Trade & FA 2024-25:

[mvossman]

He is the waste of 4 pick, but i think he can be usefull player for us. He clearly isn't a ''new Kawhi'', but i think he can become a similar player to Jerami Grant.

He clearly isn't a Herb Jones level of player, but if his price is only Kleber + Powell + Hardy/Exum (and maybe 2 rp) that is the deal i would do it. Just watching the games and see that those guys basically are just on the payroll here and are mostly getting DNP is enough to consider the deal.

And that could also mean that all core players are staying here.

He is a little bit overpaid for his production, but if he can turn into Jeremy Grant type of player that deal wouldn't look so bad.

E: After DFS trade, there is even less players in that range on the market...

I would argue he is currently wildly overpaid for his production.  His true shooting is 50% right now.  That is really bad.  I realize he is still young, but we are on our 5th year of sample he has been on a downward trajectory.  I think the chances he becomes another Gerami Grant are getting very low, and you are paying a big cost (cap) to make that gamble.

There is also the concept of opportunity cost.  Even if we are getting nothing from those players we are sending out (which I think you are overstating) the question remains could we get something better for that 18 mil in cap than taking a big risk on a play who has been wildly underperforming for years.

[Chicagojk]

Ok, I was thinking of a Thybulle trade where you had a Luka on/Luka off rotation.

Luka on:

Luka, Grimes, Klay/Marshal, Thybulle, Gafford

Grimes is your point of attack defender. Both Grimes and Luka are solid to good rebounders so hopefully that would help with being smaller. Klay/Marshall guard the second best wing. Thybulle is at his best off ball. Luka would need to guard either the weakess player or PF type. Gafford guards the rim. On offense, it is a Luka offense. Gafford your rim runner. Grimes, Klay/Marshall are your floor spreaders. Thybulle needs to prove he is average from wide open threes. 5 minute run with this group where you ask Luka to play with your bench to give starters a rest.

Luka off

Kyrie, Din, Klay/Marshal, PJ, Lively

PJ and Lively help with the defense. Din helps Kyrie to play off ball. Grimes could also get some run in the Klay/Marshall spot.

This rotation only doable if the smaller lineup can rebound and score enough off Luka. In addition, it probably puts Din in a much smaller role than he is going to get (12-14 minutes).

I just don't know if Maxi (negative asset) and the Philly second round pick gets Portland's attention. Even for a guy who has been hurt for most of the year.

[Chicagojk]

Ok, I was thinking of a Thybulle trade where you had a Luka on/Luka off rotation.

Luka on:

Luka, Grimes, Klay/Marshal, Thybulle, Gafford

Grimes is your point of attack defender.  Both Grimes and Luka are solid to good rebounders so hopefully that would help with being smaller.  Klay/Marshall guard the second best wing.  Thybulle is at his best off ball.  Luka would need to guard either the weakess player or PF type.    Gafford guards the rim.  On offense, it is a Luka offense.  Gafford your rim runner.  Grimes, Klay/Marshall are your floor spreaders.  Thybulle needs to prove he is average from wide open threes.  5 minute run with this group where you ask Luka to play with your bench to give starters a rest.

Luka off

Kyrie, Din, Klay/Marshal, PJ, Lively

PJ and Lively help with the defense.  Din helps Kyrie to play off ball.    Grimes could also get some run in the Klay/Marshall spot.

This rotation only doable if the smaller lineup can rebound and score enough off Luka.  In addition, it probably puts Din in a much smaller role than he is going to get (12-14 minutes).

I just don't know if Maxi (negative asset) and the Philly second round pick gets Portland's attention.  Even for a guy who has been hurt for most of the year.

i am not even a huge fan.  In fact, I can’t really remember watching a game and focusing on him.  He is a below average shooter but in the 35 percent range…so comparable to DJJ.

I just think his skills fill in as a spot guy.

https://youtu.be/P6_L-lFiOjU?si=hrSAJzZ4jn_9mk5Y

[KillerLeft]

He is the waste of 4 pick, but i think he can be usefull player for us. He clearly isn't a ''new Kawhi'', but i think he can become a similar player to Jerami Grant.

People can disagree, and that’s what this place is all about, but to be clear about my opinion regarding Patrick Williams, I think he is not good enough to play in the NBA, and wouldn’t want him on my team at all. Maybe at the minimum, but probably not even then.

It’s not a question of what role they would have him play or how much he would count against the cap or luxury tax, I am simply uninterested in him as a basketball player.

[mvossman]

Ok, I was thinking of a Thybulle trade where you had a Luka on/Luka off rotation.

Luka on:

Luka, Grimes, Klay/Marshal, Thybulle, Gafford

Grimes is your point of attack defender.  Both Grimes and Luka are solid to good rebounders so hopefully that would help with being smaller.  Klay/Marshall guard the second best wing.  Thybulle is at his best off ball.  Luka would need to guard either the weakess player or PF type.    Gafford guards the rim.  On offense, it is a Luka offense.  Gafford your rim runner.  Grimes, Klay/Marshall are your floor spreaders.  Thybulle needs to prove he is average from wide open threes.  5 minute run with this group where you ask Luka to play with your bench to give starters a rest.

Luka off

Kyrie, Din, Klay/Marshal, PJ, Lively

PJ and Lively help with the defense.  Din helps Kyrie to play off ball.    Grimes could also get some run in the Klay/Marshall spot.

This rotation only doable if the smaller lineup can rebound and score enough off Luka.  In addition, it probably puts Din in a much smaller role than he is going to get (12-14 minutes).

I just don't know if Maxi (negative asset) and the Philly second round pick gets Portland's attention.  Even for a guy who has been hurt for most of the year.

I like these lineups, including how we would utilize Din when everyone is healthy.  I would definitely keep Klay in the starting lineup without Luka and Naji with Luka and the backups.  But I thought the goal was to get an elite point of attack defender.  If that is not Thybulle then I am skeptical he makes much sense given his limitations on the offensive end.

[Chicagojk]

https://x.com/MavsFilmRoom/status/1881090316138323978

[Chicagojk]

https://x.com/MavsFilmRoom/status/1881086187089359051


Mavs Film Room ??
@MavsFilmRoom
Marc Stein also noted that Luka Dončić is a “notable admirer” of Daniel Gafford and that his dad, Sasa Dončić has been recruiting Gafford to play for the Slovenian National Team.

If you’ve been paying attention, Luka’s admiration for Gafford shouldn’t come as a surprise ??‍♂️

[KillerLeft]

https://x.com/MavsFilmRoom/status/1881090316138323978

[KillerLeft]

It's so funny. When the season started, I felt there was almost no chance Dallas would make a deadline deal this year (still kind of feel that way, tbh), and I swore I wouldn't get sucked in by trade season this time around. But, here I am, pining over a potential trade that probably won't happen, same as ever.

I really, really like the idea of Herb Jones on this team.

[Chicagojk]

It's so funny. When the season started, I felt there was almost no chance Dallas would make a deadline deal this year (still kind of feel that way, tbh), and I swore I wouldn't get sucked in by trade season this time around. But, here I am, pining over a potential trade that probably won't happen, same as ever.

I really, really like the idea of Herb Jones on this team.

I tend to think they don't do anything either.   With the injuries, lack of everyone playing together, limited assets and potential better moves this summer.  Although, I thought they would probably not make a move last trade deadline either. ha ha

I have no hope for Herb Jones imo.  Pelicans have so many other people to trade before Jones.   Ha ha.  Also,  how he plays, his low salary and how every team would want Jones in the league.   They would only consider if they are blown away.  I think it starts at 3 first round picks to get their interest.

[Chicagojk]

My current sneaky trade target is Javonte Green on the Pelicans. He makes barely 2 mil, but he knows how to defend and can actually defend up against guys like Tatum despite his size

He looked pretty good when we played the depleted Pelicans.    With only a 2 million contract, I am sure he could be had for matching salary and the Sixers second.   Do we have any other seconds?   It probably isn't worth the Philly seconds, but not sure what else we can offer.  Some team may offer something better than a spare second.   
Does it move the needle though?   Where would he fit in the rotation?   Feels like he would be outside the main rotation, right?

[LukaMVP]

Ok, I was thinking of a Thybulle trade where you had a Luka on/Luka off rotation.

Luka on:

Luka, Grimes, Klay/Marshal, Thybulle, Gafford

Grimes is your point of attack defender.  Both Grimes and Luka are solid to good rebounders so hopefully that would help with being smaller.  Klay/Marshall guard the second best wing.  Thybulle is at his best off ball.  Luka would need to guard either the weakess player or PF type.    Gafford guards the rim.  On offense, it is a Luka offense.  Gafford your rim runner.  Grimes, Klay/Marshall are your floor spreaders.  Thybulle needs to prove he is average from wide open threes.  5 minute run with this group where you ask Luka to play with your bench to give starters a rest.

Luka off

Kyrie, Din, Klay/Marshal, PJ, Lively

PJ and Lively help with the defense.  Din helps Kyrie to play off ball.    Grimes could also get some run in the Klay/Marshall spot.

This rotation only doable if the smaller lineup can rebound and score enough off Luka.  In addition, it probably puts Din in a much smaller role than he is going to get (12-14 minutes).

I just don't know if Maxi (negative asset) and the Philly second round pick gets Portland's attention.  Even for a guy who has been hurt for most of the year.

I have been a thybulle recommender for years and have always thought the mavs should have signed him when he was a FA (they actually did so but too bad their offer was matched). at least thybulle would be a significant upgrade defensively which is for sure, while at the offensive end he wouldn't need to do much else but stand at either of the two corners waiting for open 3 chances when Kyrie and luka are both on court.

[DL2RimRocker]

It's so funny. When the season started, I felt there was almost no chance Dallas would make a deadline deal this year (still kind of feel that way, tbh), and I swore I wouldn't get sucked in by trade season this time around. But, here I am, pining over a potential trade that probably won't happen, same as ever.

I really, really like the idea of Herb Jones on this team.

I'm probably alone thinking we shouldn't make any trades unless there is an available deal that is completely lopsided in our favor.

The only need imo is to find a better version of Maxi and that should only be done without giving up any of our current rotation players other than Maxi.

If we are healthy come PO time, this is a solid roster that can compete with anyone.

[KillerLeft]

I'm probably alone thinking we shouldn't make any trades unless there is an available deal that is completely lopsided in our favor.

The only need imo is to find a better version of Maxi and that should only be done without giving up any of our current rotation players other than Maxi.

If we are healthy come PO time, this is a solid roster that can compete with anyone.

I agree with your goal, and the that the roster is in great shape.

I don’t agree that a better Kleber can be obtained by only using Kleber. But, I also am not in too big of a hurry to replace Kleber.

[F Gump]

Herb Jones as a concept has appeal at the right price, but with the real HJ, I can't imagine Mavs would ever consider a TDL trade for him, for several reasons.
1 They would be giving up assets and roster depth to make this team's chances worse. Maybe in the summer? But no reason to trade now and get nothing and sabotage the roster.
2 Trade matching and adjusting the roster (both DAL and NO) is easier in the summer, too, and I also think NO lacks any urgency to do a trade now when they are likely to have more suitors and better offers in the summer, after he returns to health.
3 It's possible that a labrum tear can involve surgery and take a LONG time to heal (6 months or more?), and it's an area that can have an impact on the mechanics and feel of a player's shot. Jones hasn't been a great shooter anyhow. 
4 Of more concern is that earlier in the season he missed games due to a strain in that same spot. IIUC the labrum is a cushiony thing (ie it's cartilage), making me wonder if there is some sort of degenerative injury evolving here. With those kinds of things in play, it adds layers of caution and perhaps more progress and medical clearances necessary before chasing HJ.

Thybulle carries health question marks as well. He hasn't played a single game all season, after major surgery in the offseason followed by a rehab that went wrong. (Supposedly he sprained his ankle doing rehab, and after multiple months that "sprained ankle" is still the listed excuse for his ongoing absence. I'm very skeptical. That sounds wrong.) Their last word was "we will have an update in 2 weeks."

[DL2RimRocker]

I don’t agree that a better Kleber can be obtained by only using Kleber. But, I also am not in too big of a hurry to replace Kleber.

Yeah, that is kind of my point. 
No reason to move Maxi unless there is a significant upgrade without creating another need.

We'd obviously have to add draft capital and maybe OMax for that upgrade to Maxi, but my point is that it isn't worth breaking up our current structure and rotation just to upgrade Maxi. Otherwise, we'd just be filling one hole and creating another.

So yeah, I'm not in too much of a hurry to replace Maxi either for that very reason.
I don't think his role and need is enough to justify disrupting the legit championship contender that Nico has built.

[DL2RimRocker]

Herb Jones as a concept has appeal at the right price, but with the real HJ, I can't imagine Mavs would ever consider a TDL trade for him, for several reasons.
1 They would be giving up assets and roster depth to make this team's chances worse. Maybe in the summer? But no reason to trade now and get nothing and sabotage the roster.
2 Trade matching and adjusting the roster (both DAL and NO) is easier in the summer, too, and I also think NO lacks any urgency to do a trade now when they are likely to have more suitors and better offers in the summer, after he returns to health.
3 It's possible that a labrum tear can involve surgery and take a LONG time to heal (6 months or more?), and it's an area that can have an impact on the mechanics and feel of a player's shot. Jones hasn't been a great shooter anyhow. 
4 Of more concern is that earlier in the season he missed games due to a strain in that same spot. IIUC the labrum is a cushiony thing (ie it's cartilage), making me wonder if there is some sort of degenerative injury evolving here. With those kinds of things in play, it adds layers of caution and perhaps more progress and medical clearances necessary before chasing HJ.

Thybulle carries health question marks as well. He hasn't played a single game all season, after major surgery in the offseason followed by a rehab that went wrong. (Supposedly he sprained his ankle doing rehab, and after multiple months that "sprained ankle" is still the listed excuse for his ongoing absence. I'm very skeptical. That sounds wrong.) Their last word was "we will have an update in 2 weeks."

I agree Jones would be a huge risk and NO (and us) would be better off waiting until the off season.

But if there was a decent chance of Jones being fully healthy come PO time, what do you think about this deal?

Gafford/Grimes/OMax/Pick(s)
for
Jones/J. Green/Theis

[F Gump]

I agree Jones would be a huge risk and NO (and us) would be better off waiting until the off season.

But if there was a decent chance of Jones being fully healthy come PO time, what do you think about this deal?

Gafford/Grimes/OMax/Pick(s)
for
Jones/J. Green/Theis

IMO, easy no. Cartilage tears are problematic IIUC because they leave the future possibility of bone-on-bone and they are hard to truly heal. It can linger. From what I hear, HJ is done for the season, and his recovery time is murky.

I also don't think the Mavs would do a TDL trade that finds them essentially accomplishing "shuffling the deck" on their backups. You probably don't gain enough in talent (if anything) to overcome the loss in understanding the DAL system and how they fit in it. I'm not interested in going backwards this season.

One more issue. Even if we liked it, that trade adds about 3.4M to NO payroll, which would never fly, because they are only a bit over the tax line and almost certain to be looking for a trade to subtract some salary and get under it. (I think we will see either Ingram or McCollum as their central outgoing piece.)

If we are just piggybacking the general idea of J Green into the HJ mix, fwiw Green-Hardy is a trade match (almost identical), and in some ways that swap as a standalone might make sense if the teams want to swap offense for defense. Green will be UFA this summer with no Bird rights, so that has to be considered.

[DL2RimRocker]

If we are just piggybacking the general idea of J Green into the HJ mix, fwiw Green-Hardy is a trade match (almost identical), and in some ways that swap as a standalone might make sense if the teams want to swap offense for defense. Green will be UFA this summer with no Bird rights, so that has to be considered.

Can we trade Hardy at the TDL?

I thought he couldn't be traded until April.

[Chicagojk]

https://x.com/MavsFilmRoom/status/1881090316138323978

So, who are the names that are gettable who are better than we already have?   Does this mean that probably Grimes is moved?  Minutes are already tight.

I just don't see many names available who are gettable and would deserve minutes over the existing rotation players.   

Marcus Smart if Memphis made a trade and gave up Smart???