GAME 3 NBA FINALS: Boston Celtics (2-0) vs. Dallas Mavericks (0-2)

[JasonKidding]

  ...Boston is clearly the better team.  But they got a lot of help tonight.

Yeah.  From 19 minutes of THJ.  Kidd literaly put him in to stop the bleeding from a time out, and then put him in the last 3 minutes to replace Luka after he fouled out.   He has been the worst player in the last month of the regular season and the playoffs by the eye test and analytics, and this is KIdd's answer when we are in a tight spot.

Either Jason Kidd is really dumb, or THJ has dirt on him.

He has been so bad (and so bad in THIS GAME) I would literally rather have had Dwight Powell (-13 in playoffs) in there than THJ (-42 in playoffs) in the last 3 minutes.

But obviously there were like 5 guys that would have made more sense at that point.

[omahen]

Boston is just a better team and Mavs were not able to find counters against them. Their defenders are good enough one on one to keep Lukai efficiency at reasonable levels and wear them out through the game. All their guys can do things on offense. As Minny was not built to win against Mavs, Mavs are not built to win against Boston and quite honestly, I don't know which team is able to construct a team that will be able to stay with them, now that they figured it out. Mavs had a chance if their stars would be by far best players on the court, but it didn't happen. Our bench (outside of Lively tonight), gave us absolutely nothing. Less than zero from Maxi and THJ, Green as meh as always.

I think Luka is getting more hate here than he will get from national media... He didn't have his best game. Started great, but looked to me like something happened towards end of first quarter and all of a sudden he looked limited on both ends. Like his energy or ability to move was gone. Still, Mavs fell apart every time he had a breather, outside of the last couple of minutes after he fouled out.

[BigDirk41]

Boston is just a better team and Mavs were not able to find counters against them. Their defenders are good enough one on one to keep Lukai efficiency at reasonable levels and wear them out through the game. All their guys can do things on offense. As Minny was not built to win against Mavs, Mavs are not built to win against Boston and quite honestly, I don't know which team is able to construct a team that will be able to stay with them, now that they figured it out. Mavs had a chance if their stars would be by far best players on the court, but it didn't happen. Our bench (outside of Lively tonight), gave us absolutely nothing. Less than zero from Maxi and THJ, Green as meh as always.

I think Luka is getting more hate here than he will get from national media... He didn't have his best game. Started great, but looked to me like something happened towards end of first quarter and all of a sudden he looked limited on both ends. Like his energy or ability to move was gone. Still, Mavs fell apart every time he had a breather, outside of the last couple of minutes after he fouled out.

Windy went nuclear on Luka after the game. It was kinda comical. His points were valid, but he seemed legit mad about Luka's performance...lol. Not sure why he's so invested in Luka. Just Google Luka. He's getting crushed right now all over. It might be a while before this blows over.

[KillerLeft]

Windy went nuclear on Luka after the game. It was kinda comical. His points were valid, but he seemed legit mad about Luka's performance...lol. Not sure why he's so invested in Luka. Just Google Luka. He's getting crushed right now all over. It might be a while before this blows over.

I thought every single word Windhorst said was correct. It was harsh, but I think it was true. And, I think that what we perceive as hate at times from national guys is really just frustration that Luka won’t let the world enjoy what his true potential might just be. Pretty silly to think about, considering he is already unbelievable, but he’s 25 now, and I’m starting to wonder how long it’s going to take for him to actually figure this stuff out. These past five years went by really fast, and I seriously hope we are not still talking about the same crap when he’s 30.

[JasonKidding]

Windy went nuclear on Luka after the game. It was kinda comical. His points were valid, but he seemed legit mad about Luka's performance...lol. Not sure why he's so invested in Luka. Just Google Luka. He's getting crushed right now all over. It might be a while before this blows over.

He had 27, 6 and 6 on a clearly bad knee and who knows what else, was flying around as much as he could on defense, and had a +9 when he was in the game. He really didn't do that badly.  The Officiating was not calling that many fouls on either side, and that clearly hurt him more than anyone else in this game.  The last couple of foul calls that could have gone either way when we were at home down 0-2 to take him out of the game was the deal breaker.  So much for home court advantage for the Mavs.

[JasonKidding]

I thought every single word Windhorst said was correct. It was harsh, but I think it was true. And, I think that what we perceive as hate at times from national guys is really just frustration that Luka won’t let the world enjoy what his true potential might just be. Pretty silly to think about, considering he is already unbelievable, but he’s 25 now, and I’m starting to wonder how long it’s going to take for him to actually figure this stuff out. These past five years went by really fast, and I seriously hope we are not still talking about the same crap when he’s 30.

He's been playing so long, and has had these nagging injuries on his upper legs for the last 3 years. I just hope he doesn't become like Kawhi and not be able to move right for half the time he is playing the rest of his career.

[audiosway]

I've had some time to think about it and cool off. That game was very frustrating to watch. The NBA always talks about game integrity and allow the best player in the series to foul out for the first time in his 6 year career. However, I digress.

Boston right now is the better team. Then, you pile on some really bad calls and it is what it is.

I think the reason Kidd played THJ is because Jones Jr scored 2 points in 15+ minutes. That just won't get it done. Jones Jr will be a great piece for the bench as an MLE but he's not a starter on the biggest stage. PJ I think will blossom into a great 3rd option. Gafford and Lively are great pieces to build on. Luka and Ky can score. They are missing a starter at the 4 and some bench pieces that can get it done.

It's been a great season and I think the Mavs exceeded expectations by making a leap early. I thought after the deadline they were starting to have the look of a contender. But, the bench and 1 starter has to be addressed in the offseason for that to be complete. That fix combined with the growth of Lively, Gafford, Luka, PJ, Omax, and Hardy will get it done I think. I would use Green, THJ, Powell and anything else outside of Ky and the group I just mentioned as trade pieces.

Meantime, I would hard foul the crap out of Boston in game 4 and make the refs do something about it. I would foul guys out for the purpose of scaring and daring Boston to hit the paint. The series is over. Make them earn it.

[KillerLeft]

He's been playing so long, and has had these nagging injuries on his upper legs for the last 3 years. I just hope he doesn't become like Kawhi and not be able to move right for half the time he is playing the rest of his career.

Yeah, he definitely has more miles on his body than a typical 25 year old.

[JasonKidding]

...I think the reason Kidd played THJ is because Jones Jr scored 2 points in 15+ minutes. That just won't get it done. Jones Jr will be a great piece for the bench as an MLE but he's not a starter on the biggest stage....

How many points did THJ have in the last 4 games?

Who is a better defender, rebounder, shot blocker, rim defender, 3 point shooter, and lob threat?

Only reason to not play Jones Jr over him would be if he was hurt.  Even then, Hardy, Exum, or Kleiber would have been better. 

Jones Jr was a big reason we got this far in the playoffs. 

We got this far in the playoffs despite THJ.

[audiosway]

How many points did THJ have in the last 4 games?

Who is a better defender, rebounder, shot blocker, rim defender, 3 point shooter, and lob threat?

Only reason to not play Jones Jr over him would be if he was hurt.  Even then, Hardy, Exum, or Kleiber would have been better. 

Jones Jr was a big reason we got this far in the playoffs. 

We got this far in the playoffs despite THJ.

Don't get me wrong. I fully agree with you. However, Kidd obviously knows that he is at the end of the bench trying to get a win of any kind. When they can't win with Jones Jr starting you have to try something else. I don't fault Kidd at all. If THJ gets hot and knocks down some shots as he certainly can then Kidd is called a genius.

I don't think Kidd has a choice. They will NOT win with Jones Jr out there against the Celtics and Kidd knows it.

I don't see Dallas winning game 4. They literally gave them their best punch and Boston destroyed them. Not only is Boston a very good team but they have literally everything bouncing their way this year. When you have a 3rd string Center come out and hit the only 3 pointer he has taken in the playoffs that's a bad day for you. Houser hit a 3 pointer from half court as a half time buzzer beater in game 2. Sometimes you get a combination of a very good team that gets very hot. That combined with a poor showing from the refs is a recipe for disaster. This series is over and has been since the first quarter of game 1. Kidd knows that. He is throwing the kitchen sink at it to see if someone gets hot to turn the momentum.

Luka and Kyrie combined for 62 points and Dallas ended up with 98. That's ridiculous. You can't win in the NBA with that. This isn't 1995.

[BolsDamols]

After Luka fouled out, there was still some game left to be played.

Kyrie makes a jumper, 93-92 Celtics.

Tatum, guarded by Green, drives to the rim and THJ comes over to try to draw an offensive foul. Tatum misses but Brown (who mas THJ's man) gets the rebound and putback. DJJ or Exum would have been a more capable body to guard either Tatum or Brown in this case.

Then refs call an egregious offensive foul on PJ and White makes a huge three. Game was over at that point.

Had we completed that comeback, it would have totally changed the complexion of the series, especially with KP being out, Lively finally breaking through, Kyrie finally showing up..oh well, what could have been.

[hakeemfaan]

Tonight was a punch to the gut. I hope the Mavs win one but the series is over. It was a great run and while it feels terrible right now, I won’t forget all the clutch plays and joy this team gave us. The sadness is not just due to the impending end of the season but the realization that the West is so tough. A lot of young teams that are only getting better.

[JasonKidding]

Don't get me wrong. I fully agree with you. However, Kidd obviously knows that he is at the end of the bench trying to get a win of any kind. When they can't win with Jones Jr starting you have to try something else. I don't fault Kidd at all. If THJ gets hot and knocks down some shots as he certainly can then Kidd is called a genius.

I don't think Kidd has a choice. They will NOT win with Jones Jr out there against the Celtics and Kidd knows it.

I don't see Dallas winning game 4. They literally gave them their best punch and Boston destroyed them. Not only is Boston a very good team but they have literally everything bouncing their way this year. When you have a 3rd string Center come out and hit the only 3 pointer he has taken in the playoffs that's a bad day for you. Houser hit a 3 pointer from half court as a half time buzzer beater in game 2. Sometimes you get a combination of a very good team that gets very hot. That combined with a poor showing from the refs is a recipe for disaster. This series is over and has been since the first quarter of game 1. Kidd knows that. He is throwing the kitchen sink at it to see if someone gets hot to turn the momentum.

Luka and Kyrie combined for 62 points and Dallas ended up with 98. That's ridiculous. You can't win in the NBA with that. This isn't 1995.

I understand the idea of searching for answers, but THJ has been terrible all playoffs, and was also bad in THIS game for about 15 minutes as well before subbing him in for the last 4 minutes for Luka.

If you wanted scoring when no one else can do it, that's when you put Hardy in.

[audiosway]

After Luka fouled out, there was still some game left to be played.

Kyrie makes a jumper, 93-92 Celtics.

Tatum, guarded by Green, drives to the rim and THJ comes over to try to draw an offensive foul. Tatum misses but Brown (who mas THJ's man) gets the rebound and putback. DJJ or Exum would have been a more capable body to guard either Tatum or Brown in this case.

Then refs call an egregious offensive foul on PJ and White makes a huge three. Game was over at that point.

Had we completed that comeback, it would have totally changed the complexion of the series, especially with KP being out, Lively finally breaking through, Kyrie finally showing up..oh well, what could have been.

I can't stand the NBA officiating. The whole attitude is "he's a superstar and he's earned it so he'll get special treatment". That's bull. If a player fouls call it. I don't care who it is. Call it and call it evenly. Every time that Dallas tried to get physical with Boston it was a foul. Boston could easily get physical with Dallas and they swallowed the whistle.

It's been that way for decades and needs to be fixed. It won't be though. I digress once again. lol.

That said, Kidd has 90 fouls at his disposal in a 15 man roster. I would make sure that the team knows that if you foul make it count in game 4. I'm not kidding when I say I would take it back to 80s basketball. Give the refs a reason to call a foul. If you want to disrupt a team like the Celtics that's the quickest way. Make it as ugly as possible. I don't want anyone to get hurt but if Derrick White or Jrue is going up for an easy layup and I'm Gafford someone is going to hit the floor hard. They will only drive once. The second time they will think twice about it.

If someone has a wide open 3 while making the run knock them out of bounds. No easy shots. Ever. That's the play that got them here. That's the crap they have done to Luka all playoffs. Let's see if Boston can handle it for 48 minutes.

Another thing is that Boston hasn't played a real basketball game since April. Dallas had a slugfest in the West. It's unfair but it is what it is.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

I thought every single word Windhorst said was correct. It was harsh, but I think it was true. And, I think that what we perceive as hate at times from national guys is really just frustration that Luka won’t let the world enjoy what his true potential might just be. Pretty silly to think about, considering he is already unbelievable, but he’s 25 now, and I’m starting to wonder how long it’s going to take for him to actually figure this stuff out. These past five years went by really fast, and I seriously hope we are not still talking about the same crap when he’s 30.

Windy was absolutely correct in his assessment of Luka. He needs to dedicate himself to getting in better shape. His conditioning and stamina has to improve. Boston has sent out the blueprint on how to contain Luka. They hunted and attacked him all series on offense making him expend energy. Also, he hurts his team with the incessant crying and bitching to the refs to the point he won't get back on defense and his team is playing 4 on 5 at the other end. Dallas is not a finished product. They were the 5th seed in the West and lost 14 more games than Boston. They had a good season, but need more tweaks. To try and get back to this stage is going to be difficult in the West. I love Luka's game, but this is a off season he needs to do some soul searching about how he's going to transform his mind and body. He'll never hoist the trophy if this continues.

[hakeemfaan]

Windy was absolutely correct in his assessment of Luka. He needs to dedicate himself to getting in better shape. His conditioning and stamina has to improve. Boston has sent out the blueprint on how to contain Luka. They hunted and attacked him all series on offense making him expend energy. Also, he hurts his team with the incessant crying and bitching to the refs to the point he won't get back on defense and his team is playing 4 on 5 at the other end. Dallas is not a finished product. They need more tweaks.  I love Luka's game, but this is a off season he needs to do some soul searching about how he's going to transform his mind and body. He'll never hoist the trophy if this continues.

Windhorst is an idiot. Luka was the Conference Finals MVP. Kyrie had two stinkers in Boston.  Plus we all knew this was the best team in the league this season. How many teams can emulate them? 

I am not saying Luka can’t improve on some things but when you lose too often all the great things are easily forgotten or minimized.  What this team and Luka did this year was terrific.  If Bron was in that situation and losing like this to Boston the narrative would be how he needs more support.

[audiosway]

Windhorst is an idiot. Luka was the Conference Finals MVP. Kyrie had two stinkers in Boston.  Plus we all knew this was the best team in the league this season. How many teams can emulate them? 

I am not saying Luka can’t improve on some things but when you lose too often all the great things are easily forgotten or minimized.  What this team and Luka did this year was terrific.  If Bron was in that situation and losing like this to Boston the narrative would be how he needs more support.

I agree. Windbag is full of it. That team is in the finals because of Luka. He had a legit gripe with the way the refs were calling it. Even Legler said it on the post game.

I actually thought Luka has really pulled back from griping so much to the officials. The Mavs are exhausted and Luka has several injuries right now. When you and one other player score 62 combined you expect to win a game.

[hakeemfaan]

Harden has never done what Luka did. Neither has CP3. Booker was teamed with KD and Beal and those 3 could not do much. LeBron and AD didn’t. OKC and Minny were higher seeds who fell to the Mavs

I understand being disappointed and critical. But let’s keep it in perspective. This team reached the Finals and went through higher seeds and some really top notch teams. While we are disappointed let’s not act as if this is a stinking first round embarrassment.

[BolsDamols]

These Luka criticisms are all valid - being attacked on defense, ref complaining and not getting back, being in better shape. Given all that it can be argued that Luka has been one of the best players of this post season, at one point being the leader in points, rebounds, assists, steals, 3 pointers made.

Windhorst was the same guy who argued Anthony Edwards was a better player than Luka. By the end of the Minny series he then compared Luka to Lionel Messi. So take what he said, plus all national media guys, with a grain of salt. They flip flop more than your average politician.

[SleepingHero]

Harden has never done what Luka did. Neither has CP3.  Booker was teamed with KD and Beal and those 3 could not do much.  LeBron and AD didn’t. OKC and Minny were higher seeds who fell to the Mavs

I understand  being disappointed and critical. But let’s keep it in perspective.  This team reached the Finals and went through higher seeds and some really top notch teams. While we are disappointed let’s not act as if this is a stinking first round embarrassment.

I wish I can pin this post. 

If I told you at the beginning of the season that Mavs would make the finals but lose, everyone here would be overjoyed at the playoff success and think Luka ascended a new level of basketball expertise we've never seen to pull that off.

Well that kind of happened. If they aren't ready to win now, maybe getting absolutely embarrassed in the finals will make sure they won't rest on their achievements and spark a fire under everyone's butt to try to win it again.