streak for what it should be:

What It Shouldn't Be: The Mavs wins, even against very good teams, shouldn't fool anyone into thinking this is a true contender, as fun as that might be. That's Fool's Gold. Even if this team does hit it's stride, it's far closer to a lottery team than a squad that's going to beat OKC(psst...no one is). Buying short-term assets against the future would be disastrous. That said, enjoy the wins right now because they're very fun!!!

What It Absolutely Should Be: This winning streak should absolutely be used as leverage in trade discussions. It's easy for other teams, when your team sucks, to say, "Your players are garbage. Your team is garbage. So just make a trade out of desperation." Instead, the MBT can say, "Look how well these guys look. We think we're on our way now. But if you want to buy us out of our ticket to the dance, especially before Kyrie comes back, it's gonna cost you."

I think the team's success improves its bargaining position as much as AD and others' play does.

Yeah, an injured AD on a bottom 5, rudderless team is much easier to vulture off of than one that suddenly looks like it's figured things out.

But make no mistake, this team should still be selling, even if as a fan base it would hurr.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

DNP coaches decision for Kuminga tonight

[Mavs2021]

I really hope people are viewing this recent team hot streak for what it should be:

What It Shouldn't Be: The Mavs wins, even against very good teams, shouldn't fool anyone into thinking this is a true contender, as fun as that might be. That's Fool's Gold. Even if this team does hit it's stride, it's far closer to a lottery team than a squad that's going to beat OKC(psst...no one is). Buying short-term assets against the future would be disastrous. That said, enjoy the wins right now because they're very fun!!!

What It Absolutely Should Be:  This winning streak should absolutely be used as leverage in trade discussions. It's easy for other teams, when your team sucks, to say, "Your players are garbage. Your team is garbage. So just make a trade out of desperation."  Instead, the MBT can say, "Look how well these guys look. We think we're on our way now. But if you want to buy us out of our ticket to the dance, especially before Kyrie comes back, it's gonna cost you."

I think the team's success improves its bargaining position as much as AD and others' play does.

Yeah, an injured AD on a bottom 5, rudderless team is much easier to vulture off of than one that suddenly looks like it's figured things out.

But make no mistake, this team should still be selling, even if as a fan base it would hurr.

1000% this. We need a bottom eight finish to give ourselves at least a chance at a 2nd star. You can find a Derrick White. You can find a Jrue Holiday. You can find a Porzingis. You can find a Pritchard. We need a Jaylen Brown. This would be so outrageously short-sighted that it´s right in Cuban´s wheelhouse. Not willing to suffer for six months, so they can suffer for six years. Even if there is no good AD trade, no Klay trade, no Kyrie trade; you still tank the 2nd half of the season and come back with a top 8 pick next year. Then you can try to win and you probably will with a 2nd year Flagg/Nembhard, possibly another generational talent and extra guards to replace Exum, Powell´s roster spots. 

Just don´t give AD an expensive extension. Right now only PJ and Gafford have contracts beyond 2028. Mavs could have about 100M in capspace in 2028, if you factor in Lively´s extension. I´d rather have Cuban do Dry Doncic Powder 2028 then have no top 10 pick this year.

[Dirknows]

1000% this. We need a bottom eight finish to give ourselves at least a chance at a 2nd star. You can find a Derrick White. You can find a Jrue Holiday. You can find a Porzingis. You can find a Pritchard. We need a Jaylen Brown. This would be so outrageously short-sighted that it´s right in Cuban´s wheelhouse. Not willing to suffer for six months, so they can suffer for six years. Even if there is no good AD trade, no Klay trade, no Kyrie trade; you still tank the 2nd half of the season and come back with a top 8 pick next year. Then you can try to win and you probably will with a 2nd year Flagg/Nembhard, possibly another generational talent and extra guards to replace Exum, Powell´s roster spots. 

Just don´t give AD an expensive extension. Right now only PJ and Gafford have contracts beyond 2028. Mavs could have about 100M in capspace in 2028, if you factor in Lively´s extension. I´d rather have Cuban do Dry Doncic Powder 2028 then have no top 10 pick this year.

They better hire a new GM cuz Mark Cuban doesn’t deserve a say in anything after he sold the team, making way for the Luka trade.

[windjc]

Comparing the Mavs to the Thunder who are the best team since the Jordan Bulls, is not fair. Either salary cap or injuries destroy that team or they win indefinitely. The Mavs should compare themselves to the next best team.