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+--- Thread: 2020-2021 ROSTER TALK: Archived (/showthread.php?tid=682)
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RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cow - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:12 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: Just curious... Who do you think is a possible upgrade on DFS? If you are talking about including him in a blockbuster deal and he's got to be included, I think we'll all be driving him to the airport lol.
That's my angle. DFS and Brunson have value and if they are part of package to get another player, go for it.
Dorian is my favorite Mav by a country mile but you can't think that way.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:10 PM)cow Wrote: If they retain Lonzo, KP is their 4th best player, that will only play around 65% of their games and is on a max contract. Was he even our 4th best player in the playoffs? We've completely submarined his value.
I'm just preparing myself for Wiggins in a Mavericks jersey.
I mean his value definitely has come down, but I think Mavs fans are way to down on him right now because of how frustrated they are with his playoff performance.
But he had career high #s with his shooting percentages. Only 20 players had those same #s and 20 ppg and 18/20 were all stars.
Playoffs he was a ghost. But he also wasn't putting up horrific shooting displays every game. You can chalk up the low scoring to them going small in game 3. his shot attempts went waaaaaay down then too.
His defense was awful against small ball (it's always going to be that) and he lacked the aggressive to get his shots. But to Mavs fans they viewed him as being completely in capable of playing basketball off this series. There's a difference between playing really bad and being MIA. KP was the latter IMO.
(06-06-2021, 10:17 PM)cow Wrote: That's my angle. DFS and Brunson have value and if they are part of package to get another player, go for it.
Dorian is my favorite Mav by a country mile but you can't think that way.
I think my mindset is that guys like DFS aren't included in those deals because the blockbuster trade would likely be you getting a player from a team that doesn't need a guy like DFS.
so I automatically picture any deal with DFS as someone you are trying to get to take his starting spot but be better. It's hard to find non star versions of that.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cow - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:26 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: but I think Mavs fans are way to down on him right now because of how frustrated they are with his playoff performance.
Not me friend. I think greener pastures are ahead from KP. He's handled his frustrations as about as well as you can expect off the court. I just see it like this:
-He's on an expensive contract.
-He has major health concerns.
-Anyone with eyes can see he's not happy (again) and has issues with Luka and Carlisle.
That puts the MBT at a severe disadvantage and it's not like they are great with trades in the first place. We are going to get taken to the woodshed.
Really hope I'm wrong.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Omega_Supreme - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:10 PM)cow Wrote: If they retain Lonzo, KP is their 4th best player, that will only play around 65% of their games and is on a max contract. Was he even our 4th best player in the playoffs? We've completely submarined his value.
I'm just preparing myself for Wiggins in a Mavericks jersey.
Do you think the Wiseman Trade will go down? If so I am just not seeing it.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Scott41theMavs - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:31 PM)cow Wrote: Not me friend. I think greener pastures are ahead from KP. He's handled his frustrations as about as well as you can expect off the court. I just see it like this:
-He's on an expensive contract.
-He has major health concerns.
-Anyone with eyes can see he's not happy (again) and has issues with Luka and Carlisle.
That puts the MBT at a severe disadvantage and it's not like they are great with trades in the first place. We are going to get taken to the woodshed.
Really hope I'm wrong.
You aren't, but if at least two teams show any interest in KP, at least there will be a minor bidding war.
The Spurs were great at getting free agents when they had a good core, which isn't the case now. My gut bet is that KP is a Spur next year - perhaps in a sign-and-trade for DeRozan, whom I would have viewed as a pupu platter return before this offseason. We take whatever they consider their worst contract and DeRozan and go for whomever we can get with whatever cap we have left.
(06-06-2021, 10:33 PM)Omega_Supreme Wrote: Do you think the Wiseman Trade will go down? If so I am just not seeing it.
I'd be surprised if he isn't thinking KP for Wiggins straight up. That's KP's value right now.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - dirkfansince1998 - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:35 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: You aren't, but if at least two teams show any interest in KP, at least there will be a minor bidding war.
The Spurs were great at getting free agents when they had a good core, which isn't the case now. My gut bet is that KP is a Spur next year - perhaps in a sign-and-trade for DeRozan, whom I would have viewed as a pupu platter return before this offseason. We take whatever they consider their worst contract and DeRozan and go for whomever we can get with whatever cap we have left.
I would take capspace and one of the younger guys over DeRozan but the Mavs cannot be picky. Spurs have the capspace to absorb KPs salary and if they send out 10-15m they could probably resign DeRozan as well. If they really want to go for it makes sense to build around DeRozan/KP and their solid role cast of role players.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - KillerLeft - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:39 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: I would take capspace and one of the younger guys over DeRozan but the Mavs cannot be picky. Spurs have the capspace to absorb KPs salary and if they send out 10-15m they could probably resign DeRozan as well. If they really want to go for it makes sense to build around DeRozan/KP and their solid role cast of role players.
OMG, you are getting my hopes up. Stop it.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cow - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:35 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: You aren't, but if at least two teams show any interest in KP, at least there will be a minor bidding war.
The Spurs were great at getting free agents when they had a good core, which isn't the case now. My gut bet is that KP is a Spur next year - perhaps in a sign-and-trade for DeRozan, whom I would have viewed as a pupu platter return before this offseason. We take whatever they consider their worst contract and DeRozan and go for whomever we can get with whatever cap we have left.
I'd be surprised if he isn't thinking KP for Wiggins straight up. That's KP's value right now.
DeRozan would solve a major need and make Luka harder to double. Not sure about spacing.
Nah, Wiggins has no basketball IQ. You'd need to pay me to take on his salary. I think Luka would hate him too. I do kind of wonder if there is a Draymond for KP deal that could be worked out. Not terribly interested in Wiseman.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Scott41theMavs - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:39 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: I would take capspace and one of the younger guys over DeRozan but the Mavs cannot be picky. Spurs have the capspace to absorb KPs salary and if they send out 10-15m they could probably resign DeRozan as well. If they really want to go for it makes sense to build around DeRozan/KP and their solid role cast of role players.
In spite of his 1) age, 2) lack of a 3-pointer, and 3) lack of defense, DeRozan is superior to every current Mav not named Luka right now. Beggars can't be choosers.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - KillerLeft - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:41 PM)cow Wrote: Nah, Wiggins has no basketball IQ. You'd need to pay me to take on his salary.
How long is the contract though? Gotta be shorter than KP's at this point, right?
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Scott41theMavs - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:41 PM)cow Wrote: I do kind of wonder if there is a Draymond for KP deal that could be worked out.
Sure there is! We give them Brunson, DFS, two future firsts, and the '22/'24 pick swaps, and they say deal!
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cow - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:43 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: Sure there is! We give them Brunson, DFS, two future firsts, and the '22/'24 pick swaps, and they say deal!
Go watch Draymond in the play-in games. He's been pretty bad.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - dirkfansince1998 - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:41 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: In spite of his 1) age, 2) lack of a 3-pointer, and 3) lack of defense, DeRozan is superior to every current Mav not named Luka right now. Beggars can't be choosers.
You might be right but i have always been super low on DeRozan. One of the worst defenders in the league. So bad that Pop moved him to the PF spot. Desperately trying to hide him on defense.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cow - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:43 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: How long is the contract though? Gotta be shorter than KP's at this point, right?
2 more years, 64 million dollars.
GSW front office has been pretty bad of late. They didn't get enough out of the Wiggins/D'Lo swap and Wiseman probably wasn't the best choice.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Scott41theMavs - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:44 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: You might be right but i have always been super low on DeRozan. One of the worst defenders in the league. So bad that Pop moved him to the PF spot. Desperately trying to hide him on defense.
I don't disagree with you. I'm just saying, that guy might be our only real chance at improvement this summer. He'd be better than nothing (ducks at KL's incoming salvo).
(06-06-2021, 10:46 PM)cow Wrote: 2 more years, 64 million dollars.
The fact that a GM not named Donnie gave him that deal disqualifies the MBT from being the league's worst FO. At least at that time.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cow - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:47 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: I don't disagree with you. I'm just saying, that guy might be our only real chance at improvement this summer. He'd be better than nothing (ducks at KL's incoming salvo).
Suns could win a title and Cubes could talk CP3 into opting out and giving him a multi-year deal. I'm not sure if I love or hate that idea.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Omega_Supreme - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:35 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: You aren't, but if at least two teams show any interest in KP, at least there will be a minor bidding war.
The Spurs were great at getting free agents when they had a good core, which isn't the case now. My gut bet is that KP is a Spur next year - perhaps in a sign-and-trade for DeRozan, whom I would have viewed as a pupu platter return before this offseason. We take whatever they consider their worst contract and DeRozan and go for whomever we can get with whatever cap we have left.
I'd be surprised if he isn't thinking KP for Wiggins straight up. That's KP's value right now.
That would be a strong hell no for me, I would much rather dump KP to a team like OKC for cap space and draft compensation.
In fact, given how he acted this year I am in full blown support to send to OKC or Cleveland.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Scott41theMavs - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:50 PM)cow Wrote: Suns could win a title and Cubes could talk CP3 into opting out and giving him a multi-year deal. I'm not sure if I love or hate that idea.
Given your arguments above about Luka's maturity, CP3 might be exactly what he needs, but the likelihood is that he doesn't see it that way and demands a trade at the deadline next season if we force-feed him that strong of medicine.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:31 PM)cow Wrote: Not me friend. I think greener pastures are ahead from KP. He's handled his frustrations as about as well as you can expect off the court. I just see it like this:
-He's on an expensive contract.
-He has major health concerns.
-Anyone with eyes can see he's not happy (again) and has issues with Luka and Carlisle.
That puts the MBT at a severe disadvantage and it's not like they are great with trades in the first place. We are going to get taken to the woodshed.
Really hope I'm wrong.
Yeah I agree on all those points... And that's why I think that there's a pretty decent chance he's done here.
At the same time tho, the best thing may be for KP to be here this summer.
My stance is despite those concerns however legitimate they are, the Mavs won't just dump him to dump him. I also think he does have actual value.
#1 is a minor concern IMO if the Mavs aren't planning on having cap space. #3 I think can be worked out. #2 has been an issue since he got here.
KP even on a slightly expensive deal is going to have guys that really want him due to the shooting as a big. Almost everyone has an expensive deal they can make us take on if money is a concern. I think the other teams see #3 are going to be calling.
FWIW my preference is to trade him in the right deal. I won't be upset if he's back next year if we've made major roster improvements elsewhere.
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cow - 06-06-2021
(06-06-2021, 10:53 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: Given your arguments above about Luka's maturity, CP3 might be exactly what he needs, but the likelihood is that he doesn't see it that way and demands a trade at the deadline next season if we force-feed him that strong of medicine.
I'm not really bagging on Luka either, but he is a kid and I do wonder if "wonderboy" tends to get to his head.
I really think CP3 is fine for a season or two. It's the 3rd season+ when his personality starts to grind everyone down. The real question is would he and Carlisle get along? And would he opt out for a two year deal or want three?