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+--- Thread: 2020-2021 ROSTER TALK: Archived (/showthread.php?tid=682)
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RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - DanSchwartzgan - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 11:38 AM)omahen Wrote: I agree he would be better here. Point is - he wanted to be in a situation he has in Detroit, not in a similar situation he would have in Dallas.
This may actually be an issue with Luka. The board often assumes he will be a magnet for players off of other teams. But players move for 1. Money, 2. Lifestyle, 3. PT and 4. Role.
Grant went to a worse city and the same money for a better role. It has been reported that Bogdan changed his tune on Milwaukee when they traded for Holiday (moving him down a notch on the offensive pecking list). How much offensive oxygen is left in the room in a lineup that has Luka/KP/THJ and Richardson?
Yet another reason to consider an in-season trade rather than waiting for next summer (unless GA is still on the table and you have good intel that says he's very interested).
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - KillerLeft - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 12:03 PM)DanSchwartzman Wrote: This may actually be an issue with Luka. The board often assumes he will be a magnet for players off of other teams. But players move for 1. Money, 2. Lifestyle, 3. PT and 4. Role.
Grant went to a worse city and the same money for a better role. It has been reported that Bogdan changed his tune on Milwaukee when they traded for Holiday (moving him down a notch on the offensive pecking list). How much offensive oxygen is left in the room in a lineup that has Luka/KP/THJ and Richardson?
Yet another reason to consider an in-season trade rather than waiting for next summer (unless GA is still on the table and you have good intel that says he's very interested).
I agree with the above, but not as some sort of revelation specific to Luka.
I think that each time a piece (to which they're fairly committed) gets put in place the field of players who fit into the remaining holes becomes smaller (the fit requirements become more specific).
In the case of Grant, specifically, I suspect this talk of "a better offensive role" was really PR code for a broader issue about the obvious: Denver viewed him as a placeholder for MPJ. I am a little surprised they even offered to match the offer.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - omahen - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 12:03 PM)DanSchwartzman Wrote: How much offensive oxygen is left in the room in a lineup that has Luka/KP/THJ and Richardson?
Mavs are still short of a secondary creator. THJ is not that and JRich is a very poor man version of that. Mavs can offer a role where a guy would have a ball a lot in his hands. I think we are a very good destination for LaVine, Oladipo types - guys who are good but not really alpha types, if they want to win anything.
(12-12-2020, 12:03 PM)DanSchwartzman Wrote: Grant
Problem with Grant - he is several levels below LaVine types. He is not a creator. His role is to play defense and shoot catch and shoot three pointers. He could be great in this role or bad in a creator type role.
(12-12-2020, 12:12 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Denver viewed him as a placeholder for MPJ.
I think they would play both and move Barton to sixth man role.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - KillerLeft - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 12:35 PM)omahen Wrote: His role is to play defense and shoot catch and shoot three pointers. He could be great in this role or bad in a creator type role.
This might be true, but I don't think we have enough info yet to be sure about it. I saw him floor the ball AND CHANGE DIRECTIONS with it quite a bit in the playoffs. I didn't think he had that in him, but it's in there. Whether he'll be able to apply those skills to consistently be an engine for his team is an unknown, though. No issues with the idea that it's a long shot, because a lot of people feel that way. But, we know someone at Detroit believed in it.
Quote:I think they would play both and move Barton to sixth man role.
I think that would be a bad, bad idea. I don't think either of them can play the 3, really. I suppose that's speculation, though. To be clear about MY interest in Grant, it's based solely on the paradigm that he's a 4, and that the skills I mentioned above are rare for THAT position. In the 3 spot, he's probably not a guy you want to run the offense through, imo. That's part of why I think he'd be better here than in Detroit - because he'd be a 4.
If Detroit's plan was to play him with Griffin as the bigs, I think I'd be (a little) more of a believer, but it's clear from their draft and the first three hours of free agency that THEY want him to play some 3, at least until they get rid of Griffin. That's the part I'm most skeptical about.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - omahen - 12-12-2020
First impression with JRich for me is, that he is respected around the league by players and he has a lot of buddies. Something an euro will have a trouble achieving (the buddies part). That's why I think it would be important to keep him. Luka and JRich also share the same agent. Developing a theory from here - LaVine and Turner also share the agent and I could see them fit in Dallas. Other than that, Duffy client list is not impressive. We already discussed LaVine.
Turner trade proposal:
Dal: Turner, Lamb
Ind: THJ, Kleber (or switch THJ with Johnson, 2027 first and one of our young players)
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - Mapka - 12-12-2020
I really have a hard time finding any player on an other team, I like better in his specific role than some player on the Mavs. There are some players that may be a upgrade talentwise, but I don´t want on the Mavs at all. See Hield, Buddy; Harden, James; Griffin, Blake; Collins, John. There may be fitting players on unfitting contracts: Love, Aldrige, Conley, Kyle Lowry or players faaaaar out of our reach. AD, Jrue Holiday.
I have to see them play to find holes to upgrade first.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - StepBackJay - 12-12-2020
Would Mavs rather keep THJ or sign Fournier if given the option this summer? THJ might be cheaper to keep?
I would probably want Fournier if we are just comparing players as I think Fournier is a better version of what THJ is. That being said money could be the tie-breaker there. I could see Fournier getting overpaid but THJ is probably locked in as an MLE-level or low-level starter $$ given his history.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - StepBackJay - 12-12-2020
How about Fournier + a trade for Aaron Gordon next offseason (or sooner?). Not sure what his value is but if you can get him for a good value (bench player or two) you would be getting a 25-26 yr old that Rick could mold into a more consistent offensive player.
Starting lineup would be Luka, J Rich, Fournier, Gordon, KP.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - loki - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 04:44 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: Would Mavs rather keep THJ or sign Fournier if given the option this summer? THJ might be cheaper to keep?
I would probably want Fournier if we are just comparing players as I think Fournier is a better version of what THJ is. That being said money could be the tie-breaker there. I could see Fournier getting overpaid but THJ is probably locked in as an MLE-level or low-level starter $$ given his history.
I would prefer Fournier if he's obtainable. He's a better playmaker and probably a slightly better defender as well. But it's much less risky to simply re-sign THJ. If you go after Fournier and ask THJ to wait you could end up losing both. I don't think THJ goes for MLE-level money though. Assuming he plays about as well as last season, I'd be surprised by anything less than $15 mil per year.
Quote:How about Fournier + a trade for Aaron Gordon next offseason (or sooner?). Not sure what his value is but if you can get him for a good value (bench player or two) you would be getting a 25-26 yr old that Rick could mold into a more consistent offensive player.
Starting lineup would be Luka, J Rich, Fournier, Gordon, KP.
Gordon is my favorite target at the moment. It seems that Orlando turned down an offer similar to the one that landed Covington which included two 1st rounders, so he's not going to be easy to get. But perhaps Orlando will finally be ready to move on at the deadline. If they wait until he is expiring I think his value falls even more.
Dallas could offer some combination of Kleber, Green/Bey/Terry, 2027 1st. Maybe that's enough if one of the rookies plays extremely well. Kleber to a 3rd team for a 1st might be needed since Orlando isn't contending any time soon.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - DanSchwartzgan - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 04:44 PM)StepBackJay Wrote:
I would probably want Fournier if we are just comparing players as I think Fournier is a better version of what THJ is. That being said money could be the tie-breaker there. I could see Fournier getting overpaid but THJ is probably locked in as an MLE-level or low-level starter $$ given his history.
Can we do one of those pretend internet bets on this. Maybe $1 million AND a shaved head? (BTW, when it comes time to showing the shaved head for the world to see, I look a lot like Bruce Willis)
Set the Over/Under at $12mm and I’ll take the over. You in?
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - KillerLeft - 12-12-2020
Call me crazy if you want, but my interest in Orlando would be more about stealing Isaac than helping them get out from under past mistakes and helping them get better financially situated to keep him.
(12-12-2020, 05:35 PM)DanSchwartzman Wrote: Can we do one of those pretend internet bets on this. Maybe $1 million AND a shaved head? (BTW, when it comes time to showing the shaved head for the world to see, I look a lot like Bruce Willis)
Set the Over/Under at $12mm and I’ll take the over. You in?
Don’t do it @"StepBackJay"
If he shoots 40% from distance at high volume again he’s not even going to have to take a pay cut, imo. Just look at what the shooters got THIS time around. Shooters get paid.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - loki - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 05:36 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Call me crazy if you want, but my interest in Orlando would be more about stealing Isaac than helping them get out from under past mistakes and helping them get better financially situated to keep him.
Sign me up for healthy players. Adding another post-ACL tear starter seems like a huge risk.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - DanSchwartzgan - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 05:36 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Call me crazy if you want, but my interest in Orlando would be more about stealing Isaac than helping them get out from under past mistakes and helping them get better financially situated to keep him.
Don’t do it @"StepBackJay"
If he shoots 40% from distance at high volume again he’s not even going to have to take a pay cut, imo. Just look at what the shooters got THIS time around. Shooters get paid.
Hush. For all we know SBJ is bald already and all I’m going to get from him is the $1 million.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - KillerLeft - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 05:47 PM)loki Wrote: Sign me up for healthy players. Adding another post-ACL tear starter seems like a huge risk.
Well, there is that. Valid.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - david75090 - 12-12-2020
I want to tap the brakes on trading Maxi. Seeing him on the videos, he looks different. Lean and mean, or some such. Like he's been in the league a bit and he's seen the type of athletes he's competing with and he's gotten himself in his optimum shape. Maybe I'm seeing what's not there, but let's not throw him into a trade for balance, just yet.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - ItsGoTime - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 12:54 PM)omahen Wrote: Turner trade proposal:I really think Turner would be a great fit on this team.
Dal: Turner, Lamb
Ind: THJ, Kleber (or switch THJ with Johnson, 2027 first and one of our young players)
Actually ditto on Lavine, as long as we have the defenders to back him up.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - StepBackJay - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 05:35 PM)DanSchwartzman Wrote: Can we do one of those pretend internet bets on this. Maybe $1 million AND a shaved head? (BTW, when it comes time to showing the shaved head for the world to see, I look a lot like Bruce Willis)
Set the Over/Under at $12mm and I’ll take the over. You in?
So the bet is on THJ's contract next year? That's a tough one for me bc I think if it's not the Mavs then I would be in on the under of $12 mil. If he resigns with the Mavs I bet they overpay him so I might take the over then but then they might do less years, like 2 + a TO. So honestly its hard to say. A team could easily give him 2 for $30 like a lot of these journeymen types get. There is not much risk on the part of the team, if the player is a starter then its worth it, if they aren't a fit then they can trade the contract pretty easily. So ya I don't have a great feel for his contract value.
(12-12-2020, 05:36 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Call me crazy if you want, but my interest in Orlando would be more about stealing Isaac than helping them get out from under past mistakes and helping them get better financially situated to keep him.
Don’t do it @"StepBackJay"
If he shoots 40% from distance at high volume again he’s not even going to have to take a pay cut, imo. Just look at what the shooters got THIS time around. Shooters get paid.
What are we thinking his contract will be then?
(12-12-2020, 05:47 PM)loki Wrote: Sign me up for healthy players. Adding another post-ACL tear starter seems like a huge risk.
I love Isaac but if I am the magic I hold onto him. I guess the issue could be a healthy Isaac is worth a lot of money but an injured one is worth less. Would he pull a KP-like situation where he won't agree to a long-term deal and force a trade? I would definitely be all in on that. Life is about risk but the upside is great there.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - StepBackJay - 12-12-2020
Turner trade proposal:
Dal: Turner, Lamb
Ind: THJ, Kleber (or switch THJ with Johnson, 2027 first and one of our young players)
Man I hate this trade so much. Turner is overrated and more of a 5 in Rick's system. The only way I would want him is if Powell is outgoing. No way I give up Kleber. Kleber is a better fit and value than Turner. If Mavs didn't have KP then I would like Turner as the 5 but I don't like his fit with KP.
Indy would pull the trigger on that trade so fast, they would hang up the phone before you could reconsider. Remember Boston could have had Turner for nothing basically and they said 'nah'. This is a team that didn't have a center last year. They opted for Tristan Thompson instead. That should tell you something.
The Pacers trade I would like is Dipo + Lamb for THJ + Johnson at the TDL if Johnson doesn't end up cracking the rotation (which we hope he does). This would be a buy-low situation on Dipo to get a look at him before the summer. Lamb is a useful wing whose stock is also down so he would be the dump player you take to get Dipo.
I would expect by the TDL that THJ will be looking pretty good but I am not sure I want the Mavs to hand him a bunch of money next offseason. I would be very interested in looking at Oladipo who has a higher ceiling frankly than THJ ever did.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - DrMav - 12-12-2020
(12-12-2020, 06:01 PM)david75090 Wrote: I want to tap the brakes on trading Maxi. Seeing him on the videos, he looks different. Lean and mean, or some such. Like he's been in the league a bit and he's seen the type of athletes he's competing with and he's gotten himself in his optimum shape. Maybe I'm seeing what's not there, but let's not throw him into a trade for balance, just yet.
I want Maxi to be a forever Mav, if for no other reason than to keep the stat that players born in Wurzburg only play for the Mavs alive.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Trade/FA Ideas (Mar 25 TDL?) + Salary Chart - david75090 - 12-13-2020
Hate to jump to conclusions but I'm thinking these young guys might make DFS expendable.