Trade & FA 2024-25:

[HoosierDaddyKid]

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5862754...ed_article


Jalen Green's contract raises a lot of questions for the Rockets.

[michaeltex]

Am I correct in thinking there is no downside letting Grimes to to RFA next summer vs. extending now? Other than possibly having to pay more after a successful season? DAL still has full matching rights + longer contract length?

[mvossman]

Am I correct in thinking there is no downside letting Grimes to to RFA next summer vs. extending now? Other than possibly having to pay more after a successful season? DAL still has full matching rights + longer contract length?

I mean paying more is a legit downside.  We could run into Apron issues making it more difficult/painful to sign at the bigger number.  He could also sign a poison pill offer sheet to make things much more difficult.  I think its unlikely that he will get an offer more than MLE, but if he has a really nice year its possible, at which point we would probably regret not getting something down now.

[F Gump]

I mean paying more is a legit downside.  We could run into Apron issues making it more difficult/painful to sign at the bigger number.  He could also sign a poison pill offer sheet to make things much more difficult.  I think its unlikely that he will get an offer more than MLE, but if he has a really nice year its possible, at which point we would probably regret not getting something down now.

OTOH paying less - maybe a LOT less - is a legitimate upside.

We don't know what Grimes was demanding. An extension was not limited to MLE. The theoretical apron issues could have been part of why there's no deal now.

It's easy to assume his ask was modest or reasonable, but it could have been absurd.

I'm not sure what poison pill potential exists, that could cause issues for the Mavs next summer. Am I forgetting something?

[SleepingHero]

Am I correct in thinking there is no downside letting Grimes to to RFA next summer vs. extending now? Other than possibly having to pay more after a successful season? DAL still has full matching rights + longer contract length?

Only downside is the Mavs may have possibly lost out on an opportunity of locking up Grimes on a cheaper deal. Luka will probably let him have a breakout year.


But one upside is this summer there isn't a massive amount of cap space like last summer. Less suitors means less people to potentially overpay Grimes if he does have a breakout year.

[mvossman]

OTOH paying less - maybe a LOT less - is a legitimate upside.

We don't know what Grimes was demanding. An extension was not limited to MLE. The theoretical apron issues could have been part of why there's no deal now.

It's easy to assume his ask was modest or reasonable, but it could have been absurd.

I'm not sure what poison pill potential exists, that could cause issues for the Mavs next summer. Am I forgetting something?

To be clear, the question was is there any downside to waiting because he is RFA and worst case it will cost more money.  I'm not advocating for a decision one way or the other, just pointing out that yes there is potential downside (of course there is potential upside for waiting as well).

[michaeltex]

I guess my thinking was that everyone is waiting to see how he fits this season. On the upside, Grimes becomes an important contributor and we may have to pay him more. He will be a RFA, so we don't get "Brunsoned" again and lose his value for nothing.

His QO will be ~$6.3M. Is there a limit on how much another team can offer next summer?

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Y'all, I think LAC is quite happy with DJJ. Let's move on because their trading him now is a pipe dream.

[SleepingHero]

Y'all, I think LAC is quite happy with DJJ.  Let's move on because their trading him now is a pipe dream.

If it gets to December and LAC is 8-18 with no Kawhi in sight, I can see them selling off their guys.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Big Suggs fan, but ~$30mill a year?

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

If it gets to December and LAC is 8-18 with no Kawhi in sight, I can see them selling off their guys.

Perhaps packaged with a weighty contract.  DJJ is on a nice, value driven contract.  Unless he can yield a younger player, a bottom dwelling team still has to court a team.

[mvossman]

I guess my thinking was that everyone is waiting to see how he fits this season. On the upside, Grimes becomes an important contributor and we may have to pay him more. He will be a RFA, so we don't get "Brunsoned" again and lose his value for nothing.

His QO will be ~$6.3M. Is there a limit on how much another team can offer next summer?

A team could offer him his max, although that is highly unlikely.  

I think part of getting "Brunsoned" is that Cuban was choking on the tax he would have to pay (although I do fall into the category of folks that thinks Brunson was going to NY regardless of what Cuban offered).  In Grimes case, it would probably be less about the tax and more about cap/apron issues.  Its not that they couldn't sign him, but it may be painful to fit it in.  They may have to ditch salary (paying assets to do so) in order to sign him and not go over an apron.

My best guess is that Grimes was looking for something around MLE level (I would be surprised if its significantly less and they couldn't come to a deal, but its possible).  So the only real hit is if Grimes has a great year (say 15 points a game on efficient shooting while playing good defense on a contender at age 24).  That might be enough for a team to offer him well over the MLE and create some very hard decisions for the Mavs.  I don't think that is a likely scenario (partially because it will be hard for him to get enough minutes to do it), but it is possible.

I'm a huge Grimes fan so I would have been fine to sign him to MLE kind of money, but I can see the strong argument that it would make more sense to wait given his RFA status and unlikelihood he will get an offer over the MLE.

[F Gump]

What did DJJ do sò far that guarantees he will be a priority for LAC going forward?

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Clearly there's some PTSD from Brunson, and probably some institutional shame from Nash. The decent contracts to Green and now Hardy gives me hope we've learned. I'd really like to lock in Grimes.

[RGP1981]

Big Suggs fan, but ~$30mill a year?

That's another highly over-priced deal IMO. $15M per season ($20M tops!), is his current contribution value on the court AFAIC.

But when a Front Office does stupid things, like paying $23M to a 32-year old KCP... then they're left with no choice except to pay someone like Suggs $30M because of "potential"... or his agent will be asking, how can he get less than or the same as KCP? 

The deals being handed out in the NBA today, reminds me of Ponzi schemes in a way. Everyone just wants to grab all they can get... it's a free-for-all... and nobody cares about providing or obtaining actual value... because it's someone else's money being handed out.

Anyway, there will be a nice opportunity for rebuilding teams or teams with cap-space because of all these awful deals. They can identify overpaid players that other teams need to get off their books in the future, but who could still be temporarily useful to them because they might complement a young star they have drafted... and then ask for really nice draft picks to take on these awful salaries. I.E., if those rebuilding teams aren't super dumb and give draft picks to trade for a Suggs on $30M, lol.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

What did DJJ do sò far that guarantees he will be a priority for LAC going forward?

What has he not done to do so?

WTF would a team sign a player, start him, then trade him back to the team who didn't resign him?  I mean, is LAC in business to help us?

[Scott41theMavs]

What has he not done to do so?

WTF would a team sign a player, start him, then trade him back to the team who didn't resign him?  I mean, is LAC in business to help us?

I don't know, maybe if said team thought they were contenders when they signed him, and was trending at mid-season toward the play-in or worse? Pretty easy answer, tbqh.

[Scott41theMavs]

Re: Grimes - He's a young guy who looked really good two years ago. Could he be so good that if Kyrie chooses to leave next summer (PO, right?), Grimes could be his replacement?

[KillerLeft]

I don't understand why we're still talking about DJJ.

I wanted him back, but I actually like what they did instead better, now that the shock has worn off, and it suuuuuuuuuure seems like he was gettable for them if they REALLY had him as their top priority. The situation read to me like they willingly chose a different path, tbqh.

He's a good player, but you can't play him AND Marshall AND Grimes AND Thompson. Green was barely getting minutes by the end last year. Let's see what THIS team looks like for 20-30 games, yeah?

[RGP1981]

Re: Grimes - He's a young guy who looked really good two years ago. Could he be so good that if Kyrie chooses to leave next summer (PO, right?), Grimes could be his replacement?

I doubt it, because they're different players. Grimes seems like the kind of player who could be a really good complement next to a Kyrie type... but not a direct replacement for a Kyrie type (i.e., someone who the burden of creation can be placed on). Grimes does has some ability to create though, as in, he's not a purely 3&D guy like Reggie Bullock.