MAVS NEWS:

[omahen]

The problem with this is that the conceptualization that the three stars on the team aren't going to start and finish games is profoundly wishful thinking in today's NBA. I agree that they're going to stagger those guys throughout the rest of the game, but there's zero conceivable way they ever play less than around 12 mpg together. That's simply not how it works. Which is not to say it's going to work.

Agree. I think overall the team is better than last season and I would hope they spend less energy in the regular season. New additions will hopefully take some load off the stars to bring them as healthy as possible to playoffs. I hope we will not have again extended stretches of games with Luka playing 40+ minutes on a nightly basis when Irving is out (which is likely, according to his injury history). I expect SD to be a good enough addition in times when injuries/rest to one of the stars so that we will not need to overload the other one. I expect offense to be good and I think a combo of Thompson/Grimes/Naji is much better than a combo of Green/DJJ/THJ. I think better offense and additional player depth and versatility will overweight a likely drop in defense in regular season and make Mavs have an easier job. I will be dissapointed if they don't finish top4, assuming reasonable health, of course. 

While I think Mavs will be better in the regular season, I am not sure if they will be better in the offseason. With now three players on likely heavy minutes and none of them being a great defender, they might become easier to target and even more difficult to hide. There will be even more minutes in playoffs when all three of Luka/Kyrie/Klay will be on the court together. Looking forward to see how they make it work

[mvossman]

Agree. I think overall the team is better than last season and I would hope they spend less energy in the regular season. New additions will hopefully take some load off the stars to bring them as healthy as possible to playoffs. I hope we will not have again extended stretches of games with Luka playing 40+ minutes on a nightly basis when Irving is out (which is likely, according to his injury history). I expect SD to be a good enough addition in times when injuries/rest to one of the stars so that we will not need to overload the other one. I expect offense to be good and I think a combo of Thompson/Grimes/Naji is much better than a combo of Green/DJJ/THJ. I think better offense and additional player depth and versatility will overweight a likely drop in defense in regular season and make Mavs have an easier job. I will be dissapointed if they don't finish top4, assuming reasonable health, of course. 

While I think Mavs will be better in the regular season, I am not sure if they will be better in the offseason. With now three players on likely heavy minutes and none of them being a great defender, they might become easier to target and even more difficult to hide. There will be even more minutes in playoffs when all three of Luka/Kyrie/Klay will be on the court together. Looking forward to see how they make it work

The playoffs are a long way away, but how much they play together will depend on total minutes.  If Luka and Kyrie play over 40 minutes a game again and Klay plays well over 30 then they will get more minutes together.  But if its more like upper 30s for Kuka/Kyrie (which might be better) and lower 30s for Klay then they don't need to be on the floor together any more than the default 12 minutes of starting and finishing games.

The 10 to 15 minutes Klay is on the court with the starters will be a definite downgrade on defense compared to DJJ, but it will also be a massive upgrade on offense.  His remaining minutes will be replacing THJ and Hardy, which will be an upgrade both offensively and defensively.

I think by the time we get to the playoffs Lively will be starting, which should help mitigate the lack of POA defender.  It makes sense when you have your top three offensive players on the floor together that you also have your best defensive center.

If Naji/Grimes can hold their own replacing remaining DJJ/Green minutes (I think they can) then its hard to see this team not being better than last season in the playoffs (if healthy).  They might be a little less on defense, but they will be significantly better on offense.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

I'm not sure what you're trying to say, because those two highlighted thoughts seem very contradictory to me.

My point is that I expect Luka-Kyrie-Klay will NOT be playing heavy minutes-per-game as a trio. In fact, those 3 players can get all their usual minutes in a game with around ZERO minutes of all 3 on the floor, if the Mavs chose to do that.

More importantly, imo having a lineup on the floor that can get stops - especially down the stretch of games - will actually be a higher priority than is recognized.

I think there's going to be a bit of the PHX team issues in play here, where an over-supply of offense has to bow to the need for enough defenders on the floor to get stops. Or else you'll be sorry. That means for the most part only 2 of Luka-Kyrie-Klay are playing at one time, not 3.

I agree with you that Luka/Kyrie/Klay is problematic.  I just think Kidd will play the trio together more than you or I would like.

[F Gump]

The problem with this is that the conceptualization that the three stars on the team aren't going to start and finish games is profoundly wishful thinking in today's NBA. I agree that they're going to stagger those guys throughout the rest of the game, but there's zero conceivable way they ever play less than around 12 mpg together. That's simply not how it works. Which is not to say it's going to work.

I recognize the concept you are utilizing, which is that the star players will have to be catered to, because they are top players. And that each of Luka, Kyrie, Klay will expect to get the highest profile minutes. In general, I think that's an accurate way to see lineups.

But do YOU honestly think that 3-at-a-time will be an advantageous lineup for the Mavs? I don't. So then what happens?

One Path is that the stars will all be intractable, and insist on getting their preferred minutes, no matter what.

Path Two is that the players themselves will see what's what, and set aside their whims for what's better.

I think they will want what leads to more wins. 

I see TWO paths to get there ...

1  They MIGHT have all 3 start each half together and play a few minutes (only) as a trio. Then someone sits. When they get to crunch time, Kidd prioritizes getting stops, and making it really hard for the opponent to score, as their path to closing out games -- which mean the lineups that get those minutes have to be defensively proficient. That's one formula that might naturally result in only a few minutes of all 3 at a time.

2  The path that makes more sense to me is that they use the Sixth Man carrot. The Sixth Man gets recognition and awards and might be a tool to get one of them to give up starting, because a starter is ineligible for those awards.

Ultimately, either way, I have some faith that all of the 3 will bow to "what it takes to win." Which means that, if I am correct that playing all 3 together will not be a good lineup, they will all 3 get on board with doing something better.

If you think their egos are too big for that, I understand why you think that, but I have faith. And fwiw I also have faith in Kidd and his ability to get the team to follow his lead, along with his desire to have a team that has a lock-down defense in crunch time. That's his formula imo. That was how his title team worked.

[WildArkieBoy]

I agree with you that Luka/Kyrie/Klay is problematic.  I just think Kidd will play the trio together more than you or I would like.

Especially in the season's first half, JKidd is an experimenter.  Luka/Kyrie/Klay is an offensive juggernaut.  Kidd may want to make teams prove they can outscore that threesome before tweaking the lineup. . . . . If Luka gets his hands on balls, Klay moves his feet and Kyrie holds his own, that may be more than a token starting lineup.  If not, wheeler/dealer Nico brought in two defenders as reinforcements.  It's all good.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Especially in the season's first half, JKidd is an experimenter.  Luka/Kyrie/Klay is an offensive juggernaut.  Kidd may want to make teams prove they can outscore that threesome before tweaking the lineup. . . . . If Luka gets his hands on balls, Klay moves his feet and Kyrie holds his own, that may be more than a token starting lineup.  If not, wheeler/dealer Nico brought in two defenders as reinforcements.  It's all good.

Yes, this is why I'd rather Naji come in for Klay, Grimes for Kyrie, Exum for Luka.  Hardy and Din need to earn minutes with some good team defense.  I just don't think we can have 2 ball handlers always on the floor in that we only have Luka, Kyrie, Exum, and Din.  It's almost impossible to scheme around 2 out of the 4 always being on the floor.  Hardy's days at the point needs to be over.  Grimes is not a distributor in any way.  

I'm not being Chicken Little in that this is an upgraded Finals roster.  I just would love a more complete 2-way player at SF, a defensive stud.  Tari Eason still not traded?  

[michaeltex]

Ultimately, either way, I have some faith that all of the 3 will bow to "what it takes to win." Which means that, if I am correct that playing all 3 together will not be a good lineup, they will all 3 get on board with doing something better.

If you think their egos are too big for that, I understand why you think that, but I have faith. And fwiw I also have faith in Kidd and his ability to get the team to follow his lead, along with his desire to have a team that has a lock-down defense in crunch time. That's his formula imo. That was how his title team worked.

I agree with your summation. I would suggest, however, that the 3-star offense, combined with what DLive/Gaff brings as lob targets, could be a form of defense in that the opponent will tasked with matching the output. A task that most other teams are not prepared.

I think you can just look at DAL last year and see how discouraged they got when they were unable to get stops and let it pressure their offensive play into bad decisions (i.e., hero ball, no pass 3pt attempts, etc.). Despite their defensive chops, BOS took the air out of DAL when they just kept scoring, no matter what Kidd tried.

I loved the defensive lift PJ, DLive and Gaff brought and it won games, but if Luka or Kyrie was off (maybe Hardaway, too?) then the scoring could get hard to come by. I anticipate the new team will have more offensive options to keep the output up. I'm also encouraged that, if the game gets scrappy, then DAL has the flexibility to play that way too.

[F Gump]

I agree with your summation. I would suggest, however, that the 3-star offense, combined with what DLive/Gaff brings as lob targets, could be a form of defense in that the opponent will tasked with matching the output. A task that most other teams are not prepared.

I think you can just look at DAL last year and see how discouraged they got when they were unable to get stops and let it pressure their offensive play into bad decisions (i.e., hero ball, no pass 3pt attempts, etc.). Despite their defensive chops, BOS took the air out of DAL when they just kept scoring, no matter what Kidd tried.

I loved the defensive lift PJ, DLive and Gaff brought and it won games, but if Luka or Kyrie was off (maybe Hardaway, too?) then the scoring could get hard to come by. I anticipate the new team will have more offensive options to keep the output up. I'm also encouraged that, if the game gets scrappy, then DAL has the flexibility to play that way too.

My point about what Kidd wants from his closing lineup and why is shown by the very example you use. 

Having an "unstoppable offense" gains you nothing if that lineup can't get stops on the other end, and the offense feels even more pressure (which adversely effects shooting choices and efficiency). As you say, BOS got repeated stops in crunch time (making it easy for the offense to relax) and DAL did not.

You are correct that Luka and Kyrie didn't get the scoring done in the 4th vs BOS. That's a problem. But neither did the D. That's also a problem. (But until BOS, they had enough.)

If you can't get stops, there's no way to gain ground, nor to put the other team away.

If we are thinking that Luka and Kyrie aren't efficient enough on offense to carry the load in the playoffs, that might actually be a correct analysis. Luka's free throws and willingness to take terrible low-percentage shots (and awful FT shooting for a PG), and Kyrie's lack of size, those can be exploited with the right defenders and a good defensive game plan. Both tend to wear down because of the way they play. Some of the solutions involve those 2 simply getting better, or fitter, or more focused, but whether that's possible is a good question.

But if that's a problem, then that's a HUGE problem. If they are NOT good enough to carry the offense, then having to cover for their weaknesses on offense too is going to put a real ceiling on the team.

The solution of course is in having more and better TWO-WAY players to make things better on both ends at the same time, rather than being limited by one-way players. 

But in the meantime, I think Kidd will skew toward "stops" when he's figuring how to play in crunch time. Ultimately there is a path of having (or creating) a team full of good two-way players that's the place to go, but they have what they have for now.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

My point about what Kidd wants from his closing lineup and why is shown by the very example you use. 

Having an "unstoppable offense" gains you nothing if that lineup can't get stops on the other end, and the offense feels even more pressure (which adversely effects shooting choices and efficiency). As you say, BOS got repeated stops in crunch time (making it easy for the offense to relax) and DAL did not.

You are correct that Luka and Kyrie didn't get the scoring done in the 4th vs BOS. That's a problem. But neither did the D. That's also a problem. (But until BOS, they had enough.)

If you can't get stops, there's no way to gain ground, nor to put the other team away.

If we are thinking that Luka and Kyrie aren't efficient enough on offense to carry the load in the playoffs, that might actually be a correct analysis. Luka's free throws and willingness to take terrible low-percentage shots (and awful FT shooting for a PG), and Kyrie's lack of size, those can be exploited with the right defenders and a good defensive game plan. Both tend to wear down because of the way they play. Some of the solutions involve those 2 simply getting better, or fitter, or more focused, but whether that's possible is a good question.

But if that's a problem, then that's a HUGE problem. If they are NOT good enough to carry the offense, then having to cover for their weaknesses on offense too is going to put a real ceiling on the team.

The solution of course is in having more and better TWO-WAY players to make things better on both ends at the same time, rather than being limited by one-way players. 

But in the meantime, I think Kidd will skew toward "stops" when he's figuring how to play in crunch time. Ultimately there is a path of having (or creating) a team full of good two-way players that's the place to go, but they have what they have for now.

It's a tale of the have's and have not's.  Boston's starting 5 has 2 defensive studs (Jrue, White), 1 exceptional help-side defender (KP), and 2 good defenders (Tatum, Brown).

We have Lively and PJ as good defenders and Klay as diminished (maybe plus) defender.  That's it.

BOS can put on the floor their best offensive AND defensive lineup; they're one in the same.  While we can kinda match that offense, we can't stop them like they can stop us.  We simply don't have the 2-way players that we need.  Most noticing is at SF.  We really need Klay of 3 years ago.

[KillerLeft]

Hate to see this. This is going to bring scrutiny to Lively that he would have been smarter to avoid. I happen to agree with this opinion, but I'm not sure he's attained "allowed to publicly criticize a 4xDPOY" status just yet. 

...and what are we even doing with some of these podcasts? I loved Pinson when he was here, but not everyone deserves a platform, imho. 

https://x.com/JVSwaps/status/1831078551220793507

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Meh. Great defenders are usually a little WWE-ish. I'm glad Lively is engaging and talking some smack he'll have to back.

[RGP1981]

Since I posted the photos of Luka from the send-off game for Dragic where it looked like he gained weight... guess it's only fair that I post photos where it seems like he is becoming leaner. This is from a promo in Shangai, saw it on another forum.

Keep up the good work, Luka.

https://x.com/overtime/status/1828795595714355292

[SleepingHero]

Yeah there's no way he lost 20lbs in 3 weeks.

Luka Weight Watchers will always be the weirdest part of Mavs fandom.

[SleepingHero]

Kevin Gray Jr. (@KevinGraySports)
Mavs Dereck Lively working at Duke Pro Devils weekend on what he's working on:

"...I’m just trying to be more dominate when it comes to the paint...strength’s definitely No. 1; working on my handle...I wanna own the paint before I can shoot threes…" #MFFL


https://x.com/KevinGraySports/status/183...3269814318

[SleepingHero]

https://x.com/canpekerpekcan/status/1832812625001947404

(@canpekerpekcan)
Dallas Mavericks center Dereck Lively and 2006-born projected 2025 NBA Draft lottery pick Khaman Maluach works together.

Dereck Lively shares good information for post players. Young players should definitely watch it.

(@tonywmiller)

[fifteenth]

nothing to see here, I posted something silly after misreading SH's post

[F Gump]

Kevin Gray Jr. (@KevinGraySports)
Mavs Dereck Lively working at Duke Pro Devils weekend on what he's working on:

"...I’m just trying to be more dominate when it comes to the paint...strength’s definitely No. 1; working on my handle...I wanna own the paint before I can shoot threes…" #MFFL


https://x.com/KevinGraySports/status/183...3269814318

"I wanna own the paint before I can shoot threes"

Kudos to Lively - he understands priorities. So many big men (and fans) don't get this right, and think the ability for a C to make 3s should be their focus. That's so wrong. I think Wemby is in great danger of falling into this trap (if he hasn't done so already).

[DallasMaverick]

"I wanna own the paint before I can shoot threes"

Kudos to Lively - he understands priorities. So many big men (and fans) don't get this right, and think the ability for a C to make 3s should be their focus. That's so wrong. I think Wemby is in great danger of falling into this trap (if he hasn't done so already).

True. A man can only be in one place at a time.

Do you want him in the paint? Or on the perimeter?

[michaeltex]

https://x.com/canpekerpekcan/status/1832812625001947404

(@canpekerpekcan)
Dallas Mavericks center Dereck Lively and 2006-born projected 2025 NBA Draft lottery pick Khaman Maluach works together.

Dereck Lively shares good information for post players. Young players should definitely watch it.

(@tonywmiller)

Thanks for sharing SH!

Is it just me, or is DLive acting like he's been here for 10 years. Wonder how much of his wisdom he got from working with Chandler...

[YaBoyAplus]

Y'all haven't seen the Omax n Klay at the Rico Hines runs? Omax was going to work and Klay was steady and made it look easy for him.
They went 4-1 if I'm not mistaken